I still don't Understand The Bio Passport

[AndyRubio]

How do they hide the injection sites? intravenous injection sites leave tracks on me for a week. or do they inject between their toes like heroin users?

Tattoos? Ever seen Hollentour?

 

[whiteboytrash]

One more question: Does the Bio pick up coke ?

 

[BroDeal]

How do they hide the injection sites? intravenous injection sites leave tracks on me for a week. or do they inject between their toes like heroin users?

Armstrong used makeup to hide the marks according to his team's soigneur.

 

[analo69]

In the good old days CSC introduced their own bio passport, with a Danish doctor responsible.

As far as I can recall this program is now overwith because the UCI introduced a very similar program.

Here are som data from the CSC bio passport program. As I understand these data are almost idenitcal to the data from the UCI bio passport.

So you ca see for yourself what the bio passport is all about.

http://www.riis-cycling.com/pdf/CSC_Saxo_Bank_second_AD_report.pdf

Note that no riders have a baseline 48-49% heamotocrit, but more like the normal 42-44%.

 

[Escarabajo]

In the good old days CSC introduced their own bio passport, with a Danish doctor responsible.

As far as I can recall this program is now overwith because the UCI introduced a very similar program.

Here are som data from the CSC bio passport program. As I understand these data are almost idenitcal to the data from the UCI bio passport.

So you ca see for yourself what the bio passport is all about.

http://www.riis-cycling.com/pdf/CSC_Saxo_Bank_second_AD_report.pdf

Note that no riders have a baseline 48-49% heamotocrit, but more like the normal 42-44%.

Thanks for the information.

I don't know about you but I still see some kind of trend. Most Hemat.% seems to be higher in the months of december, january and february. Maybe when they are jacking up and drawing some blood for later. Of course we never going to see the values of the dark ages when most everybody was over 50%.
That's just me thinking.
Thanks.

 

[hmronnow]

Thanks for the information.

I don't know about you but I still see some kind of trend. Most Hemat.% seems to be higher in the months of december, january and february. Maybe when they are jacking up and drawing some blood for later. Of course we never going to see the values of the drak ages when most everybody was over 50%.
That's just me thinking.
Thanks.

Hematocrit percentage generally falls with increased fitness. So it is normal to be slightly higher in the months with less intensive training.

 

[Escarabajo]

Hematocrit percentage generally falls with increased fitness. So it is normal to be slightly higher in the months with less intensive training.

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[BigBoat]

Excellent informative post. What I am not clear on is, if you blood dope before the race to raise crit to >50% wont that show in a test if you cannot dilute before the control?

The post stage value doesnt get considered because of dehyration and needing to get back to the motorhome/ hotel and "rehydrate" (train off extra blood.) When the body senses loss of blood volume it immediately replaces it with plasma volume. Or they can add a volume expander, do both.

If somebody doing this has so much as 20 minutes in the bus or somewhere else out of sight they can do this... And even if his crit is at 49% on volume expanders, they might wear off but it might only go to low 50s when its really 59.... So dehyration can be used as an excuse and it is!

They do test for drugs but blood values immediately post stage/ race are not taken into consideration if their even taken. What they really should do is take startline blood values, if they take any at all.

 

[BigBoat]

Thanks for the information.

I don't know about you but I still see some kind of trend. Most Hemat.% seems to be higher in the months of december, january and february. Maybe when they are jacking up and drawing some blood for later. Of course we never going to see the values of the dark ages when most everybody was over 50%.
That's just me thinking.
Thanks.

They dont actually need a high crit to donate blood...

The Plasma gets spun off in a centrifuge so they can blood dope with pure red cells that have been stored in say glyceral solution + additives like saline, adenine, glucose, mannitol, sodium bicarbonate, and disodium phosphate in a chilly fridge at 1-6 degrees C. This will last 41 day shelf life in 350 ml blood bags..


The volume with pure red cells is less for a transfusion. A single unit of Pure red cells will raise crit by 3-4%... A big 600cc transfusion could give an 8% increase!

Also, reducing oxygen saturation by storing the RBCs in a Nitrogen environment will increase shelf life by a couple of weeks... SO they could do it 2 months before a race or >>>

Or they can use cryopreservation which glyceralizes the red cells for a shelf life of up to 10 bloody years at -80 C / half as cold as the boiling point of liquid Nitrogen! This allows the riders to store up blood for the future so they dont have to have draw off periods anymore.

The red blood cells need to be diluted and thawed properly before transfusion or there are major health concerns.

Cheers again.

 

[franciep10]

They dont actually need a high crit to donate blood...

The Plasma gets spun off in a centrifuge so they can blood dope with pure red cells that have been stored in say glyceral solution + additives like saline, adenine, glucose, mannitol, sodium bicarbonate, and disodium phosphate in a chilly fridge at 1-6 degrees C. This will last 41 day shelf life in 350 ml blood bags..

The volume with pure red cells is less for a transfusion. A single unit of Pure red cells will raise crit by 3-4%... A big 600cc transfusion could give an 8% increase!

Or they can use cryopreservation which glyceralizes the red cells for a shelf life of up to 10 bloody years at -80 C / half as cold as the boiling point of liquid Nitrogen! This allows the riders to store up blood for the future so they dont have to have draw off periods anymore.

The red blood cells need to be diluted and thawed properly before transfusion or there are major health concerns.

Cheers again.

how do you know this stuff I mean cryropreservation come on drop some knowledge on me

 

[BigBoat]

how do you know this stuff I mean cryropreservation come on drop some knowledge on me

The shelf life in some circumstances (in one trial study that started in teh 1970s.. was able to store some RBCs for up to ~ 37 years.

Crazy huh!

 

[franciep10]

The shelf life in some circumstances (in one trial study that started in teh 1970s.. was able to store some RBCs for up to ~ 37 years.

Crazy huh!

dam well maybe lance is gonna us some of his blood from 2000, disregard that statement

 

[BigBoat]

You see what Kohl said, less that 20 minutes per refill (about 650 cc each).

Wattt did I say! They can now do this right before the start of the key stages... And take blood out immediately after.

 

[BigBoat]

The test for HGH is either still in trials, or unreliable, or only works for something like 1 day.



As I said before, it's money, and the culture of doping - teams, trainers, doctors, and especially riders and sponsors - that are the real key to getting doping to stop.

Bingo bingo bingo!

 

[Stani Kléber]

You see what Kohl said, less that 20 minutes per refill (about 650 cc each).

Wattt did I say! They can now do this right before the start of the key stages... And take blood out immediately after.

This has long been the assumption, that behind the tinted windows of the team bus you have several riders being hooked up to blood infusions. So one small way would be to take the riders into the "race village" when they sign on before the start and then to hold them there whilst selecting a few to measure their haematocrit count. Simple and cheap, it only means changing the timing of the near-pointless UCI "vampire" tests where riders are woken early to provide blood samples for the same purpose but idiotically given hours to refill.

 

[rolfrae]

Not long to wait now...honest. This auto-translation from L'Equipe:

The President of the Union Cycliste intenrnationale (UCI), Pat McQuaid said Wednesday at a press conference that disciplinary proceedings would be initiated against a number of riders whose passport biological abnormalities. "The Riders will be informed next week, said the president of the UCI. After informed, we will notify their teams and their federations. "

The UCI said it would be solely the responsibility of teams to impose suspensions against the riders. "There will not be provisionally suspended by the UCI, has stressed Pat McQuaid . This will be the teams to make a decision. "awaited for several months, the first list of names of riders with abnormal blood data could be unveiled Monday, according to sources within the UCI.

 

[issoisso]

In fact, they specifically said the names will be announced on Monday, right after they contact the riders themselves.

 

[rolfrae]

In fact, they specifically said the names will be announced on Monday, right after they contact the riders themselves.

Should we expect a rash of Dauphine abandons over the coming days?

 

[elapid]

The UCI said it would be solely the responsibility of teams to impose suspensions against the riders. "There will not be provisionally suspended by the UCI, has stressed Pat McQuaid . This will be the teams to make a decision. "awaited for several months, the first list of names of riders with abnormal blood data could be unveiled Monday, according to sources within the UCI.[/I]

Jeez, great to see proof that the UCI has no backbone. Pass the responsibility on to the teams. What if the teams allow these riders to continue to race? What will the UCI (and national federations) do then? My guess - sit on their fat lazy asses and do absolutely nada as per usual. Bunch of self-serving gas bags.

Also like the timing. Why do things like this (Festina, Operation Puerto, Vienna, now the Biological Passport) always get revealed just before a GT, and usually the TdF? It stinks of something more complicit. Maybe I'm just getting too cynical in my old age.

 

[rolfrae]

Also like the timing. Why do things like this (Festina, Operation Puerto, Vienna, now the Biological Passport) always get revealed just before a GT, and usually the TdF? It stinks of something more complicit. Maybe I'm just getting too cynical in my old age.

It's maximum publicity for the facade that they are actively fighting doping.

 

[rolfrae]

It's maximum publicity for the facade that they are actively fighting doping.

And all this coming out now might help Lance and Johan's search for a sponsor pre-Tour?

 

[Mellow Velo]

Yes. Shove the ball into the team's court.
Hope they will save the UCI a fortune in lawyer's bills, just to find out they haven't a leg to stand on.

I expect the names to be leaking from HQ, before the weekend.

Bet there won't be a single rider who's on one of those nice "medical programmes".........
.........unless someone is passing on an extra large brown envelope, to get rid of a certain Spaniard.

 

[BYOP88]

Yes. Shove the ball into the team's court.
Hope they will save the UCI a fortune in lawyer's bills, just to find out they haven't a leg to stand on.

I expect the names to be leaking from HQ, before the weekend.

Bet there won't be a single rider who's on one of those nice "medical programmes".........
.........unless someone is passing on an extra large brown envelope, to get rid of a certain Spaniard.

they're wanting rid of Jose Ivan Gutierrez Palacios

 

[Rice Daddy]

Kohl/Vaughters etc.

In today's story regarding J. Vaughters's refutation that the Tour top ten from last summer could ALL have been found positive, the reporter states:

"Vaughters' story seems to run counter to Kohl's assertion that the blood passport results were beneficial in helping riders to regulate their doping."

Help me understand how Vaughters's willingness to accept UCI-provided blood values in any way belies Kohl's completely plausible claim that HAVING THAT INFORMATION helps skillful riders micro-manage their doping programs to evade detection.

And just an aside, regarding overall credibility: Kohl is a confessed cheat who has indicated that he will be completely frank about his past activities. Maybe he will; maybe he won't. Vaughters, however, is a highly likely cheat during his career who has remained coy about his own doping experiences and now loudly proclaims that his team, employing at least one known high-profile cheat, is helping to turn the page to a clean era in cycling. Yeah. OK.

 

[Kerbdog]

Sorry now folks but a lot here seem to ready & foaming at the mouth to jump on the UCI's backs on this. Am I correct in stating that the purpose of the Blood passport was to catch these supposed cheats & rid the sport of them & deter doping etc?? Also are the UCI not entitled to under this program gather & prepare the information so that what they present is correct & by the regulations therin? It stated that this is about abnormal values so its plausible that they have as much information as possible for reference.
I think people are looking too much into the timing of the Bernard Kohl interview. Hes coming out & saying things & how they were done in a bid to assist clean things up & help for the future. He will also be around doing & saying these things for a while so will the UCI be continually marking his comments from now on & counteracting them?
I believe the sports big event the Tour de France is almost upon us & by doing this now & naming names a month before the race it helps get rid of cheats that would otherwise be in the race & possible be caught then with even more bad exposure. It will also allow teams to replace any riders who will not be allowed compete & have them in shape for it.
With all of whats gone on in mind would someone here please tell me when it would suit you all to be informed of a positive test or bad news regarding blood levels?? Anyone, seriously just let the UCI know when you all have an available window so we can be called aside.
Oh yeah as regards all this pity for Kolom, sorry but didnt he fail a Dope test recently? Is it a pity about timing or how he has to take the fall? Fall for what? He has apparently cheated, got caught & will now be sanctioned. Justice will be served upon him. End of, end of.