Effects of EPO-microdosing

Mar 4, 2010
1,826
0
0
in the Ashenden EPO microdose paper

1: Ashenden M, Gough CE, Garnham A, Gore CJ, Sharpe K. Current markers of the
Athlete Blood Passport do not flag microdose EPO doping. Eur J Appl Physiol. 2011
Sep;111(9):2307-14. Epub 2011 Feb 20. PubMed PMID: 21336951.

they came up with a regimen uv epo microdosing

that was not flagged on the biopassport software

yet still able to dramatically increase Hgb mass

ashenden was able to raise Hgb mass by 114 gm

10 %

the equivalent uv transfusing a full liter uv blood


n

all we got was

a bump uv

yawn

.9 gm/dL


What about retics?

aside from an inconsequential temporary bump

it [retics] hardly budges from baseline


in fact

the only tell in the whole process

may be just that

an overly stable retic
because...

as hgb mass starts to rise

natural epo is suppressed

and

natural epo fluctuation

contributes less and less to bone marrow stimulation

leaving the more constant

injected dose to stimulate the bone marrow

more consistently stimulated bone marrow

resulting in

a more stable retic
http://captaintbag.tumblr.com/post/33920095332/a-gt-epo-microdose-profile-simulated-from-ashenden
 
Mar 4, 2010
1,826
0
0
Coming off micro-dosing might be the best tell.

then after comming off epo

all that’s left is a suppressed natural epo

due to excess Hgb

resulting in a low retic
I'm guessing that micro-dosing year round would look rather iffy, with the abnormally stable retics and higher Hb-baseline.
 
Sep 29, 2012
12,197
0
0
Tyler'sTwin said:
I'm guessing that micro-dosing year round would look rather iffy, with the abnormally stable retics and higher Hb-baseline.
How expensive would it be to micro-dose year round?

In my research I read the following:

stimulated reticulocyte
with intense stimulation of erythropoiesis there is premature release of reticulocytes from the bone marrow into peripheral blood. These are larger and contain more reticulum than normal reticulocytes
Do you have any idea how much exo epo you need to take to trigger this state of "intense stimulation"? Given the body has an uncanny ability to enforce equilibrium, would it only take a little bit over the body's natural EPO production level perhaps?

Would it be possible to do a measure of these larger, reticulum-laden cells and do you think they would provide a possible marker for EPO use?
 
Sep 29, 2012
12,197
0
0
Apologies if my questions are dumb - I just find this interesting, have a passion for learning and honestly believe this stuff ain't rocket science.

And if it is rocket science, I honsetly believe I am capable of teaching myself how to build a rocket.
 
Dear Wiggo said:
How expensive would it be to micro-dose year round?

In my research I read the following:



Do you have any idea how much exo epo you need to take to trigger this state of "intense stimulation"? Given the body has an uncanny ability to enforce equilibrium, would it only take a little bit over the body's natural EPO production level perhaps?

Would it be possible to do a measure of these larger, reticulum-laden cells and do you think they would provide a possible marker for EPO use?
I would guess that intense stimulation would look a lot like an adaptation to altitude. I figure it would/is especially hard to differentiate between altitude and microdosing (or microdosing from clean), but depends on the context of your snippet I guess
 
Sep 29, 2012
12,197
0
0
More Strides than Rides said:
I would guess that intense stimulation would look a lot like an adaptation to altitude. I figure it would/is especially hard to differentiate between altitude and microdosing (or microdosing from clean), but depends on the context of your snippet I guess
So pretty much anything above baseline?
 
Oct 2, 2012
152
0
0
Abstract

The Athlete Blood Passport is the most recent tool adopted by anti-doping authorities to detect athletes using performance-enhancing drugs such as recombinant human erythropoietin (rhEPO). This strategy relies on detecting abnormal variations in haematological variables caused by doping, against a background of biological and analytical variability. Ten subjects were given twice weekly intravenous injections of rhEPO for up to 12 weeks. Full blood counts were measured using a Sysmex XE-2100 automated haematology analyser, and total haemoglobin mass via a carbon monoxide rebreathing test. The sensitivity of the passport to flag abnormal deviations in blood values was evaluated using dedicated Athlete Blood Passport software. Our treatment regimen elicited a 10% increase in total haemoglobin mass equivalent to approximately two bags of reinfused blood. The passport software did not flag any subjects as being suspicious of doping whilst they were receiving rhEPO. We conclude that it is possible for athletes to use rhEPO without eliciting abnormal changes in the blood variables currently monitored by the Athlete Blood Passport.
Hmm. I wonder if I could participate in their next research study.
 
Sep 29, 2012
12,197
0
0
Sarcastic Wet Trout said:
Hmm. I wonder if I could participate in their next research study.
Anyone within the age ranges / training mileage / VO2 limits typically can, but you sign (or should be required to indicate) you won't compete during and up to a certain period post-study.

Or was there another reason? ;)
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY