Gilbert V Cancellara - who is the best one day rider of this generation?

[Froome19]

Phillipe Gilbert:
National Road Race Championship (2011) National Time Trial Championship (2011) Amstel Gold Race (2010, 2011) Brabantse Pijl (2011) Clásica de San Sebastián (2011) Liège–Bastogne–Liège (2011) Giro del Piemonte (2009, 2010) Giro di Lombardia (2009, 2010) Grand Prix Cycliste de Québec (2011) La Flèche Wallonne (2011) Omloop Het Nieuwsblad (2006, 2008) Paris–Tours (2008, 2009)

Vs
Fabian Cancellara:
World Time-Trial Champion (2006, 2007, 2009, 2010) National Time Trial Championships (2002, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008.) National Road Race Championships (2009, 2011) Olympic Time-Trial Champion (2008) Paris–Roubaix (2006, 2010) Ronde van Vlaanderen (2010) Milan – San Remo (2008) E3 Prijs Vlaanderen (2010, 2011)

to name only a few...
These 2 riders currently dominate the one day scene and though Gilbert may win more, when it comes to the races where it really matters Cancellara is also as strong as anybody and his TT gives him a boost over Gilbert, especially as through it he has been crowned multiple World Champion.

 

[Caruut]

Do those TT results really belong here?

 

[Froome19]

Do those TT results really belong here?

They are one day races technically and were under the one day section from where I copied it from, but yeh I get youre point...

 

[Richeypen]

Cancellara by a mile for me.


I fully expect Fabian to leadthis poll until right near the end where Gillbert will jump out from behind him and win.


Interesting both have 5 Monument podiums to add to that list as well, although Fab also has a ORR silver medal.

 

[Panda Claws]

Philippe Gilbert has podiums in 4 of the 5 monuments.
Fabian Cancellara has won 3 of them but hasn't even top-10'd in the other 2.

If we look at the smaller one-day races Gilbert is also more versatile and more dominant.

So, Phil wins this one but it is very equally matched.

Also since 2009:

Philippe Gilbert has ridden 12 Monuments and won 3 of them.
Fabian Cancellara has ridden 9 Monuments and won 2 of them.

Again, they are very equally matched.
Still Gilbert is more versatile and wins more smaller one-day races.

Because ultimately if we are only going to look at monument wins we could almost include Oscar Freire in this poll.

 

[Froome19]

Cancellara by a mile for me.


I fully expect Fabian to leadthis poll until right near the end where Gillbert will jump out from behind him and win.

I think people just take Gilbet's wins in hilly races a lot for granted as thats now what they expect. To dominate LBL and Lombardia totally (when on good form) is truly something and people tend to underestimate it, just because they overlap a lot, generally on Cancellara terrain maybe people think Canc has the edge but in races like AGR Gilbert smashes canc every time whilst people dont even take notice.

(though i still voted for cancellara)

 

[Richeypen]

I think people just take Gilbet's wins in hilly races a lot for granted as thats now what they expect. To dominate LBL and Lombardia totally (when on good form) is truly something and people tend to underestimate it, just because they overlap a lot, generally on Cancellara terrain maybe people think Canc has the edge but in races like AGR Gilbert smashes canc every time whilst people dont even take notice.

(though i still voted for cancellara)

The WRR that Cadel won was a very hilly course yet Canc was clearly the strongest (in fact one of the strongest performances I can remember). Not belitterling Gilbert but when Fab dominates no one comes close (Roubaix '10, E3 last year as prime examples), Gilbert is reliant on the hills in order to attack. Not belittling him as he is obviously a supreme athlete, Canc is just head and shoulders above everyone else though.

 

[burning]

Gilbert's variety of races that he can more wider compared to Canc's, so I vote for him

 

[Richeypen]

Gilbert's variety of races that he can more wider compared to Canc's, so I vote for him

How so? If the hill isnt there Gilbert can't win. Think he will ever win Roubaix? Canc will never win LBL but if he wanted to it would be very hard to stop him at Lombardia. Canc can win flat races, cobbled races, moderatly hilly races, TTs etc. If there isnt a hill, Gilbert can do squat in the big races.

 

[Swede1]

Well its obviously Cancellara overall. He has also been much more consistent over the course of his career. I think if cancellara focused only on the ardennes next year he would be very competitive.

 

[burning]

He sprinted quite a bit in TDF flat stages, so I think he can do well in complete flat courses too.
And nearly every big one day race has some hills here or there, I can only find Roubaix without hills.
And for example, there is no way that Canc can win FW or AGR.

 

[Froome19]

How so? If the hill isnt there Gilbert can't win. Think he will ever win Roubaix? Canc will never win LBL but if he wanted to it would be very hard to stop him at Lombardia. Canc can win flat races, cobbled races, moderatly hilly races, TTs etc. If there isnt a hill Gilbert can do squat. in the big races.

Not really
a) These days more of the high profile classics have hills than not
b) if totally flat then it goes to cav or one of his mates, its only on a cobbles race or a hilly flat race where Canc wins.

 

[Richeypen]

Not really
a) These days more of the high profile classics have hills than not
b) if totally flat then it goes to cav or one of his mates, its only on a cobbles race or a hilly flat race where Canc wins.

Your argument makes no sense. The amount of races is irrelevant, I was responding to a comment which said that Gilbert can win more types of races which is plainly wrong. A quick look at each riders' palmares makes that clear.

 

[cineteq]

Sorry can't compare apples and oranges.

 

[Panda Claws]

All this talk about Cancellara having the potential to win Hilly races.

Besides Montepaschi he hasn't won any of them.
Milan-Sanremo doesn't qualify as hilly and Ronde Van Vlaanderen has cobbles.
It's easy to claim that Cancellara could win Lombardia but he hasn't done anything there yet.

Gilbert on the other hand has finished 52th in Paris-Roubaix.

That is of course no result either but:

a) It was in 2007 with a Philbert that could never hope to follow the one we have now.
b) Cancellara has never ridden Lombardia nor LBL. He might finish 20th, he might finish 90th we don't know.


Also, about Cancellara winning more dominantly. This might be true but keep in mind that Cancellara TRIES to win as impressive as possible due to his "I am a gladiator" mentality.

When Gilbert goes all-out we get some impressive stuff too.

FW 2011: Gilbert leaves everyone standing with the fastest ascent of the Mur ever even though the Mur wasn't raced hard for the first half and he celebrated the last 50 metres.

LBL 2011: The pace is so high that the only ones that can follow Gilbert are the Schlecks. These two can't even attack because they are in the red just by following him.

GDL 2010: Gilbert can do Cancellara-like solos as well, if he is on hilly terrain. Then again Cancellara needs cobbles too.


Gilbert challenges Cancellara on his terrain when Cancellara can do the same on Phil's terrain then we can talk again.

 

[Froome19]

Your argument makes no sense. The amount of races is irrelevant, I was responding to a comment which said that Gilbert can win more types of races which is plainly wrong. A quick look at each riders' palmares makes that clear.

Sorry i interpreted his question differently.

 

[luckyboy]

Gibert isn't gonna win Roubaix, likewise Cancellara with Lombardia/Ardennes.
They are too different to really compare properly.

Can't see Gilbert winning Ronde to be honest - he's not going to hold a solo, even less chance this year, and coming home in a group without a sprinter (or someone stronger in the sprint than him) will need luck.
Still, there's more chance he'll win Ronde one day than Roubaix.

 

[Richeypen]

Sorry i interpreted his question differently.

Reading it back it is definitely open to interpretation. Personal though I see 'wider variety of races' as meaning more different types of races.

 

[DominicDecoco]

Obviously both brilliant riders.

I chose Fabi since, besides his wins in major races, he is also such an important rider for his team. Make it TTT, flat, descending, winds or mountains to some extend. When Fabi has no chance of winning he can still be one of the best and most important riders in a race. He's in many ways the perfect rider. I don't think Gilbert is.

Consistency wise Fabian takes it too.

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

Well its obviously Cancellara overall. He has also been much more consistent over the course of his career. I think if cancellara focused only on the ardennes next year he would be very competitive.

that plus Canc has been doing it at a high level for longer is why I voted Canc.

 

[Richeypen]

Gilbert challenges Cancellara on his terrain when Cancellara can do the same on Phil's terrain then we can talk again.

2009 WRR. Canc's performance there was unbelievable and on a climbers course with the worlds best climbers he was far and away the strongest.


Whenever one of these 'greatest ever' threads come along it seems to be taken that if you side with one it is a direct attack against the other. As I have said previously I think Gilbert is a great rider. Canc however has shown his ability in more races and over a longer timeframe, he is just a beast of a rider.

 

[Froome19]

that plus Canc has been doing it at a high level for longer is why I voted Canc.

Yet Gilbert seems to be much more competitive over different races and he gets better results.

Lets put the question this way..
Who would you bet on to get more CQ points in the one day races this year?

 

[Richeypen]

Yet Gilbert seems to be much more competitive over different races and he gets better results.

Lets put the question this way..
Who would you bet on to get more CQ points in the one day races this year?

Thats a completely different question and a pretty unfair comparison (especially in an Olympic year)

 

[pmcg76]

Philippe Gilbert has podiums in 4 of the 5 monuments.
Fabian Cancellara has won 3 of them but hasn't even top-10'd in the other 2.

If we look at the smaller one-day races Gilbert is also more versatile and more dominant.

So, Phil wins this one but it is very equally matched.

Also since 2009:

Philippe Gilbert has ridden 12 Monuments and won 3 of them.
Fabian Cancellara has ridden 9 Monuments and won 2 of them.

Again, they are very equally matched.
Still Gilbert is more versatile and wins more smaller one-day races.

Because ultimately if we are only going to look at monument wins we could almost include Oscar Freire in this poll.

+1 Agree

I think Gilbert can and has contended in most of the classics bar Paris-Roubaix. He has been up there in M-SR, Flanders, F-W, L-B-L, AMR, Paris-Tours, Lombardy, even San Sebastian. He would have dominated the old World Cup.

Cancellara is equally as strong, more so on cobbles but seems to have less variation in his palmares, I actually believe he could well in races outside of the cobbled classics and M-SR but chooses not to.

Slight edge to Gilbert.

 

[Froome19]

Thats a completely different question and a pretty unfair comparison (especially in an Olympic year)

Is it? I am basically just asking who do you think will get better one day results this year?
If you get better results it generally means you are a better rider.