Is Walsh on the Sky bandwagon?

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daveyt

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sniper said:
And any given cycling team isn't denying the use of tramadol in press only to get caught out by contradictory statements of their own (ex)staff.
They said they do not use it.

They had used it in the past, did they deny ever using it? Where is the contradiction?
 
daveyt said:
They said they do not use it.

They had used it in the past, did they deny ever using it? Where is the contradiction?
The problem is, Sky have been caught in so many lies and other contradictory statements, the rational, thinking person would not give them any benefit of the doubt.
 

daveyt

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veganrob said:
The problem is, Sky have been caught in so many lies and other contradictory statements, the rational, thinking person would not give them any benefit of the doubt.
One day I really should have a proper look into these claims and the sources, it just sounds really tedious.

Many lies and contradictions in the accusations against sky on this board make it impossible to take the accusations at face value.
 
Jul 21, 2012
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daveyt said:
One day I really should have a proper look into these claims and the sources, it just sounds really tedious.

Many lies and contradictions in the accusations against sky on this board make it impossible to take the accusations at face value.
If the hitch or someone else posts all the lies from the sky camp will you admit you were wrong?
 
thehog said:
What flak? I think you might seeing things.

I believe the reference is that Sky were using it and only admitted after Barry dropped them in it but claim now they're not.

Considering they tend to bend the truth on such matters it's hard to believe or know if they've moved onto another drug for painkilling purposes.
Sky did hire Alan Farrell as Lead Doctor a couple of years ago, it's not beyond the realms of possibility that he put a stop to riders Training/Racing on Tramadol when he arrived.
 
MatParker117 said:
Sky did hire Alan Farrell as Lead Doctor a couple of years ago, it's not beyond the realms of possibility that he put a stop to riders Training/Racing on Tramadol when he arrived.
You mean the guy who signed off Froome's horse steroids? Yes, sounds like a big change :rolleyes:
 

daveyt

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the sceptic said:
If the hitch or someone else posts all the lies from the sky camp will you admit you were wrong?
If all put together with links where I can examine the sources and context of each quote then I would hope I would be able to view it with an open mind.

As I say I have been meaning to look into myselt, but trawling through the threads, finding the sources etc sounds quite an intimidating amount of work.
 
daveyt said:
If all put together with links where I can examine the sources and context of each quote then I would hope I would be able to view it with an open mind.

As I say I have been meaning to look into myselt, but trawling through the threads, finding the sources etc sounds quite an intimidating amount of work.
You've got to remember that the most prolific posters here and in particular on the Sky threads have a hair-trigger when it comes to pointing the finger and shouting "liar"..........very often these people come to the conclusion that something is a lie because they are blind to other possibilities.........what you would learn from studying what The Hitch thinks is a lie is that he's carefully selected and spun his 'evidence' to suit his case.......and ignored that which contradicts it.........this is why he is able to "know" what he knows with such utter certainty :rolleyes:..............one of his favorite tricks is rampant exaggeration

Mark L
 

daveyt

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ebandit said:
You've got to remember that the most prolific posters here and in particular on the Sky threads have a hair-trigger when it comes to pointing the finger and shouting "liar"..........very often these people come to the conclusion that something is a lie because they are blind to other possibilities.........what you would learn from studying what The Hitch thinks is a lie is that he's carefully selected and spun his 'evidence' to suit his case.......and ignored that which contradicts it.........this is why he is able to "know" what he knows with such utter certainty :rolleyes:..............one of his favorite tricks is rampant exaggeration

Mark L
Maybe, I think it might be helpful for everyone to have their complete arguement laid out with references etc. Whenever someone has a stab at it there is usually at least one obvious exaggeration e.g Froome was so rubbish he had to hang on to a motorcycle - ignoring the fact he was injured and on his way to retire.

Then some mewling pillock posts horse steroids over and over again and the whole thing turns into a circus.
 
ebandit said:
He says horse steroids.....he means cough medicine ;)

Mark L
Prednisolone

Prescription drug

Treats inflammation (swelling), allergies, arthritis, asthma, skin conditions, kidney problems, and many other medical problems. Also treats flare-ups of ongoing illnesses such as multiple sclerosis. May be used for some symptoms of cancer. This medicine is a corticosteroid (steroid).
 

daveyt

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red_flanders said:
Prednisolone

Prescription drug

Treats inflammation (swelling), allergies, arthritis, asthma, skin conditions, kidney problems, and many other medical problems. Also treats flare-ups of ongoing illnesses such as multiple sclerosis. May be used for some symptoms of cancer. This medicine is a corticosteroid (steroid).
But as it was a valid TUE, and there is no evidence of the TUE system being abused, it really does not matter.

Out of interest what do you think the performance bonus was from that one course vs if Froome had not been ill?

Maybe in that one stage of the Dauphine where he finished just in from of Contador they may have finished neck and neck? Or Froome might have been seconds or minutes down?
 
Jul 21, 2012
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daveyt said:
But as it was a valid TUE, and there is no evidence of the TUE system being abused, it really does not matter.

Out of interest what do you think the performance bonus was from that one course vs if Froome had not been ill?

Maybe in that one stage of the Dauphine where he finished just in from of Contador they may have finished neck and neck? Or Froome might have been seconds or minutes down?
Now you are clearly trolling.
 

daveyt

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the sceptic said:
Now you are clearly trolling.
No, people keep mentioning this one TUE like it means something, what do you guys actually think it means?

It is thrown into every thread, which seems to me to be a better example of trolling.

Genuinely confused.
 
Oct 16, 2010
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daveyt said:
No, people keep mentioning this one TUE like it means something, what do you guys actually think it means?

It is thrown into every thread, which seems to me to be a better example of trolling.

Genuinely confused.
referring to facts is now considered trolling?
 
Jul 21, 2012
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daveyt said:
No, people keep mentioning this one TUE like it means something, what do you guys actually think it means?

It is thrown into every thread, which seems to me to be a better example of trolling.

Genuinely confused.
It means Froome was doping to gain an unfair advantage. cheating with the help of Zorzoli/UCI.

Hope that clears things up.
 

daveyt

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sniper said:
referring to facts is now considered trolling?
Repeating the same thing over and over and over again can be, especially when it seems completly irrelevent.

Which is why I am asking what you guys think the relavance actually is?
 

daveyt

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the sceptic said:
It means Froome was doping to gain an unfair advantage. cheating with the help of Zorzoli/UCI.

Hope that clears things up.
But as it was a valid TUE, and there is no evidence of the TUE system being abused, it really does not matter.

Out of interest what do you think the performance bonus was from that one course vs if Froome had not been ill?

Maybe in that one stage of the Dauphine where he finished just in from of Contador they may have finished neck and neck? Or Froome might have been seconds or minutes down?
 
the sceptic said:
It means Froome was doping to gain an unfair advantage. cheating with the help of Zorzoli/UCI.

Hope that clears things up.
Unfair advantage, that’s for sure. Apparently he was so sick he needed treatment and that treatment was with an illegal drug. Then Dawg thought, ‘what the heck’? and decided to smash the field all whilst sick and on an illegal drug.

But perhaps the rest of the field was on Predisone as well so it was a level playing field? :rolleyes:

And Froome has never tested positive.
 
the sceptic said:
It means Froome was doping to gain an unfair advantage. cheating with the help of Zorzoli/UCI.

Hope that clears things up.
No, it that's what you would like to make it mean, the "problem" is that it doesn't mean that at all.
He got a TUE. So the product he took was LEGAL. What is legal, is not doping.
Doping /= taking performance enhancing products
Doping = taking forbidden products.

Claiming that was doping, is a LIE:)
 
Oct 16, 2010
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daveyt said:
Repeating the same thing over and over and over again can be, especially when it seems completly irrelevent.

Which is why I am asking what you guys think the relavance actually is?
it seems irrelevant to you, and of course to a whole lot of other cycling fans who do not post in the clinic.
get your troll act together.
 
daveyt said:
Repeating the same thing over and over and over again can be, especially when it seems completly irrelevent.

Which is why I am asking what you guys think the relavance actually is?
Do you not see what has happenned here Davey?.........you have noticed the ritual chanting of the same things over and over until it becomes part of the folklore.....and therefore 'true'..........prednisolone becomes 'horse steroids'..........a legal TUE becomes illegal doping.......

This is referred to here as 'The Conversation' and what you have done is interrupted it which is why you are being accused of "trolling" ;)


Mark L

EDIT: just as I was typing this post sniper got there first with exactly what I described.....

sniper said:
it seems irrelevant to you, and of course to a whole lot of other cycling fans who do not post in the clinic.
get your troll act together.
They never fail to deliver ;)
 
Jul 21, 2012
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daveyt said:
But as it was a valid TUE, and there is no evidence of the TUE system being abused, it really does not matter.

Out of interest what do you think the performance bonus was from that one course vs if Froome had not been ill?

Maybe in that one stage of the Dauphine where he finished just in from of Contador they may have finished neck and neck? Or Froome might have been seconds or minutes down?
It was not a valid TUE as it did not pass through the required committee. This means Froome was cheating with the help of the UCI.
 
daveyt said:
But as it was a valid TUE, and there is no evidence of the TUE system being abused, it really does not matter.

Out of interest what do you think the performance bonus was from that one course vs if Froome had not been ill?

Maybe in that one stage of the Dauphine where he finished just in from of Contador they may have finished neck and neck? Or Froome might have been seconds or minutes down?
My point in posting the definition was for clarity. As far as "no evidence of the TUE system being abused" I would only agree that all parties claim there was no problem.

Having watched the UCI lie to gloss over TUE problems in the past, I don't trust them. That said, not my point in posting the definition.

It's not a cold medicine, it's a strong steroid which clearly has beneficial properties for the racing cyclist.
 

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