Armstrong media machine

[tubularglue]

Livestrong actually HELPS people access that support. In actual physical ways. They have information packs, support lines, people ..... they do good work.

nice to hear about another survival story.

As stated above, Livestrong's info and notebooks were at my hospital. But, unfortunately there is a little more to my story. Some things i have read, and some i have witnessed. Little by slowly - a knot gets untied

good luck AussieGoddess

Eleven: i had not read that detail in regards to Race Radio. No ill will intended.

 

[JMBeaushrimp]

Well as I actually HAVE myeloid luekaemia Im pretty sure I at least know the difference. I am lucky - for my condition there is a drug treatment available. But its super expensive, and getting the government/health fund to pay for it involves a whole battle all on its own.

In truth - raising awareness matters a whole lot - but thats not all that Livestrong does.

Cancer treatments, lifestyle decisions, diet, funding, health insurance, ... just surviving .... they all take money and knowledge. Learning to live with cancer is a whole new ball game. Governments accross the world have loads of support groups and insurance and assistance to help people - but loads of red tape as well. Sorting through that (in time - because time is super important when sometimes you dont have that much left) is incredibly hard.

Livestrong actually HELPS people access that support. In actual physical ways. They have information packs, support lines, people ..... they do good work.

Whether its a good use of funds for all the money they raise - well that would be up to an auditor. They certainly wouldnt be the only charity around the world that spends loads on admin and expenses for the 'directors' - but I guess its up to each person who donates or buys a bracelet whether they want to support the cause.

Yes - I do think Lance doped. I do think he should answer to the cycling bodies for that ..... but I also think he has done an enormous amount of good for the world as well.

(and no, I am not BPC)

As you seem to be someone who can appreciate his alter-ego of CancerMan, does the good he has done for survivors absolve him of his cycling misdeeds?

I'm just trying to gauge how the non-cycling world would view him. Would it matter if he cheated for his TdF wins? Does that even matter in his non-cylcing millieu of 'survivor'? How does the cancer community feel about integrity?

I'm not taking the p*ss out of him, I'm just curious. I'm not a cancer survivor, nor am I a LA fan. Hence, I'm looking for more of a reading from the LA cancer community.

I would just like to get a feel of the 'community' regarding all that's going on, without the the troll-baiting...

 

[thehog]

As you seem to be someone who can appreciate his alter-ego of CancerMan, does the good he has done for survivors absolve him of his cycling misdeeds?

I'm just trying to gauge how the non-cycling world would view him. Would it matter if he cheated for his TdF wins? Does that even matter in his non-cylcing millieu of 'survivor'? How does the cancer community feel about integrity?

I'm not taking the p*ss out of him, I'm just curious. I'm not a cancer survivor, nor am I a LA fan. Hence, I'm looking for more of a reading from the LA cancer community.

I would just like to get a feel of the 'community' regarding all that's going on, without the the troll-baiting...

Sorry to jump the post. My fault. I know myeloid leukaemia well. I have dealt with it. Every one’s experience is there own.

Sometimes people forget that cancers existed well before Lance Armstrong. Help and support through various institutes and foundations exited well before Lance Armstrong. When you told you have cancer at the hospital there are several resources available to you and your family. Most foundations go about there business quietly and without fanfare – they do what’s most important – help the those who need it. They don’t have icons representing them, they don’t have massive overheads to supply the care they just care. Most if not all provide real support such as homecare and physical support.

One thing to think of when next buying a yellow bracelet. Think about how much of this goes to jet fuel and how much goes to real survivorship.

 

[flicker]

I still live in the sweetness of Lance. the hate in the clinic inspires us to do better work. Fred

 

[AussieGoddess]

As you seem to be someone who can appreciate his alter-ego of CancerMan, does the good he has done for survivors absolve him of his cycling misdeeds?

I'm just trying to gauge how the non-cycling world would view him. Would it matter if he cheated for his TdF wins? Does that even matter in his non-cylcing millieu of 'survivor'? How does the cancer community feel about integrity?

I'm not taking the p*ss out of him, I'm just curious. I'm not a cancer survivor, nor am I a LA fan. Hence, I'm looking for more of a reading from the LA cancer community.

I would just like to get a feel of the 'community' regarding all that's going on, without the the troll-baiting...

yeh it is a conundrum.

Does his good deeds absolve him for the way in which he got there? Does the end justify the means? In his case I would say No.

He has done good things - but he has acheived fame and fortune by cheating, and it doesnt make it all better that he gives some (not all) of that back by being a good citizen with the public's largesse.

My post was really about the LAF/Livestrong. That it does do good, and I am a bit tired of people suggesting that his charity is a scam. Its not, it does do good things ....but TheHog is right in some ways too. The info and support is already there. It can be difficult to navigate around, and the LAF / Livestrong HAS certainly helped people in need and made things easier for them ... but people will still survive cancer without them. The foundation isnt looking for a cure, or paying for medication when people cant afford it.


As for the general public - I think the vast majority of the 'community' (ie non-cycling fans) actually dont really beleive he doped. I have really only just started being more than just a casual July fan .... (access to the internet and paytv means I can actually follow the sport), and before then had no real idea ... I did actually think he was clean. (Have since done a lot of reading and had my naivity exposed)

People beleive in the miracle - they want to. People beleive him when he says 'they are just out to get me' .... and dont really want to think about the truth. Even if they beleive he doped, they actually dont really consider the consequences of that in the wider community ....


As for me - Im actually one of the lucky ones. My version (CML) is treatable (though at this point not curable) ... and Australia is a great country to live in as we have great health care. Its been a rocky road - but coming out the other side

(ETA : All the luck and best wishes to you too tubularglue)

 

[JMBeaushrimp]

Great posts, AussieGoddess and Hog.

As I said, I'm not entrenched in the cancer community, so I like hearing that angle.

I keep getting the feeling that Livestrong is basically pulling in money, and justifying it, by guiding survivors to already existing resources. Is that accurate?

 

[Bilirubin]

Great posts, AussieGoddess and Hog.

As I said, I'm not entrenched in the cancer community, so I like hearing that angle.

I keep getting the feeling that Livestrong is basically pulling in money, and justifying it, by guiding survivors to already existing resources. Is that accurate?

The experts seem to disagree.

"It has pioneered programs here and abroad for survivors; worked to unify the fractured cancer community; and instigated a worldwide crusade, which includes the United Nations and the Clinton Global Initiative, to make the world's No. 1 killer a health-care priority. "I can't think of an organization with the breadth of activity that the foundation has," says Dr. Larry Shulman, chief medical officer at the renowned Dana-Farber Cancer Institute in Boston, "and that includes the American Cancer Society."

 

[Benotti69]

The experts seem to disagree.

.....worked to unify the fractured cancer community; and instigated a worldwide crusade......,

if they think it is fractured now wait till the world finds out where all the money is gone from Liestrong when LA gets done by the feds and uses his liestrong slush fund to fight a conviction.

 

[AussieGoddess]

Great posts, AussieGoddess and Hog.

As I said, I'm not entrenched in the cancer community, so I like hearing that angle.

I keep getting the feeling that Livestrong is basically pulling in money, and justifying it, by guiding survivors to already existing resources. Is that accurate?

They do that - but a fair amount more. They do provide actual physical support as well, they do provide substantial information and assistance and they campaign governments and high profiles and national institutions to rally to the cancer cause. There is only so much money going around .... and the various charities, causes, issues and medical research funding are spread pretty widely. Livestrong fights for more of it to be spent on cancer, and for the cancer causes to be united.

For example - Its not unusual for charities to go to court over bequests that are a little unclear as to the actual charity involved. The fight against cancer needs to be united .... and it needs high profile people to get behind it.

As for justifying the expenses - ALL charities have major expenses for administration and fund raising. A good charity will usually limit these to within 10%-15% of income (eg the red cross).

The Lance Armstrong Foundation / Livestrong accounts (here) DO certainly have a higher expense ration than that (around 18% - 20%), and I do think some of their costs are a little questionable. For example one that concerns me in the breakup of the spending is 'Government relations' spending of $729,337 and 2008 - $997,995'. Thats a LOT to be spending on this kind of thing, even though they have done a good job of it.

So in general - is it a charity that uses its money to best effect ..... on my quick analysis I would say I have seen better. (I have seen worse too I might add)

But for mine, even if only 60% goes to the cause, its 60% more than we had before.

 

[jimmypop]

It was never set up with good intentions. It was always meant to be a way for Armstrong to earn a living in case he could not return to the sport.

No question about that. It was spoken of openly at the time. Just ask "College". Or, for that matter, anyone who was around Armstrong in 1996/'97.

 

[tubularglue]

Can someone provide links/info regarding livestrong.org compared to and the inception of livestrong.com

Backer/owner

Are their any statistics where there was a drop in funding for .org when .com
Went online. Or are there any statistics of .com donating to .org or vice
Versa.

a link for annual gross yearly from launch date to 2009 for .org/.com

Any info appreciated

Curious

 

[sartain]

Because the entire Armstrong era and persona is a great big con game, a great conspiracy with Armstrong as the lynchpin and driven by Public Strategies, Demand Media and the evil trifecta of Weis, Stapleton and Knaggs. His access to superior doping is all that made a fat slob into a 7x TDF winner.

Race Radio knows this because he has access to grand jury information / people involved with the investigation that the rest of us don't.

BINGO, Eleven . . . short, sweat and right to the point. I can't wait to see how members of the trifecta hold up.

 

[Race Radio]

Can someone provide links/info regarding livestrong.org compared to and the inception of livestrong.com

Backer/owner

Are their any statistics where there was a drop in funding for .org when .com
Went online. Or are there any statistics of .com donating to .org or vice
Versa.

a link for annual gross yearly from launch date to 2009 for .org/.com

Any info appreciated

Curious

I am not sure exactly what you are looking for but when Armstrong pimped Livestrong to demand media he personally received warrants that are worth about $12 million plus $1 million a year consulting agreement. The value of those warrants could be significantly higher depending on how the IPO performs.

As for the .com vs. the .org. It is clear Armstrong's focus is driving traffic to the for profit site. It is easy to see he has been successful.

So much for raising awareness.

 

[tubularglue]

i am wondering the financial ties between the two,

and just thinking of digging up some site statistics as to whether there was a decline in hits for the .org when .com was launched. what the effect was.

curious

those charts are interesting. some common spikes and drops




continuing to unwind the knot

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

i am wondering the financial ties between the two

Are you asking about how much money changes hands, or how the financial arrangements are structured? I thought the whole LAF/Livestrong brand/Demand/livestrong.com thing was common knowledge here?

 

[tubularglue]

"This was an innovative partnership and rather than have any money flow to the Foundation from the dot-com site, LAF(non profit)took equity in the parent company, Demand Media since we didn't want to be financially tied with the site on a daily basis, he said."

http://journals.lww.com/oncology-ti..._com_vs_Livestrong_org__Does_Same_Name.7.aspx

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

....when Armstrong pimped Livestrong to demand media he personally received warrants that are worth about $12 million plus $1 million a year consulting agreement.

Any idea how much LAF got for "pimping Livestrong to Demand"?

The way the corporate marketing pie gets carved up between LAF and LA has interested me for a while. What is the deal with conflict of interest laws in the states?

 

[tubularglue]

now isn't this interesting:

"Unlike other new media and content startups, Demand Media has taken a hardnosed data-driven approach to content by creating an algorithm to determine exactly what kinds of content will interest Web users. In a formula that echoes the cold, steely clanks of a Ford assembly line, the algorithm scours the Web for the most commonly entered search terms and puts them together in strategic batches designed to maximize each word’s traffic-drawing value. The garble of words is then sent down the line to the first of many proofers, who attempts to arrange the words into an article topic. Eventually, the polished topic sentence finds its way to a writer, who is paid $15 to turn it into an article, and once it goes through the copyediting process, it ends up on one of Demand’s Web properties, such as eHow.com, Livestrong.com, Answerbag, and more.

The word “soulless” comes to mind."

http://vator.tv/news/2010-11-03-dem...com&utm_medium=Plugin&utm_campaign=Vator News

cached link:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...com&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-a

prediction on sale: http://vator.tv/news/2010-10-27-why-an-ipo-is-3x-better-for-lance-armstrong

 

[Dettol]

Everything Lance touches gleams of gold but reeks of sh!t

 

[TexPat]

Any idea how much LAF got for "pimping Livestrong to Demand"?

The way the corporate marketing pie gets carved up between LAF and LA has interested me for a while. What is the deal with conflict of interest laws in the states?

That's a foreign concept.

 

[Race Radio]

Any idea how much LAF got for "pimping Livestrong to Demand"?

The way the corporate marketing pie gets carved up between LAF and LA has interested me for a while. What is the deal with conflict of interest laws in the states?

They got the same amount of warrants as Lance, less the $1,000,000 per year "Consulting agreement" and traffic incentives.

The traffic figures make it clear that when Armstrong is out to "Raise Awareness" for Livestrong he is talking about the for profit site, not the .org.

 

[tubularglue]

http://vimeo.com/10612816

 

[hubbard]

http://vimeo.com/10612816

wtf..........

 

[Benotti69]

http://vimeo.com/10612816

that makes me think it would be very good for the world if Armstrong gets done for his PED use and put back into his box in Texas where he cant do much damage because stuff like that is scary.

 

[TexPat]

that makes me think it would be very good for the world if Armstrong gets done for his PED use and put back into his box in Texas where he cant do much damage because stuff like that is scary.

Jesus H Christ, I wish I hadn't clicked on that link.