Moncoutie

[luckyboy]

Odd? It's just cycling fans grasping at straws to keep the idea of clean cycling alive. The majority of fans are anti-doping to some degree, and to have to swallow the cynical pill of 'all riders dope' would be too much for them - it would be too much for the sport.

It's hardly grasping at straws. Who has said that every single professional cyclist dopes?

Take AGR yesterday for example - every single rider was dirty?

 

[veganrob]

Are we gonna have to post "before and after" pictures of every rider in the peloton now? Jeez.

Hmm. Maybe that is for another thread. Could be interesting.

 

[skippythepinhead]

"he doesn't look that much older"

Luckyboy said he doesn't look that much older. Anyone know whether that's the HGH or just good bone structure?

(edit: sorry this is veering off of Moncoutie, feel free to zap or move to the Before/After thread we should be revving up...)

 

[hrotha]

Yay pseudoscience!

Seriously, this is stupid.

 

[blackcat]

Luckyboy said he doesn't look that much older. Anyone know whether that's the HGH or just good bone structure?

have you seen him up close on tv. All the atrophy stuff like corticos, puts massive lines in your forehead. he does not look too good

lucky I dont have to shag him

 

[Benotti69]

the changing morphology is quite obvious on tv media.

Hugh, you get the visual illusion, the distance between his eyes and lips are larger as the bones have grown with the exogenous hormones, especially hgh

the distance between his eyes and lips are the same in both photos.

It is a bad comparison as in the top photo he is squinting his face and smiling and the photographer is taller so looking slightly down on Sastre whereas the bottom photo the camera is on a tripod (or smaller photographer) and the photo is from a lower angle.

His nose looks the same as you have to look really had in the bottom photo to see his full nose shape as it blends into his with the flat light.

All the above is not to say that i believe Sastre is or has ridden clean.

 

[blackcat]

good one dude

acromegaly can be imitated with growth androgens.

u know this guy, but the french swimmer's plates in his forehead are thickening worryingly, see it better in profile. the UFC fighters definition in their skull plates are worrying also

 

[blackcat]

the distance between his eyes and lips are the same in both photos.

It is a bad comparison as in the top photo he is squinting his face and smiling and the photographer is taller so looking slightly down on Sastre whereas the bottom photo the camera is on a tripod (or smaller photographer) and the photo is from a lower angle.

His nose looks the same as you have to look really had in the bottom photo to see his full nose shape as it blends into his with the flat light.

All the above is not to say that i believe Sastre is or has ridden clean.

actually no, see the current tv footage. Very different. Head's bones have changed the bone structure, no doubt about it. grown

 

[blackcat]

the biggest indictment, is seeing footage of athletes in similar sports, 25 years ago, where the declining utility of sports science, had produced the very close denouement of an athlete's form.

now, their body fat % is lower, the bones in the face are more prominent, jaws, foreheads, simian brows, see Ronnie Coleman for example.

Why could a 100metre runner, and even an Eddy Merckx and Badger Hinault, still carry intrafacial white tissue and muslce, cheeks, etc. Now growth factors and stuff like Clen, have stripped all the non-functional tissue in athletes.

 

[function]

the changing morphology is quite obvious on tv media.

Hugh, you get the visual illusion, the distance between his eyes and lips are larger as the bones have grown with the exogenous hormones, especially hgh

Aaah Internet physicians

 

[function]

the biggest indictment, is seeing footage of athletes in similar sports, 25 years ago, where the declining utility of sports science, had produced the very close denouement of an athlete's form.

now, their body fat % is lower, the bones in the face are more prominent, jaws, foreheads, simian brows, see Ronnie Coleman for example.

Why could a 100metre runner, and even an Eddy Merckx and Badger Hinault, still carry intrafacial white tissue and muslce, cheeks, etc. Now growth factors and stuff like Clen, have stripped all the non-functional tissue in athletes.

So you have never been below 8% body fat, if you had you would know it's possible without drugs, so that's a poor reason to accuse someone of doping. Find something else to grasp at.

 

[Mambo95]

actually no, see the current tv footage. Very different. Head's bones have changed the bone structure, no doubt about it. grown

Have you considered that the 'change' on the TV coverage is because it's now broadcast in HD? (Even if you don't have HD, the pictures are sharper). Everyone suddenly has more wrinkles and flaws.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Blackcat is correct.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:XbpkPN1G2JYJ:www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/harvey-reveals-his-battle-with-brain-tumour-20100612-y4r2.html+FREMANTLE+coach+Mark+Harvey+%22it+also+enlarged+his+hands%22&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=au&source=www.google.com.au


It also enlarged his hands, feet and nose, as well as his skull, brow and jaw


[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]I think blackcat is right
[/font]

 

[blackcat]

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:XbpkPN1G2JYJ:www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/harvey-reveals-his-battle-with-brain-tumour-20100612-y4r2.html+FREMANTLE+coach+Mark+Harvey+%22it+also+enlarged+his+hands%22&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=au&source=www.google.com.au


It also enlarged his hands, feet and nose, as well as his skull, brow and jaw


[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]I think blackcat is right
[/font]

zzzzing!

good research dude. I think I might use that in the future.

 

[blackcat]

check the pics of ronnie coleman and the plates on his browline fusing over his nose, growing and contacting eachother like my wisdom teeth

 

[blackcat]

u need some savant like quality wrt spacial/image recognition like Daniel Tammet. But if u have that narrow perception, quite easy to recognise.

 

[Mambo95]

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:XbpkPN1G2JYJ:www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/harvey-reveals-his-battle-with-brain-tumour-20100612-y4r2.html+FREMANTLE+coach+Mark+Harvey+%22it+also+enlarged+his+hands%22&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=au&source=www.google.com.au


It also enlarged his hands, feet and nose, as well as his skull, brow and jaw


[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]I think blackcat is right
[/font]

Yeah, because having a tumour of the pituitary gland and sticking a few HGH patches on are exactly the same.

Anyone who points to two photos years apart and says look at the change is a fool. Lighting will be the biggest factor in the change. General ageing will be second.

It's interesting that the cyclists and other sportsmen who are known to have taken HGH (Messi, Newton, Landis etc), really haven't changed.

Blackcat invited us to ask photographers to show us the way (knowing full well we don't know any). A good friend of mine is a surgeon who works mainly on facial reconstruction. He says acromegalia and 'atrophy' are very rare, like dying from eating peanuts. He says HGH generally won't make any change to the face (he doesn't recommend using it though)

 

[JMBeaushrimp]

check the pics of ronnie coleman and the plates on his browline fusing over his nose, growing and contacting eachother like my wisdom teeth

Wow! That's absurd...

 

[Spider1964]

Doesn't look to be packing too much heat in that red loin cloth?

 

[patricknd]

Doesn't look to be packing too much heat in that red loin cloth?

Checking that out, were you?

Not that there's anything wrong with that

 

[Spider1964]

HaHa... just checking for signs of steroid abuse... purely scientific research!

 

[Benotti69]

Wow! That's absurd...

+1 and i fail to see the point of it

 

[Le breton]

Doesn't look to be packing too much heat in that red loin cloth?

Hi Spider, I guess you would know considering that you come from Gode's own country
(if puzzled type "gode wikipedia" on google)

Back to topic : long live Moncoutié.

 

[User Guide]

[/QUOTE]
Back to topic : long live Moncoutié.[/QUOTE]
+1
Occam's Razor.........

 

[blackcat]

Yeah, because having a tumour of the pituitary gland and sticking a few HGH patches on are exactly the same.

Anyone who points to two photos years apart and says look at the change is a fool. Lighting will be the biggest factor in the change. General ageing will be second.

It's interesting that the cyclists and other sportsmen who are known to have taken HGH (Messi, Newton, Landis etc), really haven't changed.

Blackcat invited us to ask photographers to show us the way (knowing full well we don't know any). A good friend of mine is a surgeon who works mainly on facial reconstruction. He says acromegalia and 'atrophy' are very rare, like dying from eating peanuts. He says HGH generally won't make any change to the face (he doesn't recommend using it though)

Landis' browline is definitely thickened.

http://www.google.com/search?aq=f&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=hgh+acromegaly

show your "goodfriend" that.

... I am not a racist... but