Boonen vs Cancellara - Attempting a palmares confrontation

[burning]

Re:

Nice thread, however it is time for someone to say the truth just like it is:

Cancellara has been the strongest rider after the second week of April 2006. In the years after that, Boonen only shined on monuments and even th Tour when Fabian wasn't there, due to injury.

However, since that week, Fabian has been doing nothing more than kicking Boonen's *** on direct confrontation. There's no competition at all. Not only is Fabian by far the most complete of the 2, he has been much stronger on monuments pretty much for the whole last decade, while only being weaker in 2005.

I fail to see how Canc was strong on stones in 2008 and 2009, he is definitely the better rider though

 

[Miburo]

Re: Re:

Nice thread, however it is time for someone to say the truth just like it is:

Cancellara has been the strongest rider after the second week of April 2006. In the years after that, Boonen only shined on monuments and even th Tour when Fabian wasn't there, due to injury.

However, since that week, Fabian has been doing nothing more than kicking Boonen's *** on direct confrontation. There's no competition at all. Not only is Fabian by far the most complete of the 2, he has been much stronger on monuments pretty much for the whole last decade, while only being weaker in 2005.

I fail to see how Canc was strong on stones in 2008 and 2009, he is definitely the better rider though

Unfair to use it in '09 since canc was in half-decent shape in the classics (don't remember what happened)

Boonen was definitely better in '08, especially in the ronde

 

[Mr.White]

Re:

Nice thread, however it is time for someone to say the truth just like it is:

Cancellara has been the strongest rider after the second week of April 2006. In the years after that, Boonen only shined on monuments and even th Tour when Fabian wasn't there, due to injury.

However, since that week, Fabian has been doing nothing more than kicking Boonen's *** on direct confrontation. There's no competition at all. Not only is Fabian by far the most complete of the 2, he has been much stronger on monuments pretty much for the whole last decade, while only being weaker in 2005.

Tom Boonen is maybe the best cobbled classics rider of all-time, I only see Roger De Vlaeminck as a competition. Not Merckx, not Van Looy, and not freaking Cancellara! Cancellara is maybe better overall rider, thanks to his TT ability, but in one-day races (monuments, classics, semi-classics, etc) Boonen has the edge.

And you say he was stronger since 2005?!!! Stronger how? What does that even means?!What do you think, it's some kind of a pulling contest?!!! Why don't you look up results from that years? Boonen was a better rider whole last decade, easily!

 

[pedromiguelmartins]

Re: Re:

Nice thread, however it is time for someone to say the truth just like it is:

Cancellara has been the strongest rider after the second week of April 2006. In the years after that, Boonen only shined on monuments and even th Tour when Fabian wasn't there, due to injury.

However, since that week, Fabian has been doing nothing more than kicking Boonen's *** on direct confrontation. There's no competition at all. Not only is Fabian by far the most complete of the 2, he has been much stronger on monuments pretty much for the whole last decade, while only being weaker in 2005.

Tom Boonen is maybe the best cobbled classics rider of all-time, I only see Roger De Vlaeminck as a competition. Not Merckx, not Van Looy, and not freaking Cancellara! Cancellara is maybe better overall rider, thanks to his TT ability, but in one-day races (monuments, classics, semi-classics, etc) Boonen has the edge.

And you say he was stronger since 2005?!!! Stronger how? What does that even means?!What do you think, it's some kind of a pulling contest?!!! Why don't you look up results from that years? Boonen was a better rider whole last decade, easily!

Lol. I said after the second week of April 2006, Cancellara become a much stronger rider than Tom.

And even if you want to ignore all other of Fabian's achievements and only focus on cobbled classics/monuments, yes, Fabian is a much stronger rider as well, since 14th April 2006. Just look at the number of podiums and victories in monuments and direct confrontations.

 

[Cance > TheRest]

Re: Re:

Nice thread, however it is time for someone to say the truth just like it is:

Cancellara has been the strongest rider after the second week of April 2006. In the years after that, Boonen only shined on monuments and even th Tour when Fabian wasn't there, due to injury.

However, since that week, Fabian has been doing nothing more than kicking Boonen's *** on direct confrontation. There's no competition at all. Not only is Fabian by far the most complete of the 2, he has been much stronger on monuments pretty much for the whole last decade, while only being weaker in 2005.

Tom Boonen is maybe the best cobbled classics rider of all-time, I only see Roger De Vlaeminck as a competition. Not Merckx, not Van Looy, and not freaking Cancellara! Cancellara is maybe better overall rider, thanks to his TT ability, but in one-day races (monuments, classics, semi-classics, etc) Boonen has the edge.

And you say he was stronger since 2005?!!! Stronger how? What does that even means?!What do you think, it's some kind of a pulling contest?!!! Why don't you look up results from that years? Boonen was a better rider whole last decade, easily!

De Vlaeminck is the greatest cobbles specialist of all time, ofcourse.

A thing in their "rivalry" that makes it difficult to make comparisons is that perhaps Boonen had his best years as a cobbles specialist between 2005 and 2012, while Cancellara was probably at his best from 2010 and onwards. Therefore only the 2010 and 2011 seasons can be used as a representation of how both riders compare in peak shape (counting out Paris Roubaix 2011, where Boonen had his race disrupted on the Arenberg secteur). We all know who was the stronger rider in that period - yet it's not case decided.

From a bigger perspective, it is hard to say who's the best cobbles rider.
Obviously Boonen has a much better cobbles palmares. That is a result of two things:
1) he is Belgian and targets even the smaller semi-classics, many of which Fabian hasn't even raced.
2) he's had more weapons to use in the cobbled races than just pure power - i.e. the best possible team and a great sprint.

The different approach and characteristics is what makes the rivalry fascinating: one rider using his unique time trial power on the cobbles, while the other rider was, from the start, a born cobbles/classics specialist. You have to value both riders for what they are, and therefore it is subjective who is the most impressive of the two: Either you prefer the pure power of Fabian or the "born on the cobbles"-talent of Tom.

 

[Mr.White]

Re: Re:

Nice thread, however it is time for someone to say the truth just like it is:

Cancellara has been the strongest rider after the second week of April 2006. In the years after that, Boonen only shined on monuments and even th Tour when Fabian wasn't there, due to injury.

However, since that week, Fabian has been doing nothing more than kicking Boonen's *** on direct confrontation. There's no competition at all. Not only is Fabian by far the most complete of the 2, he has been much stronger on monuments pretty much for the whole last decade, while only being weaker in 2005.

Tom Boonen is maybe the best cobbled classics rider of all-time, I only see Roger De Vlaeminck as a competition. Not Merckx, not Van Looy, and not freaking Cancellara! Cancellara is maybe better overall rider, thanks to his TT ability, but in one-day races (monuments, classics, semi-classics, etc) Boonen has the edge.

And you say he was stronger since 2005?!!! Stronger how? What does that even means?!What do you think, it's some kind of a pulling contest?!!! Why don't you look up results from that years? Boonen was a better rider whole last decade, easily!

Lol. I said after the second week of April 2006, Cancellara become a much stronger rider than Tom.

And even if you want to ignore all other of Fabian's achievements and only focus on cobbled classics/monuments, yes, Fabian is a much stronger rider as well, since 14th April 2006. Just look at the number of podiums and victories in monuments and direct confrontations.

I don't want to ignore a thing. I agree Cancellara is stronger rider in some way, and probably more complete of the two. And I think he's very slightly better rider overall, in terms of their palmares. But on the other hand, I do think that Boonen is better one-day rider, although not much better. He may not be as strong as Cancellara, but he had a deadly sprint which gave him many great victories. I respect them both, they were/are both great champions, and the differences between them are minimal if you look at their whole careers.

 

[Nick C.]

Remember Boonen couldn't even compete for the victory in Flanders in 2008 and 2009, when he was near the peak of his powers, because Devolder was up the road (and winning) both years.

 

[Mr.White]

Re: Re:

Nice thread, however it is time for someone to say the truth just like it is:

Cancellara has been the strongest rider after the second week of April 2006. In the years after that, Boonen only shined on monuments and even th Tour when Fabian wasn't there, due to injury.

However, since that week, Fabian has been doing nothing more than kicking Boonen's *** on direct confrontation. There's no competition at all. Not only is Fabian by far the most complete of the 2, he has been much stronger on monuments pretty much for the whole last decade, while only being weaker in 2005.

Tom Boonen is maybe the best cobbled classics rider of all-time, I only see Roger De Vlaeminck as a competition. Not Merckx, not Van Looy, and not freaking Cancellara! Cancellara is maybe better overall rider, thanks to his TT ability, but in one-day races (monuments, classics, semi-classics, etc) Boonen has the edge.

And you say he was stronger since 2005?!!! Stronger how? What does that even means?!What do you think, it's some kind of a pulling contest?!!! Why don't you look up results from that years? Boonen was a better rider whole last decade, easily!

De Vlaeminck is the greatest cobbles specialist of all time, ofcourse.

A thing in their "rivalry" that makes it difficult to make comparisons is that perhaps Boonen had his best years as a cobbles specialist between 2005 and 2012, while Cancellara was probably at his best from 2010 and onwards. Therefore only the 2010 and 2011 seasons can be used as a representation of how both riders compare in peak shape (counting out Paris Roubaix 2011, where Boonen had his race disrupted on the Arenberg secteur). We all know who was the stronger rider in that period - yet it's not case decided.

From a bigger perspective, it is hard to say who's the best cobbles rider.
Obviously Boonen has a much better cobbles palmares. That is a result of two things:
1) he is Belgian and targets even the smaller semi-classics, many of which Fabian hasn't even raced.
2) he's had more weapons to use in the cobbled races than just pure power - i.e. the best possible team and a great sprint.

The different approach and characteristics is what makes the rivalry fascinating: one rider using his unique time trial power on the cobbles, while the other rider was, from the start, a born cobbles/classics specialist. You have to value both riders for what they are, and therefore it is subjective who is the most impressive of the two: Either you prefer the pure power of Fabian or the "born on the cobbles"-talent of Tom.

Agree.