Has Armstrong changed the sport?

[BroDeal]

Through those years, there are plenty of folks who complete two GT's and race a host of Spring races.

Guys like Jalabert, Boogerd, Moreau, Verbrugge, Zulle, Bartoli, Bettini, etc.

Comments as to the cleanliness of the above are not necessary, the obvious needs to detail.

I think the doping makes it more possible to do a full season.

With EPO, yeah, but not if your main doping product technique is blood transfusions.

 

[Benotti69]

..
I agree that Greg was the template, and as a pioneer of many things in professional racing, his impact is undebatable (at least, you won't find one with me).

If Lance did anything, it was to forgo much of the euro-centric, cycle racing culture traditions by totally focusing on the Tour and maximizing his own branding in a far more efficient manner. Adding the cancer story, comeback, and winning the Tour, also part of the template, outshined Greg's similar experience.

......

i think that LA is not the brains behind it all, i think others are, Weisel, Carmichael, Ochowitz etc and i reckon they figured that if LeMond could have won another TdF in 1991 it would have been huge for the guy, coming back from his injury and they twigged if LA could do the same it could go global and they put all their eggs into that basket, cyclist cured from cancer comes back and wins the TdF, the hardest endurance event and the biggest annual event in the world, and then again and again and again etc......

I wonder how much of LA is owned by others, or was, maybe he got himself out of those deals????

 

[DirtyWorks]

Stop the Bus!

According to that chart, it increased roughly 20% since 2000, worldwide. I'm not sure you can attribute increased bike sales in countries other than the U.S. to Armstrong. However, I have no doubt that Armstrong's success was the number one factor boosting sales of Trek in the U.S. (although that has certainly tapered in the last few years with the success of Specialized and Cervelo).

You can't reasonably associate Lance, (or LeMond, or Hinault, or ...) with the growth in the production of bicycles.

There's plenty to doubt when making associations like Armstrong == More_bikes. Most people buying bikes from a shop don't know who the faces are on some of the posters on the walls, nor do they care. They have a price/feature set matrix in their head to which they come to a purchase decision. A cyclist they might have heard about has nothing to do with it.

If these fabled sales happened in the U.S. there would have been other industry effects like more stores, more brands, etc. As it is, the same old bike brand-churn is still happening.

Trek did a decent job of marketing to shops and forcing other brands out of their best customer's retail locations. *That* was Trek's 'number one factor' for growth.

Finally, average cost of making a bicycle has declined dramatically over that time period. There's your #1 reason why there are more bicycles sold over that time period.

Important note: more bikes sold does not translate into more kilometers ridden. The non-profit is using the factoid to influence policy makers.

===In Other News...===

I too wonder what Weisel, Stapleton and others piece of the action was. I don't have any hope USAC would become any more transparent. The details of the many conflicts of interest at the executive level of USAC and their cuts of the money fronted by the organizers when a UCI field visits the U.S. (Tour of Cali anyone?) would be fun reading.

More popular outrage would come from the backdoor deals surrounding livestrong.(com/org)

 

[Big Doopie]

Through those years, there are plenty of folks who complete two GT's and race a host of Spring races.

Guys like Jalabert, Boogerd, Moreau, Verbrugge, Zulle, Bartoli, Bettini, etc.

Comments as to the cleanliness of the above are not necessary, the obvious needs to detail.

I think the doping makes it more possible to do a full season. The doping is also necessary to win a GT. I think it comes down to risk management. Too many exposures to tests, too many people shuttling blood and product around, too many people involved, etc.

excellent points. i would say that when they could depend solely on epo, then they could ride more. but now that the emphasis is on blood doping, it is harder. in 2005, armstrong raced a ridiculous few amount of days before the tour and then pulverized ullrich in the opening prologue. totally unbelievable. the interesting thing when you compare before 1991 and after is that being correctly "prepped" for a race means something completely different. while race miles were necessary to achieve optimum ability before, now it was more about when the rider was clinically prepped. only then he could compete at the highest level. the best example is ullrich being dropped in the first 50 km of one of the ardennes classics by the entire peloton and only a few weeks later tearing up the mountains of the tour de suisse or winning the ITT in the tour of italy.

blood doping is amazingly enhancing when it comes to bicycle racing.

 

[sartain]

Impact yes, but, only for the worse.

He did bring private jet travel to the sport. As for male athletes getting women pregnant out of wed-lock, he has hardly been a trend setter.

 

[Benotti69]

.... As for male athletes getting women pregnant out of wed-lock, he has hardly been a trend setter.

he is trying his best though, only needs another 5..

 

[flicker]

While some century events are drawing as many or more than they did in the late 80s many have disappeared..I see some regular group rides from a shop nearby but there are far fewer people out riding in the same places that were popular in the 80s.. On a local bike trail there used to be perhaps 30 or 40 riders with serious bikes and kits on a 5 mile stretch. I've been there a few times recently and only seen half a dozen or so. It looks like the local trek store sells a dozen 8000 dollar madones a year.. That only accounts for 2 lance teammate/mancrush/Lance kitted team time trial poser a-clown groups looking for someone on a schwinn they can drop. Maybe Lance gets more cyclists to buy some michilobs...Nothing else good as far as I can see.

I sold all my madones for beer money and an e machine to write this love letter...

 

[flicker]

i think that LA is not the brains behind it all, i think others are, Weisel, Carmichael, Ochowitz etc and i reckon they figured that if LeMond could have won another TdF in 1991 it would have been huge for the guy, coming back from his injury and they twigged if LA could do the same it could go global and they put all their eggs into that basket, cyclist cured from cancer comes back and wins the TdF, the hardest endurance event and the biggest annual event in the world, and then again and again and again etc......

I wonder how much of LA is owned by others, or was, maybe he got himself out of those deals????

B. 69, you are one of the few on the forum who understand pro cycling. Chapaue!

 

[Oldman]

B. 69, you are one of the few on the forum who understand pro cycling. Chapaue!

Yeah, we agree on this one. Lance wasn't a genius; he wanted what he wanted and was a toy for Weisel and a vehicle for Eddie B, Jiri Mainus, Ferrari (oh, yes, they want what Ferrari sells), Och, Carmichael, Merckx, USACycling (and friends), UCI, Patrick MacQuaid and immediate family, Vs (and babbling synchophants), Trek, Nike, SRAM, Budweiser, Nissan, etc. Lance oversold his image and all of these folks will sell his now skinny, old a*s down the river. His big mistake was believing in his own hype-that's called smoking your own dope in the trade. Ask his old girlfriends how that toke smells.

 

[bianchigirl]

Yeah, we agree on this one. Lance wasn't a genius; he wanted what he wanted and was a toy for Weisel and a vehicle for Eddie B, Jiri Mainus, Ferrari (oh, yes, they want what Ferrari sells), Och, Carmichael, Merckx, USACycling (and friends), UCI, Patrick MacQuaid and immediate family, Vs (and babbling synchophants), Trek, Nike, SRAM, Budweiser, Nissan, etc. Lance oversold his image and all of these folks will sell his now skinny, old a*s down the river. His big mistake was believing in his own hype-that's called smoking your own dope in the trade. Ask his old girlfriends how that toke smells.

And let's not forget Verbruggen.

Haven't read this thread so hoping the high cadence bollox has been laid to rest - unless Charly Gaul changed his name, dropped a shedload of pounds (and years) and changed his name?

Problem for the UCI is they put all their eggs in the Armstrong basket instead of bothering to grow interest in all aspect of the sport. Now he leaves and takes his fans with him and instead of having a robust sport with a governing body that is fair and objective, we have a failing sport with a governing body that is weak and ineffective, its future bound up with that of one rider. That is Armstrong's legacy - to have made a shambles of the way the sport is run and to have encouraged divisiveness in the way the sport is viewed (TdF uber alles). Might benefit him (and all the others who are invested in the cash cow) but aint great for the sport

 

[marinoni]

And let's not forget Verbruggen.

Haven't read this thread so hoping the high cadence bollox has been laid to rest - unless Charly Gaul changed his name, dropped a shedload of pounds (and years) and changed his name?

Problem for the UCI is they put all their eggs in the Armstrong basket instead of bothering to grow interest in all aspect of the sport. Now he leaves and takes his fans with him and instead of having a robust sport with a governing body that is fair and objective, we have a failing sport with a governing body that is weak and ineffective, its future bound up with that of one rider. That is Armstrong's legacy - to have made a shambles of the way the sport is run and to have encouraged divisiveness in the way the sport is viewed (TdF uber alles). Might benefit him (and all the others who are invested in the cash cow) but aint great for the sport

TdF uber alles indeed. It's gotten so bad that I often hear in the general media, the sport being called Tour de France. Not cycling or bike racing, just Tour de France. Some people have pointed out that he is the reason we here in North America get to watch 3-4 hrs of live coverage. I would point out that he is also the reason why OLN in Canada recently announced they would no longer be showing the race next year. It wouldn't surprise me if the same thing happens in the US.