Is Andy Schleck being criticised too much lately?

[The Hitch]

You cant deny what He did in Giau - Gardeccia... was totally amaazing...

It was Grappa that impressed me most. Cant find a video of it though.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I think andy has a point about the giro... It is a great race and is sometimes tougher than the tour but really the tour de france is the one that really matters.. For a top contendor like andy is giving up on the big fish to win something else is a bit of a bad mentality... Ullrich always went for the tour even though he was overmatched... seems andy is the same this year, I think he has a better chance of winning the giro but in my eyes(and I think many others) a giro or vuelta win, even both, don't add up to a tour win so maybe he should just keep at it..

I hope andy gets back to his best climbing form and really goes for it and wins the tour this year.

And Ullrich retired with a palmarès nothing like the one his talent merited. In 50 years' time when our generations of cyclists are the distant past, Paolo fricking Savoldelli will be better remembered than Jan.

Andy, for all his skills, has a Liège-Bastogne-Liège victory and nothing else to point to. That is the only illustrious race his name can go in the winner's list of. Given that he's racing alongside Contador (who races to win every month until July), Evans and Valverde (who both race to win at all times), and yet still are able to compete with him, and in the case of the first two beat him, at the only race he really goes for, maybe some reappraisal is needed. After all, these guys accumulate a much better palmarès for half a season... then they beat him in Le Tour... then they continue to accumulate a better palmarès for the rest of the year too. Not exactly a ringing endorsement for his approach

 

[palmerq]

And Ullrich retired with a palmarès nothing like the one his talent merited. In 50 years' time when our generations of cyclists are the distant past, Paolo fricking Savoldelli will be better remembered than Jan.

I don't think so, I think people will think of jan more highly( I certainly do)... but the point is why ride for 2nd at the cost of 1st.. Winning the giro is 2nd place compared to winning the tour and to win the giro you need to forget about the tour, bad idea for andy better to take every chance you get to win the tour.. although obviously if andy doesnt give it his all to win the tour he might as well give up... but attempting to win the giro because you believe the tour is beyond you is a bit embarrassing.

just my opinion though

 

[djlovesyou]

He's talking about in 50 years though. People think highly of Ulrich now because we saw it, when all we've got is a list of results and a few youtube videos things might be different.

 

[AussieGoddess]

Andy really is too stupid for words

Honestly, in a Tour with substantially less mountains and MTF's, 100km's of time trialling and at least 1 major descent finish .... he comes out and says "oh I am trying to improve my TT skills, but I'm not training on descents at all coz they are too dangerous"

All he is achieving is ensuring that Menchov, Evans and Contador WILL attack on every descent.

 

[The Hitch]

I don't think so, I think people will think of jan more highly( I certainly do)... but the point is why ride for 2nd at the cost of 1st.. Winning the giro is 2nd place compared to winning the tour and to win the giro you need to forget about the tour, bad idea for andy better to take every chance you get to win the tour.. although obviously if andy doesnt give it his all to win the tour he might as well give up... but attempting to win the giro because you believe the tour is beyond you is a bit embarrassing.

just my opinion though

I dont see the people writing corridos about Jan Ullrich

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nr8VsVes16k

 

[palmerq]

He's talking about in 50 years though. People think highly of Ulrich now because we saw it, when all we've got is a list of results and a few youtube videos things might be different.

well maybe he is right, who knows what people will think in 50 years.. In my opinion it is totally stupid to give up on the tour because it is too hard, far better to risk missing out on the giro and going for the tour. The tour de france is the one that matters i am Menchov fan but I would prefer he had the tour de france rather than his 3 other gt wins.. Like I said before andy should always go for the tour first and have the vuelta in mind if things go wrong... Obviously he needs to put in a great effort though.

 

[palmerq]

I dont see the people writing corridos about Jan Ullrich

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nr8VsVes16k

I prefered marco pantani singin whatever he was singing, if you can find that on youtube I will be very happy :S

 

[cineteq]

It was Grappa that impressed me most. Cant find a video of it though.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Andy really is too stupid for words

Honestly, in a Tour with substantially less mountains and MTF's, 100km's of time trialling and at least 1 major descent finish .... he comes out and says "oh I am trying to improve my TT skills, but I'm not training on descents at all coz they are too dangerous"

All he is achieving is ensuring that Menchov, Evans and Contador WILL attack on every descent.

Bonette descent, 2008: Menchov is dropped from a group containing Andy Schleck.

Menchov and Basso are about the only 2 GT contenders who won't be able to exploit that weakness. Rest assured Nibali, Sánchez, Valverde, Evans and Contador will. Wiggins perhaps as well; he was very circumspect in the Vuelta but was just coming back from an injury, and usually track guys are good bike handlers.

 

[The Hitch]

I prefered marco pantani singin whatever he was singing, if you can find that on youtube I will be very happy :S

You mean this beauty?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zz_c_0ZhaoA

Honestly one of my favourite songs. Just listening to it and watching Pantani smile touches me emotionaly every time.

Of course a few other legends had songs written by the people about them.

Coppi - also very sad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSUwt6l8qVA

Bartali
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=La5JBSEdIe0

I think we should call them velocorridos.

 

[The Hitch]

Bonette descent, 2008: Menchov is dropped from a group containing Andy Schleck.

Menchov and Basso are about the only 2 GT contenders who won't be able to exploit that weakness. Rest assured Nibali, Sánchez, Valverde, Evans and Contador will. Wiggins perhaps as well; he was very circumspect in the Vuelta but was just coming back from an injury, and usually track guys are good bike handlers.

You said Andy was only 17 seconds down on Contador at the summit in 2010 15 and he obviously finished 39 seconds down.

That means he was out-descended by Menchov.

 

[Havetts]

if you can stick as glue to Contador & Samu then you're fine. IIRC he lost contact right after the top and lost +/- 30 seconds.

Menchov definitely isnt a great descender.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

You said Andy was only 17 seconds down on Contador at the summit in 2010 15 and he obviously finished 39 seconds down.

That means he was out-descended by Menchov.

Yes, but Menchov and Andy are much of a muchness. Sometimes (eg Jausiers 2008) Andy will be better, other times (eg Bagnères de Luchon 2010) Denis will be better. I don't see Menchov doing any attacking on any descent to exploit the weakness though. He might gain time if he follows somebody else's attack though.

 

[AussieGoddess]

Lol - whoops, blonde moment there

Not Menchov for descents ... definitely meant Nibbles.

 

[Michielveedeebee]

You mean this beauty?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zz_c_0ZhaoA

Honestly one of my favourite songs. Just listening to it and watching Pantani smile touches me emotionaly every time.

I think we should call them velocorridos.

Hey that's my link Glad you like it that much

 

[sky forever]

I agree that descents can be quite a thrill, but its different when youve been pushed to the limit on the climb, exhausted totally, dont have much blood going to your brain, are racing against top descenders and watching your hopes vanish before your eyes.

Fair enough yes after climbs but Andy was rubbish after short climbs and lost minutes into Gap.

 

[sky forever]

if nibali would be a great descender then yes

Do you not think Nibali is a great descender? He was I think 1 minute behind Contador on a stage in the Giro last year (maybe more). Caught back up quickly and then got away on a different stage from AC who isn't the best but also isn't a bad descender.

 

[sky forever]

yeah gaining 20 seconds at most in downhils is fantastic! also I remembe rhis fantastic downhil in lombardia 2010, oh wait. or the downhil the sterrato giro stage this year where he nearly crashed, oh wait.

the most overrated downhiller out there. he is just a daredevil which no technique. no great cornering a bit like celestino used to be. he's not great like cancellara, hushovd, savoldelli, sagan, etc etc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuGzA_o0HBc Bunny hop on a descent. Would a daredevil than that? Yes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPXIdGy1iM0&feature=related

 

[La Pandera]

So one minute he is being called stupid admitting his problems with descents and now he is stupid for believing he can improve his TTing.

The feeding frenzy on here is really starting to get tedious.

He's not only admitting his problem with descentes but stating he has no idea how to improve in that respect and no intention of trying. The ITT statement is beyond ridiculous. 20 seconds??? C'mon Ferryman, you must admit that is completely unrealistic in a 40k TT for him, clinic enhancements not withstanding.

 

[La Pandera]

He's talking about in 50 years though. People think highly of Ulrich now because we saw it, when all we've got is a list of results and a few youtube videos things might be different.

Ullrich would still come on top of Salvoldelli. A Tour win, world ITT champion, Vuelta champion and multiple podiums in the Tour certainly trump Salvoldelli's record. I really don't see much comparison.

 

[simo1733]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuGzA_o0HBc Bunny hop on a descent. Would a daredevil than that? Yes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPXIdGy1iM0&feature=related

There is daredevil descending and then there is this.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfMQdFGTKAs&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Bonette descent, 2008: Menchov is dropped from a group containing Andy Schleck.

Menchov and Basso are about the only 2 GT contenders who won't be able to exploit that weakness. Rest assured Nibali, Sánchez, Valverde, Evans and Contador will. Wiggins perhaps as well; he was very circumspect in the Vuelta but was just coming back from an injury, and usually track guys are good bike handlers.

wiggins is no good downhiller at all. not very bad either but average at most.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

You said Andy was only 17 seconds down on Contador at the summit in 2010 15 and he obviously finished 39 seconds down.

That means he was out-descended by Menchov.

in the same 2010 tour andy followed contador in downhils. he's dfinitely better than menchov

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Do you not think Nibali is a great descender? He was I think 1 minute behind Contador on a stage in the Giro last year (maybe more). Caught back up quickly and then got away on a different stage from AC who isn't the best but also isn't a bad descender.

contador didn't pay attention to nibali at all as he wasn't a threat at any given time after etna. nibali is a daredevil and yes out of 10 downhils you are going to have some good ones but also some bad ones. he very overrated 100% and nothing like near the best downhiller sof the peloton. I believe there was a poll amonst riders one time who was the best downhiller and hushovd and jj haedo were most voted and nibali didn't get a single vote