climbing cycle

[acapro73]

Hi,

I have a technical question. I am an amateur cyclist in not so great shape and pretty heavy. I have a campagnolo veloce double groupset on my bike (52-39/ 12-25). I am planning to go with some friends to the Alps to cycle. Cycling on my lowest gear while pedaling smoothly I can't go less than 11 km/h on the local hill. I feel that I will not be able to climb the mountains with these gears. Can anybody advise me on what my options are? My groupset is still in reasonably good state so I would not like to change it completely. Is there a possibility to add a 3rd crank to the crankset or change the 39 crank to a 30?

Thanks,
Aleks

 

[davidg]

You will not be able to change to a 30 chainring unless you go with compact cranks, which is a new set.

you could stay with the 39 and get a cassette with a 29 tooth on it. will get up most things for most people

 

[elapid]

Agree. Either change to a double compact (50-34 or similar) or a triple crank, and/or change your rear cassette to a 27 or 29. I have compact cranks and will be changing my rear cassette from 11-23 to 12-27 for an upcoming tour through the mountains. While I could get up the mountains with 34-23, I think my legs will be fresher if I use 34-27. If you are going through the Alps and are not that fit, then you don't want your legs blowing up on day 1 because you are pushing too hard a gear.

 

[RDV4ROUBAIX]

The determining factor is the length of the cage of your rear derailleur. If you have the short cage, your max cassette will be 13-26. For a medium cage, your max is 13-29.

 

[mr. tibbs]

The determining factor is the length of the cage of your rear derailleur. If you have the short cage, your max cassette will be 13-26. For a medium cage, your max is 13-29.

Seconded. Make the changes in your cassette, but check with your LBS about the cage length.

I have '08 Centaur and I run a 26 cog with standard cranks and a short cage derailleur.

The Campy RD manual says you can run short cage with anything except a 13-29 cassette, and the medium cage fits all combinations. (Unless you have a triple crankset, which you don't need to worry about, I guess.)

Good luck, and have fun!

 

[lostintime]

Not really any "cheap " options for you. The first thing is to keep riding your hills to get in shape!

You can add a third ring to your present crank, with TA's triple conversion rings.
They cost $96 for the Campy ones, and you still have to get the third ring. But, you'll also need F and R D's, and a new BB.
http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/chainrings.asp (bottom of page)

There's no low cost fix here, as a lower cassette may not be low enough with a 39t ring. We don't really know how "out of shape" you are. It's always better to have some bail out room..... especially in the mountains! A compact double w/34t ring would work better.

Three cheers for 110 BCD cranks ! Get a triple 110 and you add another dimension, as you don't have to use the third ring if you don't want to, just a shorter BB. They can be used for racing, touring and mtb use.

 

[nightfend]

The Alps are a nasty place to find out you are not in shape. The climbs are steep and long. Your best bet is to improve your fitness and lose weight. It will have the biggest impact on your climbing ability.

In any case, if you feel you are not fit, then definitely, definitely get a triple chainring set. You'll need the very low gears to avoid cramping up on the Alpine climbs. Or, at least get a compact crankset.

Your gearing currently is about the same as what a bike racer would use in the Alps. 39x25 is fine for 8% climbs if you are a racer.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I would definitely try to find a steady training program, and avoid JRA training (Just Riding Around). Fitness will be as much of a key as gearing, though I would definitely do both. A 34x29 compact should get just about any fit rider up most big climbs unless you're riding up the Zoncolon or Angliru.

As to fitness, try to get some days of long, long rides in. Like, over 50 miles. Try to keep your pace good and steady.

To climbing, there are two things to do: Find the hills and ride. The advantage of this is that in a 4 hour JRA ride you'll get maybe an hour of good training; through the hills maybe 3 hours.

Find a local hill, a loop works best, with a length of at least a quarter mile, and over 4% gradient (more than 10% too much). Start riding uphill intervals. Having an HRM is a big help here. But if you know you're body (which is actually more important than an HRM) you can still do it. If you're not in great shape, uphill intervals will wipe you out. So form a plan and work your way into them. Don't plan on going out and riding them for three hours, you'll regret it.

If you have any access to any type of coaching, use it. Find a coach and start asking questions. But make sure this person is willing to listen to who you are, and what you have to say. You're equally likely to find someone to just pass on info that you need to ride three hours of uphill intervals.

 

[180mmCrank]

I would definitely try to find a steady training program, and avoid JRA training (Just Riding Around). Fitness will be as much of a key as gearing, though I would definitely do both. A 34x29 compact should get just about any fit rider up most big climbs unless you're riding up the Zoncolon or Angliru.

As to fitness, try to get some days of long, long rides in. Like, over 50 miles. Try to keep your pace good and steady.

To climbing, there are two things to do: Find the hills and ride. The advantage of this is that in a 4 hour JRA ride you'll get maybe an hour of good training; through the hills maybe 3 hours.

Find a local hill, a loop works best, with a length of at least a quarter mile, and over 4% gradient (more than 10% too much). Start riding uphill intervals. Having an HRM is a big help here. But if you know you're body (which is actually more important than an HRM) you can still do it. If you're not in great shape, uphill intervals will wipe you out. So form a plan and work your way into them. Don't plan on going out and riding them for three hours, you'll regret it.

If you have any access to any type of coaching, use it. Find a coach and start asking questions. But make sure this person is willing to listen to who you are, and what you have to say. You're equally likely to find someone to just pass on info that you need to ride three hours of uphill intervals.

Great advice.

And when it comes to the climbs - sit down, chuck it in a low gear, ride at your own pace, drink lots and enjoy! I love the Alps!

Do you know where you are going in the Alps?

 

[novicerider]

AM new to forums but was reading the advice re training for hill. I have a Shimano 52/39 with 13/25 block - finding the steep hills (10%+)a bit of a struggle and would like to increase average speed uphill

Just wondered if you could expand on uphill interval training. Keen to try and improve performance but not really sure of training techniques for hills - any advice appreciated...

Have a 1/2 mile hill close to home at about average 6% - want to make the best use of it...cheers

 

[arrhythmia rules]

Hi,

I have a technical question. I am an amateur cyclist in not so great shape and pretty heavy. I have a campagnolo veloce double groupset on my bike (52-39/ 12-25). I am planning to go with some friends to the Alps to cycle. Cycling on my lowest gear while pedaling smoothly I can't go less than 11 km/h on the local hill. I feel that I will not be able to climb the mountains with these gears. Can anybody advise me on what my options are? My groupset is still in reasonably good state so I would not like to change it completely. Is there a possibility to add a 3rd crank to the crankset or change the 39 crank to a 30?

Thanks,
Aleks

Hi Aleks
I fit your situation as well, not particularly fit much older I guess at 64, though not overweight. However I do have a heart arrhythmia which seriously affects training. I have been out to the Alps a few times and coped enough to thoroughly enjoy it. Done climbs like Col de Bonnet, Izoard, Alp d Huez, Gavia, Stelvio, Simplon, Ventoux so I'm not a complete dummy.

Depends on how long before you go. So clearly do all you can to get fitter, a few longer rides but mostly shorter and harder. Use hill intervals if you can. Build slowly, that is get the pulse up steadily. A 5 minute hill done 3 or 4 or 5 times with say a 8% grade is a good start. 4 or 5 mins recovery. Riding every day you can, even twice is good. Really hard efforts can only be done 2 or 3 times per week. For the climbing its sorting your position, your breathing, your gearing, your head, developing power, raising your pulse eventually to a steady 85-88% ish of your max pulse and being used to that. That will make the long climbs and less intense effort in the Alps seem OK.

Have a good rest / recovery in the week, 10 days before you go.

In the Alps on the climbs learn to go at your pace. Never over do it, the pay back is huge. Aim for steady effort up to around 75% of max pulse, no higher. You'll soon find the pace you can sustain. Drink plenty with salt in your drink, I use diluted orange juice + salt since its available everywhere. The psychology of a steady climb within your limits is the key to survival and enjoyment. Unless of course the object is to burn everyone else and yourself and you are pretty fit

Gearing could make your trip. You will know your gearing now. For me 25x39 would be a disaster. I use a triple Campag and have replaced the inner ring with a 24 or 26 TA ring, works OK with a long cage Campag rear gear and 28 rear sprocket though I often have basic touring kit on my bike. An empty bike is easier. A new Campy triple, block, rear gear would be £155 ish including chain though you should be able to use the existing front changer and gear levers. You can always use the old kit later on. Just a non campag 32 rear would need a new changer as well but still cheaper. Next up would be adding a compact but it only saves the bottom bracket.

For example to climb the 16k and 1000 metres of Alp d'Huez, a not particularly hard climb, at 660 metres per hour will take you 1.5 hours and an average of 10.5 KPH. So your gearing would work OK if you can do the climbing. Can you climb at 650 to 750 metres per hour just now on shorter hills? Obviously some bits on the Alp are steeper but I guess when it came to it you would cope and your current kit would be OK. Pedalling more quickly is better but its surprising how slowly you can peddle if you need.

Another way to see it is if you can cope with your current gearing at 11kph that would mean climbing at 1100 metres per hour on a 10% grade and 550 mtrs/hr on a 5% grade. How does that fit with what you can do now, bear in mind the Alps are bigger though you will be fitter.

So it can depend on where in the Alps you are going, will there be many climbs with long stretches of 10-12% gradients - need a lower gear. And at what speed can you climb now - if you still have some time before you go you should be able to improve that.

If you have no local hills take a couple of days and go and find some. Need not be that long but a few hills at 200+ metres of climbing would be good. In any case a couple of back to back days would be very beneficial. Meanwhile use intervals and other riding at home.

 

[arrhythmia rules]

Basically warm up then go and ride it.
Start using a highish gear giving a cadence around 80 rpm but not killing yourself. That session is about building strength.

Use other sessions to work hard using intervals. Ensure adequate recovery between intervals. Max 2 or 3 hard sessions in a week, unless you are really dedicating your life to fitness.

Learn to climb: position on the bike, smooth pedalling, out of the saddle, transition from standing to seated, breath deeply, exhale fully, learn to suffer, if you want to race learn to change pace, finish steady hard intervals in a sprint, sprint half way up, try different cadences: slower, faster for several weeks then work out which suits you. Loose weight. Go find a steeper hill, then a longer hill. Use each. Learn to feel pleased about it all and enjoy climbing its great fun.

Find a coach. Thats a start.