Cyclist hit by police car, NEEDS HELP!

[Floyd_MANZANO]

Anyway, I thought the OP might have received some good advice from any forum members who are police officers about how to address his concerns about the officers not being honest....But it's doubtful he'll get that kind of help after calling them all liars.

Yes, of course, not when everything I do or write on CyclingNewsForum gets sent directly to all the cops in the US to read before breakfast.

Okay, time to go back to dropping some more Brown Acid and doing your square pedaling...

 

[pedaling squares]

Yes, of course, not when everything I do or write on CyclingNewsForum gets sent directly to all the cops in the US to read before breakfast.

Okay, time to go back to dropping some more Brown Acid and doing your square pedaling...

Everything you do gets sent to the cops... are you sure I'm the one on acid? I'm not interested in an argument here, I thought from your story that you might have a case and I'm surprised by your approach to getting assistance. I think if you read the thread over you'll find I haven't either trashed you or blindly supported the police. I don't know that you're totally blameless in the collision based on my potentially inaccurate perception from your story, but I think there's a huge liability on behalf of the PD for parking the car without lights on. I wish you luck in your case but I really do suggest sticking with a fact based approach and avoiding ridiculous generalizations about everyone in a given profession.

 

[Floyd_MANZANO]

What's so strange about it? Cops make a regular practice of lying. That's exactly why OJ went unconvicted - because of all the pointless lies the cops told in his case. (Look it up.)

When it comes to knowing case law, he'd be better off relying on convicts than cops. But why rely on either side of the coin when he can (and should) simply rely on a qualified and very aggressive attorney?

Maxiton, your reality test is sound. Kudos to you. You are another one of the rare few Americans who doesn't have his head jammed right up his stupid brainwashed butthole.

As far as corruption and cops, it's very similar to the omerta and doping in cycling and the way corruption always perfuses reality like a cancer.

Cops work in the public eye. They are constantly under scrutiny. Most are in the field because it's something they're genuinely devoted to, but also because after only 20-25 years you can retire in style with a handsome pension. No cop wants to screw that up by making a stupid mistake. They really don't want any black marks on their record.

Personally, I really understand how the reality of police work leads to a few "white lies" here and there. Problem is, corruption tends to become more egregious and widespread as time goes by amongst those who practice it.

 

[Floyd_MANZANO]

Also, if the car you hit was stradling the white line, that could also mean you weren't riding far enough to the right side of the road. You still would have had half of an entire lane to miss the car had you been riding as far to the right as possible, which is typically the law.

Don't know what the law is for police cars in the road with no lights on...

I've heard something to this effect from several folks and it's infuriating. The accident is 100% the fault of the negligent cop. As soon as she decided to start operating her motor vehicle on a public thoroughfare at night in complete darkness with no lights on whatsoever, she took responsibility for this accident.

Also, if you've ever actually ridden a bike on roads, you know that the far right side of the road is pretty much the hands-down most dangerous place on the road to be. Those laws are the stupidest thing ever and need to be struck off the books. Personally, I ignore that law with the exception of when there is automobile traffic in the lane with me (which happens a lot, of course).

 

[pedaling squares]

...operating her motor vehicle on a public thoroughfare at night in complete darkness

Your original story said late afternoon just after dusk.

Personally, I ignore that law...

So it's ok for you to ignore a law but the not the other person? Interesting approach Floyd.

 

[Floyd_MANZANO]

Your original story said late afternoon just after dusk.

That's right. What comes next after dusk/twilight is over with?

So it's ok for you to ignore a law but the not the other person? Interesting approach Floyd.

If I thought driving cars at night with no lights on was something that everybody needed to be doing, believe me I would advocate for that too, regardless of what some bone-headed law states.

 

[pedaling squares]

That's right. What comes next after dusk/twilight is over with?

If I thought driving cars at night with no lights on was something that everybody needed to be doing, believe me I would advocate for that too, regardless of what some bone-headed law states.

Fair enough Floyd. I'm slow to catch up to the changing details. It was dusk, it was night... she was parked, she was driving. Bear with me.

I do have one question - were the police truck's headlights on high beam? I wonder how you couldn't see the reflective material on the police car shining from the light of the police truck or your bike light. High beams in your face might explain that. Not flaming you, just asking.

 

[fatandfast]

How did you get the other party's information. Did they actually stop and render assistance and talk to you? Prior to this, I'd never been in a bike-car accident (other than a very minor incident). The fear in the back of my mind always is that a motorist striking a cyclist or otherwise causing a cyclist to crash would be very likely to flee the scene. Do you think I need to give my fellow man a little more credit?

I find the idea that one could be seriously injured and never even know who was responsible appalling.

I did call Mionski. He had some kind words and good advice, mainly to keep knocking on law firm doors until I find a good attorney who will take the case on contingency (that's where the law firm pays the legal costs upfront, and you only have to pay at the end if your case is won in your favor).

I have had 3 pretty bad accidents in about 8 years. 1st one was nipped by car mirror going about 25 or 30(the car) I went off the road went into some ice plant..a really juicy plant that grows all over S.Cal. .My stem,fork and frame all broke.had one bruise on my shoulder that looked like I got hit with a big pancake. The thing was perfectly round and soo purple. Girl drove around 300 ft and called 911 as she was walking back to see her handy work. She was pretty cool at the time but when she got a ticket from the police her tune changed completely. 2nd one was me riding home in humid sunshine after riding for 2 hours in the rain. I was listening to some kind of metal/funk on the ipod and blew the light and just like an idiot t-boned a girl on a Schwinn. She didn't even fall on the ground. Her bike was trashed. and she got a scratch on her leg..total cost to me 1100 bucks. I have never been hit and left for dead. When I was training in FL I was hit by a beer bottle while going about 20..left a tiny little horseshoe cut on my scalp@ the size of a finger nail..I have had a boat load of injuries this little thing was connected directly to my blood pump.when I finally got to the next town 2 people had called the cops before I had even stopped pedaling. The cops thought I had been shot. All my clothes, bike and body covered in blood from a tiny cut. Never able to ID type or color of car that tossed the bottle.Most recent guy on a group ride crashed into my rear wheel.I feel on the ground and my shorts ripped from the waistline to my crotch...lots of names like sweater ****..and people saying I look like a natural in crotchless chaps..It's going to take awhile for this to go away

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Fair enough Floyd. I'm slow to catch up to the changing details. It was dusk, it was night... she was parked, she was driving. Bear with me.

I do have one question - were the police truck's headlights on high beam? I wonder how you couldn't see the reflective material on the police car shining from the light of the police truck or your bike light. High beams in your face might explain that. Not flaming you, just asking.

Not sure where you are. But for dusk/ night - you need to see where New England is on a map. Right up at the top corner of the US.
Sunset in early December for that part of the country is 16:21.

On reflective material - this might draw a "what?" from posters in the US.
Where I come from police cars are lit up like a Christmas tree, but in the US most police cars have little or no reflective material.

I will say - I have had excellent experiences with the Police.
But, cops are human too - some good, some bad, some hardworking, some lazy.

Here are 3 stories (2 bike related) that show the bad side:
1. This is quite an unbelieveable story, long but well worth the read - obviously this cop does not like cyclists - the case was settled recently.
2. A video of a cyclist being hit by a Police car - where the police did not even report the incident.
3. This is a video of an incident when a Police car hits another car - the other driver is DUI and the Police can be heard making up a story to blame her for hitting them (5 cops involved in the cover up were sacked.)

 

[TopCarbon]

*commercial break*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VecHdJXeXkA&feature=related

now back to the show.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Hi folks,
<snipped to points>

Both cops have lied about what happened. Presumably because they don't want a black mark on their records and they know there were no other witnesses. If you know much about cops, you know they lie to cover their asses in various situations, it's almost standard practice, most unfortunately.

The insurance company for the town of the police department has denied liability. They say I was probably keeping my head down for aerodynamics and not looking at the road, which is not true and totally ludicrous for a cyclist riding very cautiously just after dusk.
........

I will not walk away from this case. This is so totally OUTRAGEOUS and not right. I ask you for any help or suggestions you can provide.

.

Sorry to hear of your accident - but there are a few parts I don't get.

To the blue above - the insurance company appear to admit that the incident took place "They say I was probably keeping my head down".
Why and how are they denying liability?

In the red, you say the cops lied? On what?
Was a report made of the incident? Did their car suffer any damage? Was medical assistance offered at the time? Was it 'called in'?
All of the above should have been recorded. I would assume not to is against standard practice and would make the individuals open to disciplinary action.

The only thing I can think of is that the Police are not denying the incident - but that the insurance company is refusing to pay because they believe you are making an exaggerated or excessive claim.

As someone suggested earlier - you need to record all 'evidence', fotos etc and also to show how much your bike was, have it valued and produce copies of receipts etc.

 

[pedaling squares]

Not sure where you are. But for dusk/ night - you need to see where New England is on a map. Right up at the top corner of the US.
Sunset in early December for that part of the country is 16:21.

I agree with much of what you said, although I am surprised to hear that some US police cars don't have at least basic reflective strips. But no matter the latitude or time of sunset, dusk is dusk and night is night. One has limited visibility, the other has little to none. I was just questioning the change in terminology. I'm still wondering why if the car was 4-5 feet away from the truck he could not have seen it considering he had a (weak) bike light and was apparently not looking down. Those must have been some extremely powerful headlights.

 

[Black Dog]

I agree with much of what you said, although I am surprised to hear that some US police cars don't have at least basic reflective strips. But no matter the latitude or time of sunset, dusk is dusk and night is night. One has limited visibility, the other has little to none. I was just questioning the change in terminology. I'm still wondering why if the car was 4-5 feet away from the truck he could not have seen it considering he had a (weak) bike light and was apparently not looking down. Those must have been some extremely powerful headlights.

I would think that with his pupils contracted from the head lights he would have a hard time seeing the car that was behind the light source. Also, the closer the car to the light source the harder it would be to see do to the washout effect from the headlights. You seem very skeptical and that is fine. If you think he is full of sh*t then come out and say so. Get two cars and set this up yourself. Then you will know. In fact set it up so that you don't know if there is a second car there or not. I bet you will slow down and not blow through assuming that you can see in the dark.

I am really not taking sides but it is very plausible. Cops are human and as such will behave like everyone else and may be quick to protect their asses from responsibility if they feel they messed up.

 

[Floyd_MANZANO]

Fair enough Floyd. I'm slow to catch up to the changing details. It was dusk, it was night...

I scrolled back and re-read my lead-off post. I have erred in not stating clearly that the conditions were complete darkness about 10 minutes after the very end of dusk. The moon was below the horizon and it was particularly dark that evening, although the sky was clear but for a few small puffs of clouds here and there.

...she was parked, she was driving. Bear with me.

Before the policewoman parked (with her engine idling, gearshift in PARK, and all lights momentarily turned off by turning the dial on the steering column all the way to the left) to "chit-chat" with the other cop, she arrived at the scene via driving in her cruiser. (NOTE to PS: Duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!)

...I wonder how you couldn't see the reflective material on the police car shining from the light of the police truck or your bike light. High beams in your face might explain that.

1. There was no reflective material on the cruiser.

2. The cruiser was behind the truck, it was positioned so that it was not exposed to any light rays from the police-truck's headlights.

Shortly before I reached the cops, I had passed an area where I happen to know that many deer cross the road at dusk (a deer "transit point", if you will).

This was about 800 feet from where the cops were parked. I yelled out my "deer warning" which consists of a few wooping type of yells and maybe a non-sensical word or two.

My theory is the policewomen heard my yell and were like, "What the hell was that?". Then the policewoman (whom I was about to run into a moment or two later) extinguished her lights, kind of like "James Bond - secret agent/SuperCop" mode.

Actually that's against protocol. In my town, when you see a lone cop doing a speed trap (there are a couple really regular spots in town), if you slow down and look, you'll see that they have their tail-lights/"marker lights" on, or even have the headlights on.

The concept is something like, "This is public safety. We're not hiding. We're sitting here patrolling the road. If you are drunk, or speeding, we're gonna get ya!"

This incident is very embarrassing for the cops. Basically, they were just goofing off and passing the time talking. (Something a lot of public employees do, but only when they think no one is watching.)

On the scene, just after I picked myself up off the pavement and spoke with the cop I hit, I realized right away that she was intending to dissemble and cover up the fact that she had no lights on whatsoever and had been momentarily parked in the middle of the roadway. It gave me a really sickening sort of feeling. That's why I immediately asked to make some sort of witness statement. She complied with that and handed me a paper form. It's in my legal files today, and was submitted to the town's insurance company, and clearly states what happened and that the cop was parked in the middle of the roadway in darkness with no lights on whatsoever.

 

[Floyd_MANZANO]

If you think he is full of sh*t then come out and say so. Get two cars and set this up yourself. Then you will know. In fact set it up so that you don't know if there is a second car there or not. I bet you will slow down and not blow through assuming that you can see in the dark.

I am really not taking sides but it is very plausible.

Huh? What the bleep are you saying? You need to come out and say so.

I did not "blow through", if that's what you are accusing me of. In fact, I decelerated and approached very cautiously, wondering why a vehicle was parked there after dark (quite unusual), concerned it might be boozing teenagers, and straining to see the roadway beyond the pair of headlights shining towards me. Earlier I was going about 10 mph (I actually see very well outside at night, and of course the small front bike-light helps, although it can't compare to automobile headlamps). As I approached the cops I slowed down even further to about 6-7 mph.

Cops are human and as such will behave like everyone else and may be quick to protect their asses from responsibility if they feel they messed up.

Yup! That's exactly what happened. Do you think that's okay??

BTW, let me state clearly again, if this policewoman even just had her tail-lights("marker lights") on like any normal motor vehicle operator at night (and which is THE LAW), I would have seen this cop from several hundred yards away, FOR SURE. She committed a very negligent and illegal act, and basically blindsided me. Again, if the rear of her vehicle was a police SUV or truck, rather than the sedan, there is about a 75% chance I would have been instantly killed (broken neck) or turned into a quadraplegic. IT IS A MIRACLE that I escaped serious injury, which I believed has to do with that "cat with 9 lives" effect elite athletes possess and also the cold (33 degrees F) temps in this case had a protective effect in terms of reducing physical blunt force trauma injury. Injuries, which I should note, were very real although not very serious or long-term. I was very sore all over and had a nasty whiplash/concussion kind of injury for over 1 month. Also, this accident seems to have permanently very slightly damaged my eyes and vision. (Hard to medically prove.)

 

[Floyd_MANZANO]

Sorry to hear of your accident - but there are a few parts I don't get.

The insurance company appear to admit that the incident took place "They say I was probably keeping my head down".
Why and how are they denying liability?

In her original report of the accident, the cop never affirmatively states that her "marker lights" and/or headlights were turned on. Her report states (dishonestly) that she was in DRIVE gear and had her foot on the brakes. Subsequently, she has claimed that all of her lights were on (total fabrication).

Given this perjurious testimony, the insurance company has an "out", whereby they can deny liability, essentially claiming that I negligently rode my bike into a police car that it was my responsibility to see.

The only thing I can think of is that the insurance company is refusing to pay because they believe you are making an exaggerated or excessive claim.

Nope. Are you stupid? Any claim is an excessive claim to an insurance company.

As someone suggested earlier - you need to record all 'evidence', fotos etc and also to show how much your bike was, have it valued and produce copies of receipts etc.

That's all been submitted to the insurance company months ago.

Bob Mionske said the only reason I haven't seen justice in this case is because the insurance company hasn't had a lawsuit filed against them yet. He told me that in this day and age, nobody pays unless they are forced to.

(NOTE: For those readers who don't know who Bob Mionske is, he is a former professional racer and also an attorney who claims to litigate on behalf of cyclists. Earlier in the thread is a posted link to his website.)

Yesterday I talked to an attorney who owns a relatively large law firm specializing in personal injury cases. If anyone knows how to handle this case, he does. He told me some interesting things. He said my current attorney is mishandling the case by billing me hourly. He said if a lawsuit was filed, the case would be relegated to pre-trial arbitration by the judge. He said there was a 90% chance I could gain at least 50% of my damages and claims (that would be about $5,000), subject to insurance company appeal and jury trial. He said if the case actually went to a trial, it would be my word against two cops' word. There is a significant chance I could lose the trial, believe it or not. He more or less turned down my case, saying that his firm could quite possibly take a loss in the thousands of dollars on the case.

This sh*t so ****es me off! I hope you dear readers are never in such a crap situation.

 

[pedaling squares]

You seem very skeptical and that is fine. If you think he is full of sh*t then come out and say so.

No, I'm not at the point of being skeptical and I don't think he's a liar. And I'm not a wallflower, when I have an opinion I tend to state it. I'm asking some questions because I think this may be an issue where he didn't do a great job explaining the situation to the insurance company and so didn't get the result he desired. When one asks questions on the internet some people assume you're taking an opposing view. Sometimes questions are just questions.

I scrolled back and re-read my lead-off post. I have erred in not stating clearly that the conditions were complete darkness about 10 minutes after the very end of dusk. The moon was below the horizon and it was particularly dark that evening, although the sky was clear but for a few small puffs of clouds here and there.

Ok. Got you now.

Before the policewoman parked (with her engine idling and all lights momentarily turned off by turning the dial on the steering column all the way to the left) to "chit-chat" with the other cop, she arrived at the scene via driving in her cruiser. (NOTE to PS: Duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!)

Duhhh?? Floyd, she didn't drive there with her lights off did she? Which is how the post I was responding to made it seem. Parking or driving - that was clearly my point. Duh indeed!

There was no reflective material on the cruiser.

Ok. A strange thing for an emergency vehicle. But it makes things more clear for me.

As I wrote previously, I suspect there may be some shared liability here as you've essentially said that you were riding on the left side of the lane instead of the right. That will depend on your traffic code I imagine. But clearly the police department is liable for parking in the middle of the road in the dark without lights. Their reasons for parking like that may be numerous, but none excuse them from this basic safety requirement.

You have already received the best advice you can get - get a lawyer to battle the insurance co or city. But my suggestion is to review your statements to the police and reports to the insurance co. If you used some terminology in there that you used in this thread you might have clouded your case. For example "It was just after dusk... she was parked with no lights... I rode in the middle of the road because I ignore that law... you know that all cops are liars." Someone reviewing that may think there was still sufficient ambient light, you chose to ride in a more dangerous spot, and you hold a grudge and a bias against the police that might affect the accuracy of your story. Before you get upset, know that I am not calling you a liar. I am pointing out that, IF written like that, the tone of your report MAY have led the insurance co to think that you had an axe to grind.

As for the police lying about the details, this is something that you should also pursue with their department. I truly don't believe that this minor mishap would have given the officer a "black mark" that could affect her in terms of promotion/pension. But lying certainly could, so it might be a tough fight to get her to change her story now that she's committed to it.

Good luck. And I hope you soon run into one of the numerous honest and decent police officers out there so your opinion of the profession can be improved.

 

[Floyd_MANZANO]

Thanks, PS, I needed that.

Oh, and just to clarify, here in New England police vehicles have no more reflective material than a standard-issue consumer automobile. They do have a mostly white, shiny paint job and those flashy lettering graphics on the sides.

 

[nowhereman]

What a strange way to ask for assistance.

Is that all you could cull from of this mans story? If so why did you bother responding? And if you know cops(which I somehow get the feeling you do) you know he's not far from the absolute truth. And given this mans situation, the frustration is not going to make him mince words, when he's encountered such despicable behaviour.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

In her original report of the accident, the cop never affirmatively states that her "marker lights" and/or headlights were turned on. Her report states (dishonestly) that she was in DRIVE gear and had her foot on the brakes. Subsequently, she has claimed that all of her lights were on (total fabrication).

Given this perjurious testimony, the insurance company has an "out", whereby they can deny liability, essentially claiming that I negligently rode my bike into a police car that it was my responsibility to see.



Nope. Are you stupid? Any claim is an excessive claim to an insurance company.



That's all been submitted to the insurance company months ago.

Bob Mionske said the only reason I haven't seen justice in this case is because the insurance company hasn't had a lawsuit filed against them yet. He told me that in this day and age, nobody pays unless they are forced to.

(NOTE: For those readers who don't know who Bob Mionske is, he is a former professional racer and also an attorney who claims to litigate on behalf of cyclists. Earlier in the thread is a posted link to his website.)

Yesterday I talked to an attorney who owns a relatively large law firm specializing in personal injury cases. If anyone knows how to handle this case, he does. He told me some interesting things. He said my current attorney is mishandling the case by billing me hourly. He said if a lawsuit was filed, the case would be relegated to pre-trial arbitration by the judge. He said there was a 90% chance I could gain at least 50% of my damages and claims (that would be about $5,000), subject to insurance company appeal and jury trial. He said if the case actually went to a trial, it would be my word against two cops' word. There is a significant chance I could lose the trial, believe it or not. He more or less turned down my case, saying that his firm could quite possibly take a loss in the thousands of dollars on the case.

This sh*t so ****es me off! I hope you dear readers are never in such a crap situation.

You stated you have injuries. Was medical assistance at the time of the incident sought by you or offered by the cops?

Do the police cars in your state have 'Dash-cams'?

You stated earlier it was a "quiet residential street" - have you gone back there and talked to any householders? 2 police vehicles parked on the road is always good viewing for a nosey neighbour.

What happened directly after the incident?

 

[Floyd_MANZANO]

You stated you have injuries. Was medical assistance at the time of the incident sought by you or offered by the cops?

Do the police cars in your state have 'Dash-cams'?

You stated earlier it was a "quiet residential street" - have you gone back there and talked to any householders? 2 police vehicles parked on the road is always good viewing for a nosey neighbour.

What happened directly after the incident?

1. I was taken to the hospital in an ambulance.

2. I called our PD. They said the cruisers have dashboard cams but they only come on when the overhead lights are flashing, you know, the lights and sirens that flash when the cops are trying to pull a law-breaking motorist over.

3. No, I haven't. This is not a bad idea but likely a futile effort. Will look into this with my attorney.

 

[Black Dog]

Huh? What the bleep are you saying? You need to come out and say so.

I did not "blow through", if that's what you are accusing me of. In fact, I decelerated and approached very cautiously, wondering why a vehicle was parked there after dark (quite unusual), concerned it might be boozing teenagers, and straining to see the roadway beyond the pair of headlights shining towards me. Earlier I was going about 10 mph (I actually see very well outside at night, and of course the small front bike-light helps, although it can't compare to automobile headlamps). As I approached the cops I slowed down even further to about 6-7 mph.




Yup! That's exactly what happened. Do you think that's okay??

BTW, let me state clearly again, if this policewoman even just had her tail-lights("marker lights") on like any normal motor vehicle operator at night (and which is THE LAW), I would have seen this cop from several hundred yards away, FOR SURE. She committed a very negligent and illegal act, and basically blindsided me. Again, if the rear of her vehicle was a police SUV or truck, rather than the sedan, there is about a 75% chance I would have been instantly killed (broken neck) or turned into a quadraplegic. IT IS A MIRACLE that I escaped serious injury, which I believed has to do with that "cat with 9 lives" effect elite athletes possess and also the cold (33 degrees F) temps in this case had a protective effect in terms of reducing physical blunt force trauma injury. Injuries, which I should note, were very real although not very serious or long-term. I was very sore all over and had a nasty whiplash/concussion kind of injury for over 1 month. Also, this accident seems to have permanently very slightly damaged my eyes and vision. (Hard to medically prove.)

I was talking to SP not you. I was defending your claim and a bit annoyed at the backhanded doubting of what you were saying. I was suggesting that if he thought you were full of BS he should say so and not dance around. Also, I was suggesting to him that he would not blow through if he thought there might be a car there just as you, no doubt, would not have done. Sorry if I gave you the impression that I was jumping on your back. What the police did is wrong and shows a real lack of basic character. I really hope that you can find some justice and if not at least some compensation. I would not hold your breath for the former and work hard for the latter.

 

[pedaling squares]

I was talking to SP not you. I was defending your claim and a bit annoyed at the backhanded doubting of what you were saying. I was suggesting that if he thought you were full of BS he should say so and not dance around.

I know you're writing about what you thought at the time, hopefully you have reviewed my posts in the interim and this is no longer the case. If not I would question your perception. You won't find any backhanded doubting nor dancing around in my posts. See post #15 - "... it sounds like he has a rightful claim", or post #27 "...I think there's a huge liability on behalf of the PD...", or post #42 "I don't think he's a liar". I've questioned him on some vague details and inconsistencies, and he's admitted to a lack of clarity in his first post. And of course I disagreed with his stance on all police officers being liars.

 

[Black Dog]

I know you're writing about what you thought at the time, hopefully you have reviewed my posts in the interim and this is no longer the case. If not I would question your perception. You won't find any backhanded doubting nor dancing around in my posts. See post #15 - "... it sounds like he has a rightful claim", or post #27 "...I think there's a huge liability on behalf of the PD...", or post #42 "I don't think he's a liar". I've questioned him on some vague details and inconsistencies, and he's admitted to a lack of clarity in his first post. And of course I disagreed with his stance on all police officers being liars.

I did read your posts I can see that you are not being backhanded. I see that you were trying to get at the details. It just came across as more cynical than skeptical. All is well, and I think that you cleared up your position and helped the OP clear up the details for us all. Not trying to stir the pot here and I too agree that not all police officers are pathological liars. They are us and we are them.