Are guys like Tony Martin clean??

[Zinoviev Letter]

I thought the PC term in the UK was to call gypsies travellers/travelers?

There are a number of different groups of nomads/semi-nomads in the UK. "Travellers" normally means Irish Travellers, a group indigenous to Ireland but also found in Britain and elsewhere. They are not gypsies. "Gypsies" is an out dated colloquial term for Roma, Sinti and other related ethnic groups. They usually prefer the more specific and accurate terms, like Roma. There are also New Age Travellers, who aren't an ethnic group at all.

Settled people and the media often confuse the various different groups, so you will often find outsiders applying terms like gypsy or Traveller to the wrong people. And, of course, many people prefer to use straightforwardly bigoted and abusive terms, as happychappy does above.

 

[Anonymous]

I thought the PC term in the UK was to call gypsies travellers/travelers?

Notice that one of the travelling felons claiming civil damages from wounding by Mr. Martin was caught riding a bike. Makes it relevant to the CN forum.

gypsies and travellers are generally very different things. And then with gypsies it is broken down further into their origins..

So no. Gypsie is a very broad term used by people who dont know any better. Gypsies generally have a cultural background of a particular race and are usually born into being travellers as a way of life, irish gypsies (who have added the gypsy tag onto their nationality), romanian gypsies etc. Travellers on the whole are travellers out of choice, choosing to be on the road, living outside traditional communities for a whole variety of reasons, anti establishment, enviromental etc.

Some gypsies will refer to themselves as travellers, but on the whole the two are very different.

I call them dirty pikeys.

Well i hope you are aware of the different types and nationality of the various gypsies before you refer to them as that. You wouldnt want to get it wrong.

 

[hrotha]

There are a number of different groups of nomads/semi-nomads in the UK. "Travellers" normally means Irish Travellers, a group indigenous to Ireland but also found in Britain and elsewhere. They are not gypsies. "Gypsies" is an out dated colloquial terms for Roma, Sinti and other related ethnic groups. They usually prefer the more specific and accurate terms, like Roma. There are also New Age Travellers, who aren't an ethnic group at all.

Settled people and the media often confuse the various different groups, so you will often find outsiders applying terms like gypsy or Traveller to the wrong people. And, of course, many people prefer to use straightforwardly bigoted and abusive terms, as happychappy does above.

In the Spanish dub of Snatch, every instance of "traveller"/"pikey" was apparently translated as "gitano" ("gypsy"). In a country with many native gypsies, it was all kinds of weird to see these blue-eyed, blonde "gitanos."

 

[El Pistolero]

gypsies and travellers are generally very different things. And then with gypsies it is broken down further into their origins..

So no. Gypsie is a very broad term used by people who dont know any better. Gypsies generally have a cultural background of a particular race and are usually born into being travellers as a way of life, irish gypsies, romanian gypsies etc. Travellers on the whole are travellers out of choice, choosing to be on the road, living outside traditional communities for a whole variety of reasons, anti establishment, enviromental etc.

Some gypsies will refer to themselves as travellers, but on the whole the two are very different.

Or people who don't care about being politically correct.

 

[hrotha]

Or people who don't care about being politically correct.

Did you even read his post? It's not about not using offensive terms, it's about not getting different things mixed and confused.

 

[Susan Westemeyer]

BAck on the topic of the cyclist Tony Martin. Any further off-topic postings will be deleted.

Susan

 

[El Pistolero]

edit

==

Well, I personally don't think Tony Martin is clean. Perhaps that whole 10 out of 10 thingie.

 

[hrotha]

edit

==

Well, I personally don't think Tony Martin is clean. Perhaps that whole 10 out of 10 thingie.

Pfff, a castrated post is so sad.

Why don't you split this thread and let us discuss the terms for the Romani and nomad peoples in general in the Cafe?

 

[El Pistolero]

Pfff, a castrated post is so sad.

Why don't you split this thread and let us discuss the terms for the Romani and nomad peoples in general in the Cafe?

I read Susan's post a little bit too late, so had to edit it

I don't mind a thread about it in the General topic though, it is an interesting subject after all.

 

[RiccoDinko]

2010 UCI Suspicious list had Tony Martin ranked as 8 of 10. How come he's free of scrutiny here? His stage win in the TDF was very remarkable, then he dragged Kwia along the next day, then won the ITT. Seems he's the strongest dude in the Peloton, minus alpine climbs and cobbles.

 

[Benotti69]

2010 UCI Suspicious list had Tony Martin ranked as 8 of 10. How come he's free of scrutiny here? His stage win in the TDF was very remarkable, then he dragged Kwia along the next day, then won the ITT. Seems he's the strongest dude in the Peloton, minus alpine climbs and cobbles.

I doubt anyone thinks any rider on OPQS with Doc Ibauguren as their staff doctor is clean, hence no arguments, discussions or rants about riders like Martin et al!

 

[glassmoon]

Imho, no way he's clean... But also imho, no one in top 50 is and also no gc contender top domestic is clean neighter.

 

[del1962]

Imho, no way he's clean... But also imho, no one in top 50 is and also no gc contender top domestic is clean neighter.

That to me is such a lazy response to the subject

The world time trial champion said that he is involved in the anti-doping fight, which he admitted “takes up a lot of time in addition to racing and training.”

“That is a lot of extra stress in addition to the actual sport. But we accept that, because cycling is simply worth it to us and because we think it is worthwhile to fight for the sport.”

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tony-martin-optimistic-for-cyclings-future

So we have a man that is involved in the anti-doping fight and the lazy response is to call him a doper.

Are there any rumours that he is taking dope, (people saying they have seen him do it etc)?

 

[sniper]

That to me is such a lazy response to the subject



http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tony-martin-optimistic-for-cyclings-future

So we have a man that is involved in the anti-doping fight and the lazy response is to call him a doper.

Are there any rumours that he is taking dope, (people saying they have seen him do it etc)?

how you're gonna take somebody seriously who says he's involved in the antidoping fight while riding for QSPS? get real.
perhaps MArtin's words should be taken more literally in that he's actually 'fighting antidoping'...

 

[Benotti69]

That to me is such a lazy response to the subject



http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tony-martin-optimistic-for-cyclings-future

So we have a man that is involved in the anti-doping fight and the lazy response is to call him a doper.

Are there any rumours that he is taking dope, (people saying they have seen him do it etc)?

So how exactly is Tony Martin involved in the anti-doping fight?

 

[Echoes]

I doubt anyone thinks any rider on OPQS with Doc Ibauguren as their staff doctor is clean,

That's an unfounded allegation. In any organized team doping in recent history, you can always find some riders who stayed away...

Some reliable inside sources told me that Nikolas Maes has a good reputation, for what it's worth.

Of course not "Index 7" Martin.

 

[Benotti69]

That's an unfounded allegation. In any organized team doping in recent history, you can always find some riders who stayed away...

Some reliable inside sources told me that Nikolas Maes has a good reputation, for what it's worth.

Of course not "Index 7" Martin.

My guess is that most DS will no longer hire riders not willing to 'prepare' and i doubt Lefevere would hire someone who wont do what is needed for the team and to win. It is the way of the sport. Sadly.