How has Lance kept everyone quiet for this long?

[cleanmarine]

How has LA been able to keep everyone involved silenced for this long? Is he that much of a force that he can intimidate for silence. Or maybe he has something on everyone and that has always been his tactic. Notice how guys leave his team and get busted shortly there after? Does his influence go to the very top? UCI is bought?

 

[Hillavoider]

this is the ultimate question, the only answer i can think of is that everyone is doping, even pat mcquiad is doping

also, i often think, what a horrible existence to have a double life

 

[BikeCentric]

It's simple really, it's in everyone's benefit who makes a living off the sport to clam up and keep the charade going. Why do you think Omerta persists even now? Most within the sport think the dope makes the racing better for the fans and the riders feel they need it since competition is on it.

I think this time they're all about to find out how wrong they were.

 

[stephens]

Usually we dismiss people who speak of aliens at area 51 or faked moon landings by using the logic that it would be impossible for those claims to be true because someone the cover up would have been impossible to contain.

so... if as many people are involved as believed by some members here, someone would have indeed talked by now. if lance is doping, and of course that's likely because they are almost all surely doping, then it is done on the down low. it can't possibly be the systematic team run doping programs that are posited here. someone would have talked long ago and disgruntled ex employees of every team would be dropping bombs about programs every season.

 

[Hillavoider]

any other sports have an Omerta like this. this has got to be the biggest secret community in sport. its iron clad. even sports commentators are in on it.

 

[Hillavoider]

Usually we dismiss people who speak of aliens at area 51 or faked moon landings by using the logic that it would be impossible for those claims to be true because someone the cover up would have been impossible to contain.

so... if as many people are involved as believed by some members here, someone would have indeed talked by now. if lance is doping, and of course that's likely because they are almost all surely doping, then it is done on the down low. it can't possibly be the systematic team run doping programs that are posited here. someone would have talked long ago and disgruntled ex employees of every team would be dropping bombs about programs every season.

i think you are underestimating this, systematic team run doping has been exposed before.

and its armstrong thats definately won the yellow jersey for doping and keeping people quiet.

 

[sida-mot]

I don't think it's Armstrong that has kept people quiet, it's more the situation. Eveyone feels alone in their guillt, if they were to speak up they "know" they would be the only ones and the only thing achieved was to drag your own name into the dirt.

Now Flandis steps up and suddenly you can feel that he indeed has som support.

Armstrong is an icon. The paradox in all this is that I doubt this could be happening if he hadn't been such a powerful man in the sporting community in general and the cycling community in particular. Now people get the ultimate scapegoat, one man to carry the burden for everyone.

I am not saying that I like mr. Armstrong and I'm one of those that have been convinced that he is as dirty as they come for years. It's just odd (and fortunate in this case) how a cultural problem gets linked to one induvidual.

 

[Aus_Orca]

It's just odd (and fortunate in this case) how a cultural problem gets linked to one induvidual.

+1 for this, its not just the dopers that have to be removed, the culture that is doping in cycling still has to be removed as well, otherwise someone may just try on the shoes and find that they fit

 

[redtreviso]

Miguel Indurain tried on the eyebrow raising shoes in 1990,,,they fit pretty good in 1991..He wore the ridiculous shoes numerous times through 95..Bjarne Riis tried on the new absurd shoes in 1996..Armstrong and Ulrich liked the fit of the absurd shoes.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Usually we dismiss people who speak of aliens at area 51 or faked moon landings by using the logic that it would be impossible for those claims to be true because someone the cover up would have been impossible to contain.

so... if as many people are involved as believed by some members here, someone would have indeed talked by now. if lance is doping, and of course that's likely because they are almost all surely doping, then it is done on the down low. it can't possibly be the systematic team run doping programs that are posited here. someone would have talked long ago and disgruntled ex employees of every team would be dropping bombs about programs every season.

Dang.... you're right.

If there was any substance to the persistent rumours of Lances PED use you would think someone would have said something about it by now.

With the exception of Floyd, there is no-one, total silence...............
oh, except, Steve Swart... and Frankie Andreu ...and, Mike Anderson, Dr. Prentice Steffen, Jonathan Vaughters, Dr. Michael Ashenden, Emma O'Reilly, Stephanie McIlvain, Betsy Andreu, David Walsh, Pierre Ballester, Damien Ressiot, Paul Kimmage....

Also - why would 'disgruntled' ex-employees "drop bombs" on a team they just left? Who would hire them then? Are Jef d'Hont, Willy Voet, Jesus Manzano etc still involved in Pro Cycling?

 

[Runitout]

Usually we dismiss people who speak of aliens at area 51 or faked moon landings by using the logic that it would be impossible for those claims to be true because someone the cover up would have been impossible to contain.

so... if as many people are involved as believed by some members here, someone would have indeed talked by now. if lance is doping, and of course that's likely because they are almost all surely doping, then it is done on the down low. it can't possibly be the systematic team run doping programs that are posited here. someone would have talked long ago and disgruntled ex employees of every team would be dropping bombs about programs every season.

What? Like Swart, O'Reilly, De Vries, Anderson, Voet, Manzano, Gaumont, Jaschke, Sinkewtiz, Davy, D'Hont, Gaumont etc etc...

 

[bobbins]

Armstrongs ride in the Tour of Ireland gave the race huge publicity. It is organised by one of the McQuaids. McQuaids brother Garry works for Oakley. Now, who has massive influence at Oakley?????

 

[rata de sentina]

so... if as many people are involved as believed by some members here, someone would have indeed talked by now.

They have. You just weren't listening.

 

[Runitout]

Armstrongs ride in the Tour of Ireland gave the race huge publicity. It is organised by one of the McQuaids. McQuaids brother Garry works for Oakley. Now, who has massive influence at Oakley?????

Sarah McIlvain?

Why was that Tour of Ireland reduced from five days to three days, immediately after it was announced that Armstrong was negotiated to race there? I don't think it was the Oakley connection - I think it was the appearance fee.

Notwithstanding that he said he would race for free in his comeback year.

 

[frenchfry]

Thierry Adam, lead commentator for cycling coverage on France Télévisions, has said in an interview that he has seen proof of Armstrong's doping. This hasn't stopped him from signing on to the the cult of celebrity worship and promoting Armstrong at every opportunity. Not as bad as Phil, but he should know better.

The media have played a huge role in promoting omerta. Some of this is driven by advertising (not wanting to scare away the paying sponsors), however this isn't Adam's excuse as there isn't much advertising on public French TV.

Floyd confirmed what others have said in the past, in pro cycling doping is the norm as is lying about the reality. It becomes second nature to say in interviews that they are steadfast against doping, just before heading off to stick in the needle.

 

[Anonymous]

Usually we dismiss people who speak of aliens at area 51 or faked moon landings by using the logic that it would be impossible for those claims to be true because someone the cover up would have been impossible to contain.

so... if as many people are involved as believed by some members here, someone would have indeed talked by now. if lance is doping, and of course that's likely because they are almost all surely doping, then it is done on the down low. it can't possibly be the systematic team run doping programs that are posited here. someone would have talked long ago and disgruntled ex employees of every team would be dropping bombs about programs every season.

I guess you have not been paying attention to the people who did talk and say that it was widespread in the last 10 years. I won't do your heavy lifting, but these things are easily searched on Google.

 

[scribe]

Miguel Indurain tried on the eyebrow raising shoes in 1990,,,they fit pretty good in 1991..He wore the ridiculous shoes numerous times through 95..Bjarne Riis tried on the new absurd shoes in 1996..Armstrong and Ulrich liked the fit of the absurd shoes.

Nice analogy! I'd suggest that everyone was wearing those shoes and the cycling authority and other professional sports authorities figured it was simply a sign of modern progress. At some point, the public opinion of fans didn't agree, because some shoes were actually killing guys cause they fit so good. Then the fear and loathing of who had the shoes on and who didn't forced those who wanted to remain in pro ranks into the underground culture of doping that has it's grip on the sport currently. A bunch of closeted and guilt-ridden shoe wearers.

 

[redtreviso]

Nice analogy! I'd suggest that everyone was wearing those shoes and the cycling authority and other professional sports authorities figured it was simply a sign of modern progress. At some point, the public opinion of fans didn't agree, because some shoes were actually killing guys cause they fit so good. Then the fear and loathing of who had the shoes on and who didn't forced those who wanted to remain in pro ranks into the underground culture of doping that has it's grip on the sport currently. A bunch of closeted and guilt-ridden shoe wearers.

I think most were stuck with long term contracts on the mere "eye brow raising" shoes..

 

[tubularglue]

i associate to a large family


lots of secrets

no family member goes out on the street screaming about them

one family member is prosecuted for getting caught and is thrown out on the street

this family member continues the lies to protect himself and those inside the family

and one day, he contacts the authorities realizing he has been living a lie and has had the crap beaten out of him.

literally

just my thoughts

 

[RhodriM]

To me the cycling world seems very close-knit, which can make it friendly. But it can also seem incestuous.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Nice analogy! I'd suggest that everyone was wearing those shoes and the cycling authority and other professional sports authorities figured it was simply a sign of modern progress. At some point, the public opinion of fans didn't agree, because some shoes were actually killing guys cause they fit so good. Then the fear and loathing of who had the shoes on and who didn't forced those who wanted to remain in pro ranks into the underground culture of doping that has it's grip on the sport currently. A bunch of closeted and guilt-ridden shoe wearers.

What about the people who don't wear shoes?

 

[redtreviso]

What about the people who don't wear shoes?

some wore no shoes or lake shoes

 

[scribe]

What about the people who don't wear shoes?

I'd bet you $500k cash/bribe that you couldn't figure out who was wearing shoes and who wasn't (and everything in between) if you were to become presidente of UCI.

 

[Hmmmmm]

Has Lance kept everyone quiet for this long? Or do SOME people choose to be quiet as long as the system is working for them in one form or another. At one point in time someone might experience fear. But as time marches on, hindsight sheds light on things and the fear of something starts to dwindle and you can claim some ownership of a situation regardless of the pressure from other people.

This whole thing reminds me of smoking pot. It's illegal, but a lot of people still do it. You hang with people who do/did it, you know people who do/did it, but you don't say anything. Until you get caught, or you have to pass a lie detector for a clearance, or something along those lines. Then you start pointing the finger. Mom, that's not my bong! It's Charlie's. Or, officer, I don't know how that marijuana got in my car. It's not mine! Omerta is all over the place.

I worked as a software engineer for years and we would shoot for a bug free product but there were always bugs and we had to deliver or ship at some point. So what does everyone do, keep their mouths shut! Until a problem comes up and people notice. Then you kick into damage control mode. Until that point though, there is money on the line and everyone does the same ol' song and dance as the bucks roll in. If someone steps out of line or speaks up, you dismiss it, point out previous and current successes. Point out the steps taken to rectify past mistakes. Anything but address the current problem - but addressing the current problem is going on in some form or another. Hell, you might just cheat and introduce more bugs just to cover up the current publicly known bug! Anyways, I'm just rambling....

 

[buckwheat]

Dang.... you're right.

If there was any substance to the persistent rumours of Lances PED use you would think someone would have said something about it by now.

With the exception of Floyd, there is no-one, total silence...............
oh, except, Steve Swart... and Frankie Andreu ...and, Mike Anderson, Dr. Prentice Steffen, Jonathan Vaughters, Dr. Michael Ashenden, Emma O'Reilly, Stephanie McIlvain, Betsy Andreu, David Walsh, Pierre Ballester, Damien Ressiot, Paul Kimmage....

Also - why would 'disgruntled' ex-employees "drop bombs" on a team they just left? Who would hire them then? Are Jef d'Hont, Willy Voet, Jesus Manzano etc still involved in Pro Cycling?

Those aren't people, they are trolls, nonentities, ciphers.