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Flat Stages: Why are they hated so fervently?

Aug 24, 2011
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After Mark Cavendishs win yesterday in Copenhagen I ventured onto these forums to see what forum-goers thought. That was my first mistake, many forum posters felt that the course was flat and that made it is a poor race, and ensured that a 'one-dimensional' sprinter like Cavendish would win over more 'well-rounded' riders. The vast majority of the criticism was heaped on it being a flat race but this is not the first time I've seen considerable criticism heaped on flat stages, so what is it about flat stages that makes everyone so angry?

I for one don't care that much for flat stages so much as deciding a leader in the GC, and while they're not that fun to watch until the last 5km or so I can see their merit in stage races, I am just curious about the hatred for them.
 
Multi-hour group parade as a prelude to a dangerous finale of sprinters who were helped to the end by their team.

On a loop circuit, it is a good show for spectators, and makes it easier for TV, etc.

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA
 
Mar 10, 2009
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266 km in 5:40? In a pack of 200 I am sure I can ride that pace for maybe 15 minutes and I know a few that can do that for an hour or maybe 2. This course was not hard but the race was. I think we often judge a course on how hard the terrain is and not on how the course was raced.
 
Well, another reason is that stages (or races) like this are generally boring to watch. You can skip all of it but the last 2km and not feel like you missed anything of significance.

Most fans would rather watch riders in groups, spread out, attacking, etc. than a race where you know you're going to get a massive peloton all finishing together.
 
Jul 14, 2009
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no selection, a big negative sit in. people chasing down a 20 second gap seen as heroic .I can't believe how happy I was when Voeckler and Sorensen rolled away
 
Flat stages have also become too controlled by the teams, look back at many so-called flat stages in GTs in the 80s and breakaway riders regularly won. That rarely happens anymore and the same yesterday at the Worlds. One super strong team controlled it from the beginning and the cousre was so weak it was almost impossible for a break to succeed. After my first few years following cycling, I quickly realised flat stages were boring as ****, now I might tune in for the last few km. Hey thats all you needed to watch yesterday.
 
pmcg76 said:
After my first few years following cycling, I quickly realised flat stages were boring as ****, now I might tune in for the last few km. Hey thats all you needed to watch yesterday.

This. I don't even watch flat stages in GTs anymore. I read the results afterward. If something interesting happened then I will watch the last part of the race. It has become garbage racing. What is more is that it is phony. The break of the day goes off, and the commentators spend the next few hours pretending that the break might succeed while knowing that the DSes are back in their cars radioing the pace required to catch the escapees in time for the wind up to the sprint. A race course without the opportunity cause a selection is not worth wasting time to watch.

Heads should roll at the UCI for allowing this year's crap WC course.
 
Apparently I'm not the typical cycling fan, or what.
I enjoy a sprint, especially the slow-motion afterwards when you know who won.
Needless to say that I cheer for the breakaway until they're caught.

I agree that flat stages/races are mostly boring, but they can be a nice "background noise".
 
Fus087 said:
Apparently I'm not the typical cycling fan, or what.
I enjoy a sprint, especially the slow-motion afterwards when you know who won.
Needless to say that I cheer for the breakaway until they're caught.

I agree that flat stages/races are mostly boring, but they can be a nice "background noise".

Like Muzak in an elevator. It's there but it's not...filler till something substantial takes place.
 
I kinda like all types of stages/races.

Sure, the year when a sprint stage was basically they race towards the finish for about 200 k, and in the end Mark Cavendish wins. was a little frustrating. Cavendish isn't always a factor and he actual can get beaten fair and square in a sprint.
 
In a flat stage I like the start, loads of riders trying to get into the breakaway. Once the breakaway has formed, not a lot happens until the pretty much inevitable catch. Sprints are generally pretty cool though.

In the mountains, you are much more likely to get counter attacks and even if it is a relatively dull stage (like the Vuelta MTFs with headwinds), the scenery makes up for it.
 
Oct 29, 2009
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Flat stages are typically boring and predictable, but the final kms are by far the most exciting part of bike racing. I'd rather watch a hotly contested field sprint (with or without a lead-out) for about ten seconds than the queen stage of any GT. Something about a mass of people accelerating to 80km/h that is far more exciting than watching a bunch of 130 pounders climbing at about 20 to maybe 25 km/h. Especially considering the selection on the climb is pretty much decided early on. Watching 200 riders chase a break is just boring as watching 3-5 riders chase a spaniard :rolleyes:
 
Mar 10, 2009
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Well I think the Worlds course should always be varied year to year and having a flat race course this year was good to highlight the sprinters in the pelOton. Next year, hopefully it will be hilly or more technical highlighting a climber or a rouler. There is no one course profile to be suitable to all riders every year so gotta vary it to showcase a different specialty each year.

Now why hasn't there been an uphill ITT for worlds? Or a super technical one where maybe a TT bike might not be suitable? We've seen technical and uphill TT courses in the GT's so why not worlds? (I won't go into a downhill TT for the fear of the downhill backlash, or did I just :p)
 
I have to admit, I enjoyed this flat course far more than I do most pan-flat races.

The tactics of what they were going to do to try and beat GB .... the Belgians and Aussies and French tried a lot during the race - and the British team still managed to prevail. It was a lot better than most flat stages.

BUT - it was still a long way from an entertaining race.
 
Oct 29, 2009
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AussieGoddess said:
I have to admit, I enjoyed this flat course far more than I do most pan-flat races.

The tactics of what they were going to do to try and beat GB .... the Belgians and Aussies and French tried a lot during the race - and the British team still managed to prevail.

If Roux had anything left, Voeckler could have pulled off something magical. If there is one thing more exciting than a field sprint, it's when someone gets away right at the end.
 
Aug 24, 2011
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ImmaculateKadence said:
If Roux had anything left, Voeckler could have pulled off something magical. If there is one thing more exciting than a field sprint, it's when someone gets away right at the end.

I was really quite pleased when Voeckler and a few others were getting away, and he was definitely burying himself, it's a shame really that after his sterling performance at the TFD that he didn't get a podium spot, still, I'm sure he'll have his moment when a more 'universal' course features in the worlds.
 
Oct 6, 2010
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I don't really like flat stages as i like to watch the field really split up and everyone race hard. Not just riding in a large group. Although i enjoy the sprint at the end greatly the rest of the flat stage is just boring.
 
May 14, 2010
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Master50 said:
266 km in 5:40? In a pack of 200 I am sure I can ride that pace for maybe 15 minutes and I know a few that can do that for an hour or maybe 2. This course was not hard but the race was. I think we often judge a course on how hard the terrain is and not on how the course was raced.

Exactly. It's the racers who make the race. That's the Alpha and Omega of cycling.

BroDeal said:
This. I don't even watch flat stages in GTs anymore. I read the results afterward. If something interesting happened then I will watch the last part of the race. It has become garbage racing. What is more is that it is phony. The break of the day goes off, and the commentators spend the next few hours pretending that the break might succeed while knowing that the DSes are back in their cars radioing the pace required to catch the escapees in time for the wind up to the sprint. A race course without the opportunity cause a selection is not worth wasting time to watch.

Heads should roll at the UCI for allowing this year's crap WC course.

I despise the UCI, but I've got to hand it to them for trying to ban team radios, for it's the radios that have really compromised this sport. Things will become more exciting once the radios are gone.

Does the OP really want the truth? The truth is (lean closer) . . . a lot of people, especially mainland Euros, are prejudiced against the Brits, and especially against our man from the Isle of Man . . . but they can't admit it to themselves . . . or not to us, at least, so they grouse about a flat course, and how it's unbecoming a World's race. Whatever.

Some races have to be on the flat. That's just cycling. There's all kinds of strategy and tactics and deal making and attacks and team trains and so on to enjoy in flat racing. As mentioned above, racing, especially racing on the flats, has been emasculated by radio, but hopefully this will change soon. The big payoff for flat races is the sprint at the end, which is usually very dramatic and sometimes almost heart stopping.
 
Jul 17, 2009
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BroDeal said:
This. I don't even watch flat stages in GTs anymore. I read the results afterward. If something interesting happened then I will watch the last part of the race. It has become garbage racing. What is more is that it is phony. The break of the day goes off, and the commentators spend the next few hours pretending that the break might succeed while knowing that the DSes are back in their cars radioing the pace required to catch the escapees in time for the wind up to the sprint. A race course without the opportunity cause a selection is not worth wasting time to watch.

Heads should roll at the UCI for allowing this year's crap WC course.

I am with you all the way on this one bro.

why not just have a mass start 100 yard sprint from a track stand.
 
Jul 20, 2011
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I guess the point is a more decisive course means the race is harder for one team to control.

So the long breakaway may actually stand a chance of staying away (maybe not but the chances increase)

or all the breakaways may be chased back and we have a sprint

or the strongest riders will attack on the climb 15km for the finish and try to hold on

or the not so fast guys that know they cannot stay with the previous groups will go one lap earlier and hope the chase gets it wrong

in reality with the strength of various teams a lot of races become more predictable. if there had been a steep climb on the course would we not have just seen belgium controlling things and a predicable attack from gilbert? the more challenging the course the more options there are the more reason to watch more of the race.

having said that i loved watching the worlds this year but purely for nationalistic reasons
 
A lot depends on what attributes you want/expect from the riders.

- overall cycling ability, or specialized strength & skill
- individual self-controlled tactics, or 'managed' riding
- cut-throat 'racing' tactics, or 'who is strongest'
- having good luck, about e.g. pavement, spectator, route marking, equipment, etc. problems

The TEAMs are most concerned with having their JERSEY win - they don't care much who is wearing it.
The 'team strategy' is designed for that result.

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA
 
Maxiton said:
Exactly. It's the racers who make the race. That's the Alpha and Omega of cycling.
I think it depends. The racers can certainly make what is a good race on paper into a bad one, but their ability to make a bad race on paper good is limited. There often needs to be some kind of spark to create that, be it weather, a crash, an unusual GC situation (see stage 12 of the 2010 Giro), or something in the roadbook. But if those bits that are open to chance (wind, rain) don't arise, and the roadbook doesn't offer anything to be used as a spark, it's nigh on impossible for the riders to make the race unless they make up the majority, because the sprinters' teams have become too good at controlling.



I despise the UCI, but I've got to hand it to them for trying to ban team radios, for it's the radios that have really compromised this sport. Things will become more exciting once the radios are gone.

Does the OP really want the truth? The truth is (lean closer) . . . a lot of people, especially mainland Euros, are prejudiced against the Brits, and especially against our man from the Isle of Man . . . but they can't admit it to themselves . . . or not to us, at least, so they grouse about a flat course, and how it's unbecoming a World's race. Whatever.
Yea, that's right. It's all about nationality. Nothing to do with entertainment. It's all the mainland Euros hating the Brits.

This sounds awfully like the LA "French conspiracy". If there was a mainland European conspiracy against the Brits they would have changed the Worlds course to stop the most likely British winner from winning.

I don't like flat stages cos they're boring. I used to find the stages boring, but quite enjoy the sprint itself. But after long periods subjected to the HTC train of domination, be it leading the best sprinter in the world in the top races, or leading Greipel in races that his talent level had far outgrown because Cavendish was already racing the biggest events, it became predictable.

I quite enjoyed watching the sprints when Cavendish was off form or when his leadout train was non-existent. The races were still dull (Aubenas and San Remo excepted!) but the sprint was more fun. Cavendish often still wins, but it's much more exciting to watch riders fending for themselves).

I guess the thing is, the less organised a race is, the more likely the unexpected is to happen. And many people watch with the aim of being entertained, and watching the same thing happen over and over again stops being entertaining quicker than watching different things happen. Look at the hostility Gilbert has started to face for his domination of the hilly races. But at least those races give some different and sometimes unexpected routes to get to that predictable conclusion of Gilbert soloing away to the finish; all too often the bunch sprint stages run to an exact and repetitive formula before the predictable conclusion of Cavendish winning by a couple of lengths or more.

And when it all runs to the same formula, and the end result is the same, then it's only really fun if you like the guy who's winning. It's like all the people (including myself) who switched off from F1 when the sport basically consisted of "the lights go out, and everybody follows Michael Schumacher for two hours". Either you liked Schumacher or you got bored.
 
It's a Format Problem

I'll add to the chorus of people lamenting the abuse of race radios on flatter stages. That's half the problem with flatter race courses.

The other half of the problem is the format of Worlds. One winner at the end of the last lap. Change the race format! Have a big-money points competition and/or a points race title inside the event. That should mix things up a little. Especially if they got rid of radios.

Be fair to all of the riders though. That distance is just plain hard.
 
DirtyWorks said:
The other half of the problem is the format of Worlds. One winner at the end of the last lap. Change the race format! Have a big-money points competition and/or a points race title inside the event. That should mix things up a little. Especially if they got rid of radios.

They didn't have radios during the worlds...