Teams & Riders Jonas Vingegaard thread: Love in Iberia

[Krzysztof_O]

Now that's a hard choice for his critics. Is he a Tour-centric July mega-peaker without passion for the sport, or is he too greedy going for the win in stage races throughout the year?

If this is officially confirmed (it's still not) then it's great from a sporting point of view. Vinge is the unltimate GT racer and it would be nice if he tried to do the double, making the most of his abilities.

 

[dazaau]

!

https://twitter.com/x/status/1683039445853806592

View: https://twitter.com/Laura_Meseguer/status/1683039445853806592

The horror. I wanted a Remco Roglic rematch.

Will be interesting to see if Jonas can superpeak twice.

 

[Red Rick]

Smart decision. Jonas is very well suited for the Vuelta - the heat is a strength and the mountain stages this year are pretty hard. A lot better than what he has done post Tour previously.

Now, the interesting stuff is whether it's more of a Klöden-role or an actual dual leadership. I think the latter.

Dual leadership to start.

I think Jumbo will treat this as unknown territory for Vingegaard, so they'll just see how good he is. And I think Vingegaard and Roglic have a good relationship so they'll make it work.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

This is going to be an absurdly stacked Vuelta field - perfect timing for the best route they've had in years. Vingegaard, Evenepoel, Roglic and Ayuso is arguably four of the top-5 GC riders right now. As long as Vingegaard is a tad weaker than at the Tour, it should be a great race.

 

[tobydawq]

Now that's a hard choice for his critics. Is he a Tour-centric July mega-peaker without passion for the sport, or is he too greedy going for the win in stage races throughout the year?

I am still processing. I'll let you know which one it is in due course

 

[Netserk]

I think the baseline expectation after already winning the Dauphiné in dominant fashion is for him to hold an inconsistent high level for the first two weeks before fading in the end.

 

[Netserk]

This is going to be an absurdly stacked Vuelta field - perfect timing for the best route they've had in years. Vingegaard, Evenepoel, Roglic and Ayuso is arguably four of the top-5 GC riders right now. As long as Vingegaard is a tad weaker than at the Tour, it should be a great race.

After Pogi cracked on Loze, I think Hindley would have been 2nd without his crash. So I can't rank Evenepoel and especially not Ayuso above him yet.

 

[Ricco']

Vingo/Rogla
Ayuso/Almeida
Remco/Vervaeke

Poor Remco

 

[Valv.Piti]

I still sometimes laugh at the notion that Logic thinks Evenepoel had a 50% chance to win La Vuelta this year. I wonder how many %-points it dropped after this.

Absolutely stacked field. Now, lets hope Carapaz and Mas heals well, and that Carlos Rodriguez rides as well. Then we basically only need Pog.

 

[Red Rick]

I think the baseline expectation after already winning the Dauphiné in dominant fashion is for him to hold an inconsistent high level for the first two weeks before fading in the end.

Feels surreal to apply such conventional thinking to guys like Vingegaard.

I do think Pinot and Kuss, the two main riders that doubled up after the Giro, both did quite a solid Tour. Kuss IMO had higher peaks in the Tour but that's also going into the Giro undercooked, etc

 

[Valv.Piti]

And now we have TdF Femmes and Glasgow to get through until the Vuelta starts.

Not bad, I say!

 

[Netserk]

Dual leadership to start.

I think Jumbo will treat this as unknown territory for Vingegaard, so they'll just see how good he is. And I think Vingegaard and Roglic have a good relationship so they'll make it work.

Vingegaard helping Rogla win his fourth Vuelta will also make it far easier to handle both of them in the Tour next year.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

After Pogi cracked on Loze, I think Hindley would have been 2nd without his crash. So I can't rank Evenepoel and especially not Ayuso above him yet.

Hindley was only seventh-best of the GC riders on Puy de Dôme, which was before his crash. I'm not convinced he would have finished third without it, let alone beaten Pogacar. IMO the only other rider who you could argue is top-5 is Thomas... who is also starting, which makes it 5 of the top-6 (although Thomas' form is always a bit enigmatic, of course).

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

I like it. He's a GT specialist that has marvelous regeneration, why shouldn't a Tour-Vuelta double work. Vingegaard is so good if this goes well, he might try the Giro-Tour double once.

 

[Red Rick]

Hindley was only seventh-best of the GC riders on Puy de Dôme, which was before his crash. I'm not convinced he would have finished third without it, let alone beaten Pogacar. IMO the only other rider who you could argue is top-5 is Thomas... who is also starting, which makes it 5 of the top-6 (although Thomas' form is always a bit enigmatic, of course).

2nd of the candidates for 3rd on Cauterets after being the only one trying to follow Vingegaard and Pogacar and winning after a 20km solo the day before. Also only beaten by Pidcock on Grand Colombier. He had over 2 minutes in hand before his crash. And on Puy de Dome, he dropped early in a head wind, and limited his losses very well compared to the likes of Yates, Pidcock and Rodriguez.

Then suddenly he loses ~2 minutes on Morzine and especially 2 minutes on Bettex where he was getting dropped by Majka.

I think you can argue Ayuso is a top 5 GT rider at this point, but to me that's a seperate discussion from Hindley losing his Tour podium due to a crash or not.

 

[Peter von]

Now that's a hard choice for his critics. Is he a Tour-centric July mega-peaker without passion for the sport, or is he too greedy going for the win in stage races throughout the year?

That’s the beauty of the system, either way you cannot win.

 

[Tim Cahill]

Was dropped quite early in Lombardia and given the run-around a bit by Mohoric and Onley in Croatia last autumn but I think there were some motivational factors involved after winning his first tour. Does seem a lot more assured this season and I think he can be a factor but there are too many top riders with much better prep here for him to win. This reminds me a bit of a Froome 2012 trial-run, who had to prepare specifically for the double years later in order to win it.

Pogacar's team said he wasn't doing it last week but perhaps he will change his mind given this development, bit of revenge maybe. Poor Ayuso was meant to be given a more relaxed GT for him to try and get his first win and it's going to be carnage.

 

[Rackham]

Smart decision. Jonas is very well suited for the Vuelta - the heat is a strength and the mountain stages this year are pretty hard. A lot better than what he has done post Tour previously.

Now, the interesting stuff is whether it's more of a Klöden-role or an actual dual leadership. I think the latter.

Dual leadership veering into sole leadership when Rogla is screwed on the Angliru.

Feels surreal to apply such conventional thinking to guys like Vingegaard.

I do think Pinot and Kuss, the two main riders that doubled up after the Giro, both did quite a solid Tour. Kuss IMO had higher peaks in the Tour but that's also going into the Giro undercooked, etc

Back in May you were saying Rog would be mad to do the Giro-Tour double. So I can assume he's a conventional rider to who conventional thinking applies? Okay. And if I come across as salty here, I really am. We all know how this works, i.e. dual leadership & talk like "I'll work for him I swear bla bla bla" means squat out on the road.

I get Jumbo's decision though, i.e. Vingegaard offers guarantees to get the treble (which is what they're really looking for this season, aka 3 wins in all 3 GT's). But as a Roglič fan it really looks like Vingegaard is gate-crashing someone else's party.

There's very few upsides for Rog in terms on intra-team politics, i.e. even in the event he beats Vinge, because the Tour winner can always say "I had the TdF in my legs" whereas Rog has had a full summer to prepare. And that's "if" he beats Vingegaard as well. Something which to me looks like a sort of mission impossible if Vinge unleashes his stage 16 ITT legs at any point.

 

[Red Rick]

Dual leadership veering into sole leadership when Rogla is screwed on the Angliru.



Back in May you were saying Rog would be mad to do the Giro-Tour double. So I can assume he's a conventional rider to who conventional thinking applies? Okay. And if I come across as salty here, I really am. We all know how this works, i.e. dual leadership & talk like "I'll work for him I swear bla bla bla" means squat out on the road.

I get Jumbo's decision though, i.e. Vingegaard offers guarantees to get the treble (which is what they're really looking for this season, aka 3 wins in all 3 GT's). But as a Roglič fan it really looks like Vingegaard is gate-crashing someone else's party.

There's very few upsides for Rog in terms on intra-team politics, i.e. even in the event he beats Vinge, because the Tour winner can always say "I had the TdF in my legs" whereas Rog has had a full summer to prepare. And that's "if" he beats Vingegaard as well. Something which to me looks like a sort of mission impossible if Vinge unleashes his stage 16 ITT legs at any point.

Giro-Tour for Roglic was entirely different, because 1) Giro-Tour is harder and 2) Roglic at his best hanging with Pogacar and Vingegaard seemed optimistic to me in the first place.

In hindsight Roglic could very likely have gotten 3rd or even a lucky 2nd.

 

[theyoungest]

Congrats to Jonas Vingegaard. Just too good when it mattered. Perfect preparation by him and JV.

But I do wonder if we could see how Vingegaard responds with some adversity. On the team side of things he has that all covered with JV. But you also need luck to win grand tours. When he is put on the back foot that will be very interesting how he responds physically and mentally.

He has had adversity, without it he might have been able to challenge for 3 Tour wins rather than 2. Remember he crashed on the stage where Pogi won the Tour in 2021, and after that he only gained time on him. Plus he went into that Tour as a domestique, but his leader crashed out. And he had a hampered prep due to injury, a bit like Pog this year.

Last year there's of course the cobbles stage, plus a stage in the final week where he crashed together with Benoot.

I think this year was unusual, at least during the Tour I don't think he's even had a flat tire. People always said during the Armstrong years "if you're good you don't crash" which I think is nonsense but certainly this year Vingegaard just seemed super-focused. So much so that in the final of yesterday's stage he just couldn't switch it off.

 

[yaco]

This is a 1-2 for the Vuelta if roglic and Vingegaard are in top form.

 

[Rackham]

Giro-Tour for Roglic was entirely different, because 1) Giro-Tour is harder and 2) Roglic at his best hanging with Pogacar and Vingegaard seemed optimistic to me in the first place.

In hindsight Roglic could very likely have gotten 3rd or even a lucky 2nd.

I reckon 2nd after Pog's implosion. That's "if" the race unfolded in the same sort of way.

Anyway, here's the confirmation of Vingegaard's Vuelta news:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1683055776561082368

View: https://twitter.com/BikeBlz/status/1683055776561082368

 

[tobydawq]

This is a 1-2 for the Vuelta if roglic and Vingegaard are in top form.

What if Ayuso and Remco are in top form?

And Vingegaard will probably not be in top form.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

What if Ayuso and Remco are in top form?

And Vingegaard will probably not be in top form.

Lefevere tomorrow "I think two GTs per year are too many for a young rider like Remco. He'll focus on one-day races before going to the Giro next year".

 

[Rackham]

What if Ayuso and Remco are in top form?

And Vingegaard will probably not be in top form.

Vingegaard will be in top form.

He wouldn't be going otherwise. Even the messaging would be different (they'd downplay his chances) because here he clearly says "co leader".

Vingegaard is a top GT star now. These guys don't race GT's just to ride support or not in condition to win.