Ban Team Time Trials ?

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When should Team Time Trials be permitted?

  • At 2.WT level only

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Reduced team time trials only†

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    48
  • Poll closed .
Just enjoy things as they are now, rather than think everything should be "like it used to be".
I have heard someone here before be so fearful and prejudiced about the past that they read one thing and let it fill the whole thing and in entitlement do not want to hear more.

So here you are attached to I mentioned an era just out of curiosity of my own experience, without reading my posts in their entirety, including my points about why I think yesterday's TTT was a misplaced artificial poppet and how to do it right, if you want to have any kind of relevance. So not a part of my suggestions for how the cake could be cut here in the present, so that it did not become as indifferent as yesterday.

With your post it appear as if you think I am stuck in the past. On the contrary I'm not.

But it's not just you, it's a trend today, mixed with FOMO anxiety and canceling the pointers is unfortunately successfully distorted.
 
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So here you are attached to I mentioned an era just out of curiosity of my own experience, without reading my posts in their entirety, including my points about why I think yesterday's TTT was a misplaced artificial poppet and how to do it right, if you want to have any kind of relevance.

The way I read your point was basically "If they want to do it right, it has to be how it used to be!"
Please clarify what you meant if that isn't the case.
 
Nascar has a version of that on the Superspeedways. 20 car pileups at 200 mph is a typical occurrence but sadistically fun to watch. A cycling version would be the same thing except no one walks away from crashes. At least not with their kit intact.
Seriously watching 3 cars bump-drafting alongside groups on either side doing the same seems like taking an Atlas rocket launch naked and not strapped in. I'm sure if they had an in-car camera on the driver's "hydration" tubes leaving the racing suit they'd find one heading to the floor displaying sudden color changes.
 
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I enjoy watching TTTs as they are beautiful, but the potential gaps should be reduced.
Yesterday's stage didn't produce any significant gaps, thankfully, but sometimes a TTT may effectively decide a race. And it's simply not good if you lose time simply because your teammates are weaker/crash early in the stage, Garmin 2014 style.
 
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Team Time Trials are hilarious! I love the, ah, flexible rules and the ensuring mayhem on the road and in the commentator box.

I wish every stage race had a TTT. In fact, I wish there were (more) one day races that were TTTs.
 
The way I read your point was basically "If they want to do it right, it has to be how it used to be!"
Please clarify what you meant if that isn't the case.
OK I give in. You're right.
(previous answer to you written with quite a headache and confusion in my already messy head, I apologize).

However, I am of the opinion that sometimes it can be healthy to revisit the past with new glasses.
To me it sometimes seems like a bit too much of an auto-reply when the main justification is "ok that was back then, move on".

A long-distance TTT is still a completely different experience for the viewers compared to a short TTT - with many technical passages on a pancake-flat route (as the other day). Of course, a short TTT delivers insight into the capabilities of the different teams with the purely technical abilities comparing each team.

However, on the long distances - over varying terrain with fewer super-technical passages (festival of 90 degree corners and so on), by then you witness the slow wear and tear and you have the opportunity to closely study with magnifying glass (or e.g. helped by drone cams as mentioned as an idea here), the symbiosis for each individual team and can spot where it may start to be critical 5k later.

I've witnessed it so many times, but I think the last time was the aforementioned Tours-Blois TTT in the 2005 Tour - and I'm on the oppinion that the GTs severely misses that extra layer of tense ingredient; everything is on stake - and it becomes pure art to watch, where it's up to the strongest TT riders to dose their forces precisely - and then the solitaire element of where and when to use which riders, medium long uphill climbs, downhill winding descents, 10 km of straight flat stretch, etc.

My experience is that it's a completely different experience for the viewers than the one the day before yesterday.

Such a long TTT should of course be done in the first week, when there hasn't been that much dropout yet.

I recognize and acknowledge the main anchors speaking against.
- a GC can be decided early in the race
- juicy stuff from the past that belongs in another forum.

My suggestion is to make use of the relatively new invention - where each rider's time counts. I think, for example, it's been cool to see a domestique or sprinter riding leadout for a team's GC rider towards the finish line.

If you then translate this into a long TTT distance, then in my opinion you get a really interesting event - which is not just a misplaced puppet like the day before yesterday (I haven't gotten away from that attitude after seeing a bit of the stage anyway) - a TTT where everything is at stake and as a 'main event' on par with the best mountain stages, whereby such an event has relevance.

Of course with the risk that a GC can then become more locked after such a stage. However, I would like the organizers to have the courage for once. Some object "what can you get back commercially on that account". Here my conviction is, that such kind of TTT event will be a self-selling piece of art. As I've mentioned before here - It has happened before; with days of talk and and sparking suspence in the air leading up to - just like on the biggest mountain stages.
 
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If you then translate this into a long TTT distance, then in my opinion you get a really interesting event - which is not just a misplaced puppet like the day before yesterday (I haven't gotten away from that attitude after seeing a bit of the stage anyway) - a TTT where everything is at stake and as a 'main event' on par with the best mountain stages, whereby such an event has relevance.

And that's the thing. Just because it's not the length it used to be, it's suddenly a "misplaced puppet"?
 
And that's the thing. Just because it's not the length it used to be, it's suddenly a "misplaced puppet"?
Yes, that's my point. And I may understand your wondering.

I've tried to describe the difference here in the thread - and it's particularly in contrast to the smaller Dali-watch TTT the other day:

- Short, flat with lots of technical spots, 90 degree corners and so on. No GC at stake.

Action consists of the technical points on the route and the teams' ability here. It's very direct action on TV, which is also suitable for competition with other forms of action on streaming services and being on safe ground with the GC.

Versus:

- Longer route in varied terrain, a mix of pancake flats, semi-long climbs and descents. No festival of 90 degree turns. GC is at stake.
It changes the importance of the stage, something at stake.
But first and foremost it changes the dynamics considerably of a TTT team in action. And in previous vesions with excellent TV productions, viewers have been able to witness small details in a team where the weak links start to get into trouble over time, surprises for teams that have not coordinated optimally, riders who have not announced themselves honestly enough,
It is an extended suspense with nerves, slow or rapid wear of links in the chain, that cannot be fully described without having experienced it. And I think it is a shame that it should just be erased from history.

The reticence is probably also related to the fact that the composition of viewers has changed as the supply on the broadcasting platforms has multiplied and more artificial action is sought to keep viewers tuned in.
The obstacle, first and foremost, is the gigantic money that has come into the sport and there has become too much to lose. And that viewers can live with an artificial action that has no particular meaning.

But when you have experienced it - almost like a trance state with nerves - where it has more significance than just a stage win - then I think organizers should dare to give it a chance.
 
It would be a real loss for professional cycling if TTTs were phased out. They’re an integral part of the sport’s identity. One of the great appeals of pro cycling is its diversity—sprints, mountain stages, cobbled classics, general classification battles—all tackled by the same teams and riders. TTTs add a unique tactical and visual dimension to that mix.

If we want to preserve TTTs, they need to evolve to become more engaging for fans and viewers. After all, race organizers are driven by audience numbers and sponsor visibility.
So how can we make TTTs more exciting to watch—both on-site and on television—without resorting to gimmicks?

A few ideas :
- More intermediate time splits, or even live GPS-based time gaps and speed data to build suspense in real time.
- Multi-lap courses, allowing spectators to see each team pass several times, rather than just once.
- Stadium-style viewing zones (on false flats?), with paid seating and atmosphere similar to Flanders.
- Low-flying camera drones following each team for dynamic aerial coverage and immersive visuals.
Anything else?
 
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