Huge leads in GCs

[King Of The Wolds]

What is with one rider being head and shoulders ahead of any rivals on GCs lately (Wiggins last year, Froome this year, Nibali in Giro)... thing in these guys are not just dominating one discipline (e.g. climbing) or not-the-best-at-any-but-ok-at-all-of-them (e.g. Cadel Evans), but they are dominating the TTs, Climbs, etc.

The lack of competitive races is a strange phenomenon (but chapeau to, particularly Froome here... deserves his domination)

Evans was more than ok in 2011. He was the 2nd best climber and 2nd best TTer (finishing 5 secs behind a best ever Tony Martin in the long TT) in that Tour. All without the constant insinuations, of course.

 

[Escarabajo]

it's not the similar level, it's the way of racing that totally changed. And the routes too.

And other things help too.

 

[karlboss]

I disagree with your comments on the Giro, Nibali won GC by 4'43" over Uran who dropped 1:30 waiting for Wiggins. So that would be 3:15. Apart from the MTT Nibali was scarcely faster than anyone else, there were 10 riders within a minute on the first TT, and his largest winning margin in the mountains was 12 seconds. Hardly the domination we are seeing by Froome. The difference is it wasn't the same rider second all the time, so more time was lost. 3:15, is less time than Froome already has.
Last year I think Froome was this much better than everyone else except Wiggins. Wiggins TT is better than Froome's and I have little doubt that Froome would have won anyway if given permission. Even though he lost time on stage 1. If he didn't lose the time on stage 1, the final margin would have been less than 2 minutes. Daylight, 3rd. I think this year is a much closer affair, an MTF has actually been raced, there has been a flat TT and the only outlier if Froome. Everyone else...paper weight climbers don't TT so well, solid TTers don't climb so well. Look at Kwiatowski and Quintana.
Back in the day races lasted all day, not just the final climb. Meaning 2 things, more distance actually raced, more time to be won or lost, hitting the final climb there was a very real danger of cracking, hard. Racing is more conservative now.

 

[murali]

When I first started following The Tour in the 60's the time differences were huge compared to today, a 20 minute winning margin wan't unusual with a 10 minute gap between 2nd and third. Even in the 80's, a 10 minute difference was the norm, Hinault won 2 of his tours with 15 minutes, another with 9.

SO how did people take back time from the yellow jersey in those days?


on a related query: When was the last time someone with more than 3 min advantage didn't end up in the podium in Paris? (i haven't been following tdf pre-2000 at all)

 

[Pulpstar]

SO how did people take back time from the yellow jersey in those days?


on a related query: When was the last time someone with more than 3 min advantage didn't end up in the podium in Paris? (i haven't been following tdf pre-2000 at all)

Rasmussen, 2007.

 

[Hautacam2000]

Those huge gaps can easily make a GT boring,but there is a reverse of the medal too.In '90s it was the best era of cycling maybe,but if you look at the gaps...damn,they were enormous

 

[murali]

what hap in stage 17 of 2007? rasmussen was up 3' and then he was not at all in the listing?

I am sorry for the query as i was not following cycling at tht time (no TV access)

 

[The Hitch]

Perhaps it's that the closest contenders are either looking over the hill (Contador) hamstrung by supporting a team-mate (Quintana) or never really should be a contender for the win (Valverde).

weak competition line works for 1 or 2 races. It gets a bit tiring after 10 races though. PN 2012, 2013. Weak competition. Romandie 2011 2012, weak compeititon. Dauphine 2012, 2013 weak competition. Tour 2012, 2013, weak competition. Olympics, Oman, Criterium Internatioal etc.

Over that time sky have come up against pretty much every rider in the world tour, and destroyed every single one of them. So quite simply you have a couple of riders on 1 team, who are heads and shoulders above the whole peloton.

The fact that 1 rider may be over the hill means nothing because we arent comparing froome to one rider but the whole peloton.

Oh and Quintana lost minutes yesterday in the tt. The fact that he has Valverde on his team had no bearing on that. Froome is also heads and shoulders above him. Afterall his domestique beat him in PN ffs.

 

[roundabout]

what hap in stage 17 of 2007? rasmussen was up 3' and then he was not at all in the listing?

I am sorry for the query as i was not following cycling at tht time (no TV access)

Got abducted by aliens.

 

[wwabbit]

Oh and Quintana lost minutes yesterday in the tt. The fact that he has Valverde on his team had no bearing on that. Froome is also heads and shoulders above him. Afterall his domestique beat him in PN ffs.

Valverde wasn't at PN... you mean Dauphine?

 

[Koba80]

Someone said they didn't remember these big leads and one dominant rider in the past in the Armstrong years? Did you watch those years? And how about Indurain - how many minutes in a ITT in Luxembourg (I think it was) over every other rider? The TdF was ever thus, a couple of years aside (Lemond/Fignon, Cuddles), it's been the norm not the exception for as long as I've been watching.

 

[murali]

aliens

so no one has ever come back to top position after being 3+ min down on GC?

 

[The Hitch]

Valverde wasn't at PN... you mean Dauphine?

him = Quintana. who was at PN. And Froome's domestique (porte) beat him.

 

[Rollthedice]

Nairo beat Porte in Pais Vasco GC.

 

[murali]

Porte came up in PN mainly due to TT.

Stage 5, i think quintana lost because of lack of experience. porte's attack was predictable, but quintana was not exactly following porte's wheels.

 

[rghysens]

so no one has ever come back to top position after being 3+ min down on GC?

Well, Armstrong was 35' back on O'Grady and 13' on Kiviliev in 2001 (but that was before the first real mountain stage and TT).
In 1998 Marco Pantani was in a similar Position as AC and AV today (3' behind the pre race favourite after the first TT and first 2 mountain stages) and still managed to win the tour. But he showed in those two mountain stages that he was the better climber.
In 1990 Greg leMond had to make up 9' on Chiapucci.
So it happened before, but only on some very rare occasion did the pre-race favourite loose his topspot after being more than 3' in front of his competitors.

 

[murali]

thank you. at least AC wont have to create a record to do it.

 

[kcbworth]

Am going to be on Ventoux on Sunday (well I have a car, sleeping bags, my wife, and a few maps... so hoping to be anyway) so hopefully someone can light up the race to try to avoid a procession

 

[murali]

have a nice trip.

 

[maxmartin]

thank you. at least AC wont have to create a record to do it.

times are different, in those days you see riders pop in the high mountain, but nowadays these situation rarely happens

 

[perico]

what hap in stage 17 of 2007? rasmussen was up 3' and then he was not at all in the listing?

I am sorry for the query as i was not following cycling at tht time (no TV access)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/jul/26/cycling.tourdefrance