New site design

[titan_90]

Ianfra - there are a couple of aspects about the new website that I've been told are firm. One is that spoilers are staying, the other is that we are not going back to the old website.

I understand some people won't agree with these decisions, but I am told that on these topics the decisions are final and am just communicating this to you so you're informed. I'm not putting it the way you claim - but equally, I'm not leading anyone on. The new website is the new website - there's no point me leading you to believe otherwise if that is hard and fast fact.

Thanks
Greg Johnson

Greg, none of my comments to you personally were meant as insults. There is understandably a lot of anger coming from your readers. But whoever or whomever made the decision about the spoilers are acting like a bunch of f***ing clueless fools.

As I and many other readers have stated the spoilers are a deal breaker for us unless some solution can be made. Like myself and others have suggested. Is it really that hard for the powers that be to understand that the no spoilers issue was one of if not the # 1 reason the old site was so popular even with it's outdated and hard to update design? It might not fit into the normal news site model but it worked and worked well. They have the opportunity to fill a niche market and be it's leader. There needs to be more originality in this world not less. But they seem to be shortsighted and just want to be like everyone else.

 

[I hate the new website]

It's not, under any circumstances, coming back.

Teething troubles aside, what we have now is a platform that allows Cyclingnews to grow both journalistically and as a business.

I'm not sure how you measure the growth of your business, but if it's based on site visits I hope that you have discovered an ample supply of new visitors out there somewhere to replace your core audience because after following your "teething troubles" for the first few days I am not willing to tolerate multiple clicks to get where I used to get in one click.
Pure and simple: you guys don't listen and so you can sink your own boat!

 

[Lones1]

Hi Greg

Don't you get it? You guys have brought an a la carte restaurant and turned it into McDonalds......

This was the only site without spoilers, you as an Aussie should realise that we don't all live in Europe, many of us are alseep when the races actually run! Geez, you won't even consider the spoilers, it's a done deal...

Is there any consideration to having a further tab with just the live ticker and no spoilers, so some of us can have that as our home page. I just want an uncomplicated answer to that question, Please

Thanks

 

[powerste]

I am trying to gain feedback on how we can improve the user experience within that context though.

Thanks
Greg Johnson

Greg,

It doesn't matter how you improve it within that context if we don't read it anymore (in any context), does it?

 

[coachkev]

Ianfra - there are a couple of aspects about the new website that I've been told are firm. One is that spoilers are staying, the other is that we are not going back to the old website.

I understand some people won't agree with these decisions, but I am told that on these topics the decisions are final and am just communicating this to you so you're informed. I'm not putting it the way you claim - but equally, I'm not leading anyone on. The new website is the new website - there's no point me leading you to believe otherwise if that is hard and fast fact.

I am trying to gain feedback on how we can improve the user experience within that context though.

Thanks
Greg Johnson

Ummm... Get rid of the spoilers and then maybe you will start receiving constructive feedback to make a kick **** new site! As long as there are spoilers then there is no sense in us giving feedback to improve a site that we will not be visiting. I understand that you are no the one who can make this decision, so I would suggest that whoever has that power be brought into the conversation that dominates the feedback over the new site. Are they aware what a HUGE DEAL BREAKER this is for so many loyal readers? I'll stick around another week to see if there is ever a rethink on the spoilers but if not then like so many others... it's sign out time for me. And, like many other readers I also am a potential advertiser.

 

[coachkev]

Ummm... Get rid of the spoilers and then maybe you will start receiving constructive feedback to make a kick **** new site! As long as there are spoilers then there is no sense in us giving feedback to improve a site that we will not be visiting. I understand that you are no the one who can make this decision, so I would suggest that whoever has that power be brought into the conversation that dominates the feedback over the new site. Are they aware what a HUGE DEAL BREAKER this is for so many loyal readers? I'll stick around another week to see if there is ever a rethink on the spoilers but if not then like so many others... it's sign out time for me. And, like many other readers I also am a potential advertiser.

Wow, the censoring is hilarious!! I used the kick 'but' with an extra 't' at the end of it and it was censored. Now, that is funny!!

 

[joelpace]

I don't understand...

In describing what the goal of the new design was, there are phrases like "for our loyal readers," and "to provide the same level of information but make it easier to access." The new website appears to be ignoring the overwhelming comment of this forum. Why? Bottom line: the redesign is a step backwards and an utter disappointment. One of the main problems with the new site is that it eliminated the ability to see the gallery of photos for a particular event. That was one of the best features of the old/better site. Also, the old/better site loaded a lot faster and was so much more lean.

If you truly want to incorporate the comments of your readers, I hope you make changes to go back to some form of the old/better site.

I also hope you don't move this comment to another part of the forum because you don't like what I have to say.

I used to get up every morning and read the old/better site. Now, I cannot stand going to the site because it is hard to navigate. Very sad.

 

[rlhlbrown]

Observations on new website format

Change doesn't come easy for us old folks. Here are some my observations/questions on the new website.
Are there stage maps and profiles for the Tour de Suisse?
Are there live reports for the this race?
If so, how does one find them?
Under the old format, one had the option of clicking on "live report" and following the race without knowing who won that stage. Now, you immediately see who won the stage; taking any suspense out of it if live reports are available.
The new location of the advertisements on the right side of the page seems (to me) to minimize the impact of the ads.
The old format made it easy to catch up on news, results, photos, results all one one page, with a minimum of paging. I almost never went to Velonews, as I thought your old layout was so much easier to navigate. Hmmm!
I will keep working on it, though....you folks do a great job.

 

[cycledan]

second that

I agree. I am looking for profile of the Tour de Suisse stages. I realize that you don't always have live coverage for all the races so no live report. However the first thing I look at is the profile for the upcoming stage.

Also, I don't like to have to click to expand the list for the GC. It takes much longer to load and then get the information I want than in the old format. I see how you wanted to update and have a cleaner more modern look. However the practical aspects are annoying. Pages don't always display correctly on my Windows 2000 machine here at home.

 

[joeags]

Is it just me, or are there no live reports anymore? And no stage details - as currently for the Tour de Suisse? I hate to sound nostalgic, but this is a real minus in quality of life.

Hi Greg

Don't you get it? You guys have brought an a la carte restaurant and turned it into McDonalds......

This was the only site without spoilers, you as an Aussie should realise that we don't all live in Europe, many of us are alseep when the races actually run! Geez, you won't even consider the spoilers, it's a done deal...

Is there any consideration to having a further tab with just the live ticker and no spoilers, so some of us can have that as our home page. I just want an uncomplicated answer to that question, Please

Thanks

Exactly, as I asked pages ago, just give us some freaking bone... keep your home page your beautiful "our coders rule" self and do something to help the apparent minority.

 

[Kazistuta]

There could be many valid reasons for changing the design, at least we're told so.

What I really can't comprehend is the fact that the men behind this overhaul can't grasp the fact that A LOT of their usual visitors don't like the spoiler parts and seemingly just ignores that fact. I'm pretty sure that it's a lot more that have expressed negative reactions to this than the amount of users responding earlier that they wanted a new design.

Personally I can tell you, Greg, Dan, Stefan etc., that I haven't been clicking any links on the frontpage in two days - for results I now go to the race pages or CQranking. If you keep this ignorant attitude up towards your "committed" users, I will only use the forum (which I've bookmarked) further on - as I'm sure several others will, based on the massive complaints I've read. Oh, btw.: Have YOU read the complaints?

 

[nonlocal]

races design ruining my surprises

i like to come in at the end of a day and walk through the "live" race reports before finding out who won. now, I get told as soon as I come to the site. this pretty much ruins 90% of what I come to CN for. am I missing something?

 

[badboyberty]

2/3 blank

It's not just about annoying spoilers.

Scrolling down through the "Mountain bike news" and after the first two stories I realise I'm constantly scrolling to read seven to eight words at a line, yet two-thirds of the page in front of me is empty.

Further, reading the Astana piece and between the picture of Lance Armstrong, the ads, and the wasted space, the content was down two three to five words a line. It's like reading a children's book.

Heads out of ***** people. It wasn't broke, now you need to fix it.

 

[bruni20]

Alternative site?

Being such a CN fan for so long, I do not really look at other cycling news websites for results etc. Does anyone have an alternative website that we can all perhaps defect to until these fools who supposedly "listened to the people" return it to the CN we knew and loved? Alternative websites please...

 

[Susan Westemeyer]

I have Safari on my Mac Book, and have no such problem......

Susan

 

[pedrospeeps]

Sad day

I am beginning to like the regular contributors more and more on this forum, Unfortunately I am loosing hope with the staff spokes people as I do not think they really are qualified to speak for the company. It is obvious that this sort of response to the new design was not fully anticipated or planed for, a bit like the website its self (it was not designed or planed in any way I am use too). I am not sure of the ages or experience of the team that could have possibly put this together but no one in the organization briefed them how to field positive and negative criticism, and they are taking this far too personally. The bottom line here is that in general we are all smarting because something that was great and wonderful has been taken away from us, and we are not sure what we did wrong. Did we not use the old site enough? Did we not read all the wonderful news items at all times, day and night? To cap this we have the good doctor telling us the new site was introduced for our benefit. It seems to me the new design was to make your jobs easier at the expense of your core readership and to boot you are not going to listen to anything or change anything, it is a done deal. It is very clear that the word from on high is disregard the forum, it will go away and we can have the site to ourselves, I just hope after the dust settles you have some readers left. I know a few disgruntled readers will not willing to write on this forum will not make much difference and I predict this thread will end soon as being far too boring and you will have a lot of other users saying how well they are getting on with the site. Good luck. I am slowly getting bored, but it was fun while it lasted.

Kind regards

Peter

 

[Anonymous]

ok.. i have actually been very thorough previously about what is wrong with this page, but for your benefit i will go through it again... i wasnt saying it was rubbish, although i think it is, it was merely a consise and effective way for someone from CN to communicate their agreement..

Thank you for providing two links.. it demonstrates my point superbly..

lets look at them side by side..

(am i imagining it or does advertising and white space outweigh content on the right hand picture.. i need to grab a ruler)

first lets look at the basics... Just how much text appears on the news page of the old news page, compared with the new.. its fairly obvious.. )thats ignoring the fact the actual text starts about an inch lower down because of the bloated new menu system.. again does that really need to be that big)

flaws with the new page...
firstly, why on earth is the edition archives box where it is.. it removes an entire 3rd of the page by it being there.. is a box of archives really more important than using the rest of the page wisely and effectively, or would it be better placed up to the top.. i dont even think thats a valid question because only a complete lunatic would put it where it is now.. it just doesnt follow any logic for it to be there..

my second comment was going to be about the article headers ,but someone seems to have tidied up the thrice repaeated date, time, author since yesterday...

font size and line spacing.. simply.. WHY.. if people are partially sighted they can zoom in, you may think its easier to read, but actually the eyes are confused by white space and find it harder to read.. double line spacing is only to be used for typing essays where the examiner wants to put comments in between the lines.. apart from that dont use it

im not even going to ask why [next edition] and [previous edition] links are in that order.. that is easily remedied and i assume will be very shortly..

by the time you get to the bottom half of the page you are looking at half a column of weirdly spaced text, and half a page of blank white space..

probably the most read page on the site and it looks awful, and i cant actually read it, it doesnt interest me.. it looks like it lacks depth, glosses over, its not good to look at..

as for the advertising, it is actually fact that using a few well placed, and relevant advertising boxes on a page is more effective than just walloping a ruddy great behemoth of them that people will avoid..

so do you agree it looks *****

so whats happening about this...? Ive still not really seen a reply... algeron (or whatever his name was..) neatly sidestepped the issue..

 

[Greg Johnson]

so whats happening about this...? Ive still not really seen a reply... algeron (or whatever his name was..) neatly sidestepped the issue..

The race sections are the main priority at the moment. Once they're ready for release other issues raised - like the whitespace one - will be looked at. I have definitely seen it in the summary notes that have been created off the back of this thread for further consideration.

Cheers
Greg Johnson

 

[Flower5000]

Pretty Pretty Please

If I ask nicely will you please Drop the spoilers?

I honestly can handle the rest of the redesign. I was totally fine with the old site (Bill where are you now?) ... but understand your reasons for the update, and even applaud the entire staff (well except for maybe that managing editor chap David ... I still think it a bit smug to tell us all so absolutely that the spoilers were here to stay. That might have been a bit hasty on his part ... I hope) for all of the hard work they've obviously put into the redesign.

But I have noticed that I am not visiting the site 10 times a day any longer since the redesign and it's because of the spoiler issue.

Is it really worth ruining the CN.com experience for so many of your readers just so you can pretend to be CNN.com instead of CN.com? Seriously, I'm not trying to be overly dramatic, but I like many of your readers (based on the forum ... and this is my first visit to the forum ... didn't care about the forum before as I hate forums and avoid them like the plague ... until today) ABSOLUTELY LOVED reading the live report so that the suspense of the race was kept intact ... why on earth would you want to take that away? Seriously ... that's what set you apart from the others and now your managing editor wants to make CN.com like all the others? That just seems silly (I am trying really hard to be nice ... can you tell?)

If you are going to continue to ruin the excitement of following a race from start to finish ... maybe one of your reporters could do a story on where to find a live race feed ... that is something I am dying to find out.

Cheers! or maybe not.

 

[Anonymous]

if you are gonna do spoilers can a page with all the live feeds on it be setup somwhere.. http://www.cyclingnews.com/live for instance.. not a hard job to have a basic page with links to all the current and prior live feeds in a list..

then at least people have a page they can bookmark...

 

[Lones1]

if you are gonna do spoilers can a page with all the live feeds on it be setup somwhere.. http://www.cyclingnews.com/live for instance.. not a hard job to have a basic page with links to all the current and prior live feeds in a list..

then at least people have a page they can bookmark...

We've already asked, several times and they're not answering....

 

[Anonymous]

We've already asked, several times and they're not answering....

would it be that hard for someone else then to create a webpage, that anyone could post links to, where each day the first person to "find" and i use that as a very general word, the link to the live feed can add the link to an active page..

in fact, i came across in another thread here this wonderful site http://www.bicyclelinks.info/
maybe they could be encouraged to add an extra box for links to external live feeds..

 

[fishtacos]

In response to the "spoilers are here to stay" edict from the mysterious upper management -

What made cyclingnews different from ALL other cycling websites was the lack of spoilers. Yes, you could get massive amounts of archived information, but how many people log on several times a day to go through the archives? With the old cyclingnews, you knew that you could catch up on any action that you'd missed, stage by stage, race by race, whenever you had five minutes to spare. You could read the live report before watching your taped or Tivo'd coverage, to find out what happened before the cameras started rolling. You could breeze through the flat stages if you wanted, and then sink your teeth into the mountainous ones - it was up to you, and it was still exciting, because you didn't know what was going to happen next.

Now, there's no reason for anyone to choose CN versus VeloNews or Pez or Bike Radar when you want to find out what happened. You'll have all the results right there on the front page of any of them, so you'll pick the one that's easiest to read and has the biggest pictures. Here's a hint - it's not the new CN.

It boggles the mind that a website with such strong brand identity - truly, the only website of its kind - would decide that the one thing it wanted to do was be just like everyone else.

 

[Lones1]

would it be that hard for someone else then to create a webpage, that anyone could post links to, where each day the first person to "find" and i use that as a very general word, the link to the live feed can add the link to an active page..

in fact, i came across in another thread here this wonderful site http://www.bicyclelinks.info/
maybe they could be encouraged to add an extra box for links to external live feeds..

Great idea if anyone knows how. I would use it, but it is a real shame it would be necessary, as Cyclingnews would still be getting the hits and not delivering the service.......

 

[Contralamontre]

This is ghastly - thruly ghastly

If anyone can read and navigate this site they need a Nobel prize. Go back sack you web designers and sack whoever made the descision to do this. It is truly dreadul.

I can only imagine that the hopeless cycling commentator David Duffield now dows web site creation......