Congrats to Gerrans on MSR.... BUT

[hrotha]

What would you say Cancellara is doing below?

Herp derp, I know he asked Gerrans to take a turn. Gerrans didn't. Did Cancellara insist? Did he force Gerrans to pass? No. If he had gone to a side and forced Gerrans to pull, and if Gerrans had decided to cooperate right then, it wouldn't have taken more than a second.

 

[function]

Herp derp, I know he asked Gerrans to take a turn. Gerrans didn't. Did Cancellara insist?

Did you even watch the race? Herp derp indeed.

 

[hrotha]

Did you even watch the race? Herp derp indeed.

Hey, it's that turn Gerrans took for roughly 300 m. Yeah I'm sure Cancellara thought that was enough and that Gerrans had done his share.

The fact is that Cancellara kept going, towing Gerrans to the finish line instead of demanding an equal effort from him. That's what we're discussing here, in case you got lost.

 

[function]

Hey, it's that turn Gerrans took for roughly 300 m. Yeah I'm sure Cancellara thought that was enough and that Gerrans had done his share.

The fact is that Cancellara kept going, towing Gerrans to the finish line instead of demanding an equal effort from him. That's what we're discussing here, in case you got lost.

You can keep the spade.

 

[Polyarmour]

You always have a choice. At last year's Paris-Roubaix he made a different choice, and many breakaways die a premature death because some riders don't want to do someone else's job.

If Cancellara had refused to tow Gerrans to the finish line, would Gerrans have acted the same way, or would he have cooperated? I don't care about Goss being behind, because at that point Gerrans was a much better option, as he was clearly the faster of the three (after 300 km, of course, Cancellara still had a chance), whereas Goss (who had real difficulties up the Poggio and only managed to be 15th, let us not forget) would have to deal with the likes of Sagan, Degenkolb and Freire, in a much less certain affair.

So Gerrans can't ride as fast as Cancellara on the flat. So what, he could still have given his all. We see that all the time: a climber and a rouleur in a break, the rouleur is more important to the success of the duo, but the climber still has to do his share, if only to allow the rouleur to catch his breath.

Had Cancellara refused to ride unless Gerrans went as hard as he, Gerrans would have been an idiot not to cooperate. If Fabian had done that, the three of them might have reached the finish line, and he might have won. That didn't happen, though, so it's Cancellara's fault that Gerrans didn't work, and Fabian did ride for 2nd instead of at least trying to bluff his way into 1st.

I think you're forgetting that Sagan ended up 2 seconds behind Nibali. Not much room for a spot of foxing to be going on in the lead group is it? Cancellara got it right. It was either 2nd or 10th.

 

[hrotha]

I think you're forgetting that Sagan ended up 2 seconds behind Nibali. Not much room for a spot of foxing to be going on in the lead group is it? Cancellara got it right. It was either 2nd or 10th.

I haven't forgotten, but I think you guys are applying hindsight in only one direction, and leaving Gerrans completely out of your calculations. For Cancellara, it was either ride for 2nd or for 10th. For Gerrans, the moment Cancellara made it clear he wasn't towing him to the finish line, it would have been ride for 1st (and most likely winning) or for 7th. How much time they lost, and how much they made up later, would be entirely down to how quickly Gerrans reacted and how well the two of them cooperated.

 

[Anonymous]

Had it been anyone other than Cancellara I'd be more critical of Gerrans. Cancellara has just made it so easy for others to sit on. Had it been anyone other than Cancellara I bet Gerrans and Nibali both would have ridden.

Had it been anyone other than Cancellara the Gerrans, Nibs duo would have gone nowhere.

 

[Anonymous]

Cancellara really had no other choice, no? It was either ride for 2nd or 10th.

Although there's a distinct possibility that he tried to convince himself he had at least a miniscule chance to win. Judging by the margin Gerrans had on the Swiss at the finish line, Sparticus was justified in his illusion. Racing the way he did, in any case kept the podium alive for all three. Gerrans and Nibali both had fast teammates in the immediate chase, so its logical they don't pull. Nibali was on the edge, anyway, and Gerrans apparently not much fresher.

The only thing moderately off-putting about what Gerrans said post-race, was that he thought perhaps Cancellara had underestimated him, this after Fabian basically served him the victory up on a plate. Well, if that were the case, than he should be ecstatic that he did, as it allowed him to win.

Cancellara had one chance at victory after he was unable to drop those two coming off the Poggio. He did what he needed to do and it almost worked.

 

[thehog]

Cancellara had one chance at victory after he was unable to drop those two coming off the Poggio. He did what he needed to do and it almost worked.

Do they give out gold medals for almost?

 

[Anonymous]

I think you're forgetting that Sagan ended up 2 seconds behind Nibali. Not much room for a spot of foxing to be going on in the lead group is it? Cancellara got it right. It was either 2nd or 10th.

This is correct. Gerrans won by hitching a ride.

Personally, I wouldn't want to win this way. Nibs hitched a ride too but didn't contest. Maybe he was blown, but he did not contest.

Anybody who races is familiar of the Gerrans tactic. I'm guessing most of us don't appreciate it much. I'll also guess that this is true in the ProTour ranks as well.

 

[Anonymous]

Do they give out gold medals for almost?

By that standard then Gerrans is your boy.

 

[hatcher]

Had it been anyone other than Cancellara the Gerrans, Nibs duo would have gone nowhere.

Which surely suggests sitting on was the correct tactic.

 

[thehog]

Which surely suggests sitting on was the correct tactic.

If it was the 70's or a club race Gerrans would have been put into the barriers with that tactic.

 

[hatcher]

And rightly so.

 

[Anonymous]

Which surely suggests sitting on was the correct tactic.

If one want to win that way, sure.

Don't forget though, that tactic has a shelf life too.

 

[Froome19]

Nibali stopped riding on the descent as he saw who had tagged along and knew his chances for the win had gone and so no longer contributed with the possibility that Sagan might make it back.

Gerrans held on during the descent and then felt no need to contribute to the stronger Cancellara knowing that he had the beating of him in the sprint, this may be seen as a negative tactic but it’s a legitimate one.

The only problem with this tactic is that you don’t want to strangle the break and end up getting caught by the bunch but Gerrans got it right and won what was in my eyes a disppointing Milan-San Remo.

Nibali gave it his all and wasnt strong enough. Dont kid yourself that he was working for Sagan, take if from me he wasnt

You always have a choice. At last year's Paris-Roubaix he made a different choice, and many breakaways die a premature death because some riders don't want to do someone else's job.

If Cancellara had refused to tow Gerrans to the finish line, would Gerrans have acted the same way, or would he have cooperated? I don't care about Goss being behind, because at that point Gerrans was a much better option, as he was clearly the faster of the three (after 300 km, of course, Cancellara still had a chance), whereas Goss (who had real difficulties up the Poggio and only managed to be 15th, let us not forget) would have to deal with the likes of Sagan, Degenkolb and Freire, in a much less certain affair.

So Gerrans can't ride as fast as Cancellara on the flat. So what, he could still have given his all. We see that all the time: a climber and a rouleur in a break, the rouleur is more important to the success of the duo, but the climber still has to do his share, if only to allow the rouleur to catch his breath.

Had Cancellara refused to ride unless Gerrans went as hard as he, Gerrans would have been an idiot not to cooperate. If Fabian had done that, the three of them might have reached the finish line, and he might have won. That didn't happen, though, so it's Cancellara's fault that Gerrans didn't work, and Fabian did ride for 2nd instead of at least trying to bluff his way into 1st.

Yeh generally what you said about a climber and a roleur is right but not in this case as Cancellara isnt just a roleur, he is super powered and in this case the truth is that Cancellara didnt need Gerrans and Gerrans wouldnt have contributed even to help Cancellara catch his breath as it wouldnt have helped.
I dont think you get the point that if Gerrans had ridden they wouldnt have made it to the finish ahead.
btw Gerrans is more of a puncher than a climber.




Here is a question what do you think is more valued as a win Gerrans at MSR or Schleck at Tour 10.
It may seem that it is obviously Gerrans but if you think about it Schleck could say he was the strongest in the race something that Gerrans cant say.

 

[hatcher]

If one want to win that way, sure.

Don't forget though, that tactic has a shelf life too.

It does, but I think in those particular circumstances it was the sensible thing to do. 20k to go and not helping? Not good. Bottom of the Poggio with 5 second gap and Cancellara drilling it? I might decide to sit on too.

 

[Anonymous]

It does, but I think in those particular circumstances it was the sensible thing to do. 20k to go and not helping? Not good. Bottom of the Poggio with 5 second gap and Cancellara drilling it? I might decide to sit on too.

I would too but I would not have contested the finish. I would have been very proud to have held on for 2nd, but I would not be able to look Canc or anyone else in the eye.

I would have done what Nibs did and just tip your hat to the guy that made the race.

 

[Froome19]

I would too but I would not have contested the finish. I would have been very proud to have held on for 2nd, but I would not be able to look Canc or anyone else in the eye.

I would have done what Nibs did and just tip your hat to the guy that made the race.

And thats why you're not a professional road racer
(well one of the reasons)

And to say that Nibali just gave in to Cancellara is ubsurd... Why would he if he knew that Gerrans would probably win?

 

[gobuck]

He is paid to win, not be a good sport. That is why they are called professionals and are PAID!

 

[Irish2009]

If a cat 3 rider rode like Cancellara we' d be laughing at him for being so stupid for bringing a better sprinter to the line. Cancellara's tactic didnt work
Gerrans did, therfore the best rider on the day won.

 

[Anonymous]

If a cat 3 rider rode like Cancellara we' d be laughing at him for being so stupid for bringing a better sprinter to the line. Cancellara's tactic didnt work
Gerrans did, therfore the best rider on the day won.

Don't know many Cat 3's that can march to the line at 62kph. You?

Gerrans was the winner, that is true. Best rider? Not so much.

 

[Anonymous]

And thats why you're not a professional road racer
(well one of the reasons)

And to say that Nibali just gave in to Cancellara is ubsurd... Why would he if he knew that Gerrans would probably win?

Not saying Nibali gave in to anybody. I'm saying Nibali did not contest the finish.

 

[hatcher]

I would too but I would not have contested the finish. I would have been very proud to have held on for 2nd, but I would not be able to look Canc or anyone else in the eye.

I would have done what Nibs did and just tip your hat to the guy that made the race.

Well that's far easier said than done. Only maybe 1% of the peloton can win races simply by being the strongest, and Gerrans isn't one of them. For what it's worth, I didn't see a single pro or ex-pro say a bad word about how Gerrans won it.

Nibali would have won the sprint if he could have.

 

[Froome19]

Not saying Nibali gave in to anybody. I'm saying Nibali did not contest the finish.

Nothing got to do with him not contesting against canc but rather because he had nothing left