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Remco would've won the Giro, no matter the year: 2020, 2024, etc.
He's been in two and hasn't won either. Winning a Grand Tour like the Giro is undervalued; the Tour is more difficult, but the Giro doesn't depend solely on rivals, but also on illnesses caused by the Giro's climate (Remco knows this) and other factors.
Just ask Carapaz; before the 2022 Giro, nobody considered Hindley a better favorite than him.

Anyway, it seems Vingegaard will be there. I don't see him having any other chance against Vingegaard.

Giro is a rather strange Grand Tour with peculiar winners like Hesjedal, or even Hindley, who wasn't as much of a favorite as Carapaz.
Indeed, did anyone think Simon Yates would win another Grand Tour seven years after the Vuelta?
This year he wasn't even among the top 5 in the betting odds.
Aside from Pogacar and Vingegaard, the Giro can be quite unpredictable and full of surprises. Given recent winners like Hindley and Simon Yates, I wouldn't be so sure Remco would cruise through Italy without Vingegaard. For me Remco would be the favorite without Vingegaard, but I wouldn't consider it a surprise if he didn't win, just as I would consider it a surprise if Vingegaard didn't win without Pogacar.

Given the profile of some of the winners, I wouldn't rule out Lipowitz winning the 2026 Giro d'Italia if BORA ultimately sends him as their leader. He finished third in the Tour de France, but he's not a frequent winner, like Hindley or Simon, who hadn't won a lot races in recent years. I don't remember if Hindley has won more than 3 races since the Giro.
 
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@Berniece

Lets go one day at a time. Next challenge likely will be as one can't have such a big drop in climbing performance after those three names. So at least one more stellar climber will need to undertake the Tour. Eventually some potential names will start circulating and lets go on from there.
 
Sep 12, 2022
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@Berniece

Lets go one day at a time. Next challenge likely will be as one can't have such a big drop in climbing performance after those three names. So at least one more stellar climber will need to undertake the Tour. Eventually some potential names will start circulating and lets go on from there.
Other climbers are helpers
 
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I am not buying that at all. That si RBH as a team is (was) rather weak performing in terms of comparison to a team such as UAE. That puts their leader in a hard spot. But now they have half of the team capable of podium at the Tour, no need to cry about it any more. It seems that self sabotage or possibly ego is the only thing preventing them now on taking on Pogi and Jonas directly at the Tour. If they sort that one out i don't see on why in the 2026 season articles would still mock their chances and they would be lead proponents in B type polls on this forum. Not just the Tour, they need to stick it to UAE early in the season, to show them on how it's done a goal of 100 wins per season and counting, UAE failed at that goal this season.
I think you are exaggerating how much hurt RBH riders can put on Pogacar. Even if there was a double Jonas I'm not sure he could beat Pogi. Last year, when Lipowitz attacked in stage 10, Pogacar used that acceleration to actually attack and everyone (except Jonas) was immediately far far away, Lipowitz's attack looked like in slow motion compared to that. They have to be actually close in strength to present a threat, so far they aren't. And btw, while Pogacar as an individual might allow Lipowitz in the break, Vauquelin, Onley, Visma, UAE, certainly won't, just to name a few

Forget 100, maybe a realistic goal of 40 and 15 WT wins should be better
 
Jul 7, 2013
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Giro: Pellizari, Hindley
TDF: Evenepoel, Lipo, Roglic
Vuelta: Roglic

Do you think all the biggest GT guys will go to the Tour? Maybe it's better to have at least one of them in each GT. I'm not sure Pellizari & Hindley have enough quality (now) to win the Giro. For example Rogla to Giro+Vuelta while Hindley to Vuelta instead.
 
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Do you think all the biggest GT guys will go to the Tour? Maybe it's better to have at least one of them in each GT. I'm not sure Pellizari & Hindley have enough quality (now) to win the Giro. For example Rogla to Giro+Vuelta while Hindley to Vuelta instead.
Roglic doesn’t ride the tour for GC but stages and to help.

Roglic wants to ride the TDF
 
May 29, 2019
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Other climbers are helpers

I mean helpers. If they are nowhere near the front of the peloton after two thirds of a stage, consistently, then that isn't exactly helping. Better hence to risk it with another potential podium contender, or two.

I think you are exaggerating how much hurt RBH riders can put on Pogacar. Even if there was a double Jonas I'm not sure he could beat Pogi. Last year, when Lipowitz attacked in stage 10, Pogacar used that acceleration to actually attack and everyone (except Jonas) was immediately far far away, Lipowitz's attack looked like in slow motion compared to that. They have to be actually close in strength to present a threat, so far they aren't. And btw, while Pogacar as an individual might allow Lipowitz in the break, Vauquelin, Onley, Visma, UAE, certainly won't, just to name a few

Forget 100, maybe a realistic goal of 40 and 15 WT wins should be better

So you basically are agreeing with me that individual leader strategy for RBH is rather baseless as the outcome is likely known upfront. As for more genuine podium contenders being able to crack Pogi, working together and using some smart tactics to push Pogi out of his comfort zone, here i feel that of course it is possible. As for the wins, the beauty of it is most of it RBH will take from UAE and Visma so what more can you ask for.

Do you think all the biggest GT guys will go to the Tour? Maybe it's better to have at least one of them in each GT. I'm not sure Pellizari & Hindley have enough quality (now) to win the Giro. For example Rogla to Giro+Vuelta while Hindley to Vuelta instead.

They should if they aim to win it and even if they don't want to go i can't grasp on how either of them could dodge it.

Nothing will be different next year if Rogla goes to the Tour, contrary to what @Berniece hopes.

I mean all of them being there in great shape, that increases their chances to win it, forget about the other feasible options as it won't work.
 
Apr 3, 2009
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Do you think all the biggest GT guys will go to the Tour? Maybe it's better to have at least one of them in each GT. I'm not sure Pellizari & Hindley have enough quality (now) to win the Giro. For example Rogla to Giro+Vuelta while Hindley to Vuelta instead.
I don't think it's the most likely scenario, but seems possible. Roglic to Giro and Vuelta with Evenepoel/Lipo seems likely to me.
 
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I think you are exaggerating how much hurt RBH riders can put on Pogacar. Even if there was a double Jonas I'm not sure he could beat Pogi. Last year, when Lipowitz attacked in stage 10, Pogacar used that acceleration to actually attack and everyone (except Jonas) was immediately far far away, Lipowitz's attack looked like in slow motion compared to that. They have to be actually close in strength to present a threat, so far they aren't. And btw, while Pogacar as an individual might allow Lipowitz in the break, Vauquelin, Onley, Visma, UAE, certainly won't, just to name a few

Forget 100, maybe a realistic goal of 40 and 15 WT wins should be better
Of course. The only way having a multi-pronged attack helps is if a team attacks and makes Pogi follow repeatedly. Pretty hard to do on a 15 k col with UAE maxing everyone out at the front a la Postal/Sky.

The strongest rider generally wins the Tour. Almost always. By design.

RBH taking more than 1 top contender to any GT is a backup plan more than anything. Could cause some disruption on hilly stages, that would be interesting. But it all boils down to the big cols.
 
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Nothing will be different next year if Rogla goes to the Tour, contrary to what @Berniece hopes.
I think next year is different because the goal is different. If he feels Vuelta is his biggest goal and he wants to go further in his role as a mentor I wouldn’t be surprised he is fine with sometimes having a free role and going for a stage and other times fetching water bottles. It’s not like he has to set a high pace, Visma/UAE is already doing that.
 
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May 29, 2019
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@Berniece

It seems that your main worry is on who will fetch bottles.

@red_flanders

It was done to Pogi already successfully, on where your suggestion, on how a team like RBH should go with a single leader to the Tour. Even Visma stood no chance with such strategy in the 2025 season. Furthermore the idea that riders such as Rogla, Remco and Lipo can't apply systematic pressure and force Pogi out of his comfort zone through and through the stage(s), they can. For sure they can apply higher pressure then each of them individually ever could and on top of that they can crack UAE as a team if they choose so, individually such options are much more limited.

All in all Rogla and Lipo already expressed open attitude and desire to undertake Tour 2026. I am sure that Remco will announce that soon-ish too. The rest of the team needs to be solid, especially the climbing section, over there hence some work is still left to do.
 
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Jul 7, 2013
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@red_flanders

It was done to Pogi already successfully

Only because Vingegaard was actually stronger than Pogi in the Tour 2022 anyway. UAE and Visma will be killing climbs during mountain stages and it will be about survival for the rest. Sure, in some early stage one of BORA stars can attack from a long range: it will cause chaos but likely be a suicide attack.
 
Aug 13, 2011
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@Berniece

It seems that your main worry is on who will fetch bottles.

@red_flanders

It was done to Pogi already successfully, on where your suggestion, on how a team like RBH should go with a single leader to the Tour. Even Visma stood no chance with such strategy in the 2025 season. Furthermore the idea that riders such as Rogla, Remco and Lipo can't apply systematic pressure and force Pogi out of his comfort zone through and through the stage(s), they can. For sure they can apply higher pressure then each of them individually ever could and on top of that they can crack UAE as a team if they choose so, individually such options are much more limited.

All in all Rogla and Lipo already expressed open attitude and desire to undertake Tour 2026. I am sure that Remco will announce that soon-ish too. The rest of the team needs to be solid, especially the climbing section, over there hence some work is still left to do.
Who will go back to the team car, protect the other on flat stages, drop back and pull, etc. There are many issues you’re glossing over which is ironic since someone is very vocally not a fan of Roglic sharing leadership.

Pogacar got worked over by a super team and two riders close or better than him on a specific day. At this time all Visma or UAE have to do is up the pace to set up an attack and all of Bora’s helpers will be gone. The two teams literally have no care about anyone else because no one can match Pogacar or Vingegaard. Even a 30 minute lead from a breakaway might not be safe.
 
Apr 3, 2009
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@red_flanders

It was done to Pogi already successfully
Sure. Once, when he was less dominant.
on where your suggestion, on how a team like RBH should go with a single leader to the Tour.
I guess a language thing but this is a confusing sentence. I didn't suggest RBH go with a single leader, certainly not to the Tour. I said that having more than one leader is more a backup plan (Lipo there if Remco falters, etc.) than a plan to attack UAE repeatedly, but the latter could also come into play. As I mentioned, hilly stages might be a place for this. Maybe if you quoted what you're replying to, your comments might better incorporate what the other person said.
Even Visma stood no chance with such strategy in the 2025 season.
Correct. But they lost because Pog was so much stronger than Vingo, and no other reason.
Furthermore the idea that riders such as Rogla, Remco and Lipo can't apply systematic pressure and force Pogi out of his comfort zone through and through the stage(s), they can. For sure they can apply higher pressure then each of them individually ever could and on top of that they can crack UAE as a team if they choose so, individually such options are much more limited.
They can try. I'm skeptical it will make much difference with Pogi at the level he's at now. "Crack UAE as a team"? Not going to happen. Attack Pogi in certain tactical situations? They absolutely should try...as I said.
All in all Rogla and Lipo already expressed open attitude and desire to undertake Tour 2026. I am sure that Remco will announce that soon-ish too. The rest of the team needs to be solid, especially the climbing section, over there hence some work is still left to do.
Of course, everyone wants to go to the Tour. No decisions have been made publicly. Of course in addition to the top leaders, they need a couple more good climbers and a few good rouleurs. I'd be surprised if they brought 3 leaders to the Tour, but it's not impossible...as I said.
 
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He's been in two and hasn't won either. Winning a Grand Tour like the Giro is undervalued; the Tour is more difficult, but the Giro doesn't depend solely on rivals, but also on illnesses caused by the Giro's climate (Remco knows this) and other factors.
Just ask Carapaz; before the 2022 Giro, nobody considered Hindley a better favorite than him.

Anyway, it seems Vingegaard will be there. I don't see him having any other chance against Vingegaard.

Giro is a rather strange Grand Tour with peculiar winners like Hesjedal, or even Hindley, who wasn't as much of a favorite as Carapaz.
Indeed, did anyone think Simon Yates would win another Grand Tour seven years after the Vuelta?
This year he wasn't even among the top 5 in the betting odds.
Aside from Pogacar and Vingegaard, the Giro can be quite unpredictable and full of surprises. Given recent winners like Hindley and Simon Yates, I wouldn't be so sure Remco would cruise through Italy without Vingegaard. For me Remco would be the favorite without Vingegaard, but I wouldn't consider it a surprise if he didn't win, just as I would consider it a surprise if Vingegaard didn't win without Pogacar.

Given the profile of some of the winners, I wouldn't rule out Lipowitz winning the 2026 Giro d'Italia if BORA ultimately sends him as their leader. He finished third in the Tour de France, but he's not a frequent winner, like Hindley or Simon, who hadn't won a lot races in recent years. I don't remember if Hindley has won more than 3 races since the Giro.
I'd say the Giro is unpredictable for any contender unless the team has depth; the sort that take Yates for the win. IMO Lipowitz is more adept to the climate and tough climbs than Vindegaard. Yes; I think he can win it if he doesn't turn out to have the Giro/Tour straddle and lose focus.
Roglic riding that to provide the support alternative for Lipo would be exciting.
 
May 29, 2019
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I’m just saying what is most logical based on the latest interview Roglic gave

Leaders even gave bottles to doms to get over the hills a tad lighter so i feel that RBH has this one sorted out. That is one doesn't need to put any thought whatsoever into it from the perspective of somebody that has even a remote shot in GC.

Sure. Once, when he was less dominant.

Only because Vingegaard was actually stronger than Pogi in the Tour 2022 anyway. UAE and Visma will be killing climbs during mountain stages and it will be about survival for the rest. Sure, in some early stage one of BORA stars can attack from a long range: it will cause chaos but likely be a suicide attack.

Pogi won both the 2020 and the 2021 edition of the Tour so saying he wasn't dominant doesn't add up. When he was pushed out of his comfort zone, chasing down both Rogla and Jonas, that is what cracked him. Now RBH has three such riders and then some plus Jonas and Visma will for sure apply pressure too, among others. So just disregarding all this and believing Pogi can't struggle, fine, have such opinion but saying RBH sending one of them as a leader, possibly with a weak team, for that to be a better strategy, that is capitulating up front.

Who will go back to the team car, protect the other on flat stages, drop back and pull, etc. There are many issues you’re glossing over which is ironic since someone is very vocally not a fan of Roglic sharing leadership.

Pogacar got worked over by a super team and two riders close or better than him on a specific day. At this time all Visma or UAE have to do is up the pace to set up an attack and all of Bora’s helpers will be gone. The two teams literally have no care about anyone else because no one can match Pogacar or Vingegaard. Even a 30 minute lead from a breakaway might not be safe.

I am sure that some of you would like to keep RBH and their riders in such mindset. Forget it. Before season 2025 some even laughed when one mentioned they are third best team in GTs, and for the trajectory to climbing. Nobody is doing that any more, even before Remco signed, now more or less everybody accepts the fact that RBH can podium at the Tour if they so choose to, while yawning. I am sure that in 2026 season they will move up again and i am rather sure that they won't send a weak team to the Tour, especially not frighten one. I am sure that the mission will be to move up again and IMHO they will be successful at it.

Sure. Once, when he was less dominant.

I guess a language thing but this is a confusing sentence. I didn't suggest RBH go with a single leader, certainly not to the Tour. I said that having more than one leader is more a backup plan (Lipo there if Remco falters, etc.) than a plan to attack UAE repeatedly, but the latter could also come into play. As I mentioned, hilly stages might be a place for this. Maybe if you quoted what you're replying to, your comments might better incorporate what the other person said.

So basically we are saying the same thing it's you just have issues mentioning Rogla in the same scenario.

Correct. But they lost because Pog was so much stronger than Vingo, and no other reason.

So taking an individual approach is rather pointless indeed.

They can try. I'm skeptical it will make much difference with Pogi at the level he's at now. "Crack UAE as a team"? Not going to happen. Attack Pogi in certain tactical situations? They absolutely should try...as I said.

For sure RBH can now crack UAE, team vs team, that is if they do their due diligence, especially when it comes to roster selection and if they choose to.

Of course, everyone wants to go to the Tour. No decisions have been made publicly. Of course in addition to the top leaders, they need a couple more good climbers and a few good rouleurs. I'd be surprised if they brought 3 leaders to the Tour, but it's not impossible...as I said.

Exactly, they need to take the mentioned three riders plus some good climbers and of course somebody for the flats, or two. Basically they can't afford to split their best up and send them to different GTs, unless some do the Tour too. Main reason for it they now have a roster to compose one AAA team, they don't have enough riders of such calibre to form two such teams.

So bottom line, riders are free to choose their schedules but at the Tour the best ones will need to participate. And all please stop whining on how hard life is, as a rider riding for a super team at the Tour, that is the ultimate goal and not something one should be scared off. It pays well too.
 
May 29, 2019
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If by any chance this will continue, the naysayers attitude, maybe RBH can gift their riders a talisman to protect them, a small replica of a golden Pogi statue.
 
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Pogi won both the 2020 and the 2021 edition of the Tour so saying he wasn't dominant doesn't add up. When he was pushed out of his comfort zone, chasing down both Rogla and Jonas, that is what cracked him. Now RBH has three such riders and then some plus Jonas and Visma will for sure apply pressure too, among others. So just disregarding all this and believing Pogi can't struggle, fine, have such opinion but saying RBH sending one of them as a leader, possibly with a weak team, for that to be a better strategy, that is capitulating up front.

We are talking about 2022 here, not the previous two editions. Rogla helped with cracking Pogi during the Granon stage but the Slovenian never caused any troubles to Vingo in the mountains during that edition (and was dropped again on Hautacam). Vingo was better in 2022. One of BORA guys needs to be at about Pog's level for numbers game to play a factor.

Even in 2020-2021 there were some signs Pog can be beaten: he beat Rogla just by 1 minute in 2020 (and was dropped on Loze) plus Vingo dropped him on Ventoux in 2021. Now? Pogacar is light years ahead of BORA guys and drops them by minutes at will, even 8 Roglices won't help here unless one of them is suddenly very close to Pog level-wise next year. Vingegaard is a different story but even he has to make a considerable step forward to match Pog.
 
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