Nordic Skiing/Biathlon Thread

Page 207 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.
Jan 3, 2016
99
0
0
Re:

bambino said:
I just watched THE moment 10 times from recording and it still has nothing to do with Toenshet. At least 5m between them on THE moment.

Not sure though why I entertain this discussion... It seems obvious that...
You watched the moment few seconds after the moment the pole was broken. At the moment you watched 10 times Toenseth indeed was few meters ahead of Sasha though you could not measure meters from the front view.
 
Re: Re:

Rider said:
bambino said:
I just watched THE moment 10 times from recording and it still has nothing to do with Toenshet. At least 5m between them on THE moment.

Not sure though why I entertain this discussion... It seems obvious that...
You watched the moment few seconds after the moment the pole was broken. At the moment you watched 10 times Toenseth indeed was few meters ahead of Sasha though you could not measure meters from the front view.
Nope. I watched 10 seconds before and after the incident, so I know exactly when it happened. It was Bolshu's 7th push after downhill. When he took his 1st push after dowhill, Toenseth was already in different lane several meters away. Actually Toenseth was already ahead of Bolshu 10 seconds before when the small downhill started. Maybe you should watch the recording again?
 
Bavarianrider said:
It doesn't matter how he broke his pole.
The moment they saw the Russian Coach running towards them with the pole they went full throttle. What a shameful shameful Display of unsportsmanship behavior.
But well, that's just typical Norwegians beahvior in XC skiing nothing new.
One of the Norwegians and/or Harvey was going to go for it on that section, no matter what. I do think that it was bush league to do that. It reminded me of Contador attacking Schleck in the 2010 tour when Schleck's chain came off. Contador said he never saw that. It was far more obvious today. I am probably going to get called an 'apologist' or something like that, so I'll say no further on the incident, it's just a pity that the tour and the overall will be decided on this. He lost 17 seconds at the finish and something like 43 overall. Now he's 52 behind Klaebo. He won't catch Klaebo unless Klaebo falters and Harvey helps Bolshunov in the chase, but Harvey won't do that, he rarely does and he definitely won't help a Russian. He'll sit as long as he can and then sprint the last few hundred, as he did today.
 
Re:

frenchfry said:
Poles break from time to time, and nobody waits when they do…

But carry on!
Absolutely. Nothing strange on that. I just can't stand the false accusations although don't fancy Norwegian domination either.

I do have to admit Bavarian is not exactly wrong either. Kleabo can be seen clearly noticing the Russian guy running with new pole and ups the pace significantly. On the other hand, as you said, nothing special on that. Business as usual.
 
Re

frenchfry said:
Poles break from time to time, and nobody waits when they do…

But carry on!
And nobody should wait. Part of the game.

Also bravo Nilsson. Gutsy effort to just roll the dice, say fokit, and try to hang on with Johaug. Glad it paid off.

Goes to show that aiming at a negative split, speeding up during the second half, or whatever is becoming a bad strategy. It’s pedal to the metal from the gun in the ladies races. Cant kick it? Too bad.

As an afterthought it was not too surprising to see SN win. Neuromuscular power and brute speed could on this track compensate her vo2max deficit, and this is why she could beat the distance specialists.
 
Re:

DenisMenchov said:
Well, Bolshunov still has everything in his legs, if he wins tomorrow, he (almost certainly) wins the World Cup no matter what.
He won't win tomorrow. You can't make up that much ground on such a mellow course. There are no significant climbs, it's 15km and it's fast conditions. He needed to get the bonus seconds and at least get on the podium. He didn't lose too much on the two bonus sprints but the broken pole and the 17 second deficit+bonus seconds at the finish sealed the overall. A gap of 10-15 seconds wouldn't have been too massive to close, but he would then need to shake Klaebo off. Now he needs to make up over 50 seconds just to get to Klaebo and then shake him off. If he does somehow catch him, it will be in the latter stages of the race, by then it'll be too late. Unfortunately Bolshunov just hasn't had the luck in these important head to head races this year. He skied a tactically good race in Holmenkollen, but that's about it as far as mass start races were concerned. Also, I do agree that the Russians don't employ the team tactics very well, if at all. They ought to for next season if they plan on winning the overall and the tour de ski. On the other hand they had a very small team here, only five men came and Belov didn't start yesterday because of sickness, so that brought the number down to four, and Melnichenko and Spitsov are better in skating than classic, so only Larkov was left to try and help Bolshunov. That just isn't going to work against 8 or 9 Norwegians all working for one man. It's like Pantani or Ullrich or Basso going up (without either only one or no teammates to help) against Armstrong and the entire USPS lineup. Good luck with that.
 
Jan 3, 2016
99
0
0
Re: Re:

BullsFan22 said:
Melnichenko and Spitsov are better in skating than classic, so only Larkov was left to try and help Bolshunov.
Melnichenko was good from the start but fell down during the race.
 
Jan 3, 2016
99
0
0
Re: Re:

roundabout said:
Watch his right pole at about second 2 of the video
Yeah, I see, but it's kind of hard to tell since his snow guard is partly white. But since it seems to be partly missing when he exits the curve after that I think you must be right.

Rider said:
Thank you! And who is next to it?

That's it!
That doesn't help you nor your friend who claimed he broke his pole. Toenseth still isn't close when it happens, and to do that damage he must have run over Bolshunov's snow guard which clearly doesn't happen even when they are close in the curve.
 
Jan 3, 2016
99
0
0
Re: Re:

MrRoboto said:
roundabout said:
Watch his right pole at about second 2 of the video
Yeah, I see, but it's kind of hard to tell since his snow guard is partly white. But since it seems to be partly missing when he exits the curve after that I think you must be right.

Rider said:
Thank you! And who is next to it?

That's it!
That doesn't help you nor your friend who claimed he broke his pole. Toenseth still isn't close when it happens, and to do that damage he must have run over Bolshunov's snow guard which clearly doesn't happen even when they are close in the curve.
Just look better. Seconds 2-4.


Second 1. Basket in place, you can see it against e-tron ad.

Second 5. Basket broken away, you can see the rest against Sasha's back.
 
Re: Re:

Rider said:
MrRoboto said:
roundabout said:
Watch his right pole at about second 2 of the video
Yeah, I see, but it's kind of hard to tell since his snow guard is partly white. But since it seems to be partly missing when he exits the curve after that I think you must be right.

Rider said:
Thank you! And who is next to it?

That's it!
That doesn't help you nor your friend who claimed he broke his pole. Toenseth still isn't close when it happens, and to do that damage he must have run over Bolshunov's snow guard which clearly doesn't happen even when they are close in the curve.
Just look better. Seconds 2-4.


Second 1. Basket in place, you can see it against e-tron ad.
The moment (for me) is at 18/19 seconds. Bolshunov's basket snaps at 31:31.6 race time. That's either Harvey from behind or simply deep/soft/heavy snow that does the damage. Yes, something may have happened before to loosen the basket and/or pole, but the moment it happens clearly is at 18/19 seconds in that clip you shared. The first plant you can see that his right arm goes up as if something happened and the second time his right side sinks more, that's when it's apparent that his pole/basket is snapped. Then Harvey makes a pass.

The incident that you and your friend talk about happens pretty quickly in the first couple seconds when Toenseth comes beside Bolshunov before the left handed turn. He does get quite close to the Russian, and maybe something happened there, but it's very difficult to see. I could see his left basket is intact when they are double poling on the lower sections of the climb, but his right isn't as visible, but then again, you would see the difference right away if something broke before that. Maybe it was hit prior to that and then really broke at 18/19 seconds as mentioned. Poles and baskets don't always break after one contact, sometimes it takes several crunches in the snow or by another pole or ski for it to snap. It may have been loosened before it actually broke.

What's obvious is that Klaebo clearly sees the Russian coach running with the spare poles down the hill to get it to Bolshunov. Once he sees that, there is an injection of pace, clearly. Obviously there are no rules on that, and that's fine, it doesn't mean it isn't bush league. Aukland on NRK said that they didn't see what happened, but the Coach was running down the hill, not from behind, they absolutely knew what had happened.
 
Re: Re:

BullsFan22 said:
Rider said:
MrRoboto said:
roundabout said:
Watch his right pole at about second 2 of the video
Yeah, I see, but it's kind of hard to tell since his snow guard is partly white. But since it seems to be partly missing when he exits the curve after that I think you must be right.

Rider said:
Thank you! And who is next to it?

That's it!
That doesn't help you nor your friend who claimed he broke his pole. Toenseth still isn't close when it happens, and to do that damage he must have run over Bolshunov's snow guard which clearly doesn't happen even when they are close in the curve.
Just look better. Seconds 2-4.


Second 1. Basket in place, you can see it against e-tron ad.
The moment (for me) is at 18/19 seconds. Bolshunov's basket snaps at 31:31.6 race time. That's either Harvey from behind or simply deep/soft/heavy snow that does the damage. Yes, something may have happened before to loosen the basket and/or pole, but the moment it happens clearly is at 18/19 seconds in that clip you shared. The first plant you can see that his right arm goes up as if something happened and the second time his right side sinks more, that's when it's apparent that his pole/basket is snapped. Then Harvey makes a pass.

The incident that you and your friend talk about happens pretty quickly in the first couple seconds when Toenseth comes beside Bolshunov before the left handed turn. He does get quite close to the Russian, and maybe something happened there, but it's very difficult to see. I could see his left basket is intact when they are double poling on the lower sections of the climb, but his right isn't as visible, but then again, you would see the difference right away if something broke before that. Maybe it was hit prior to that and then really broke at 18/19 seconds as mentioned. Poles and baskets don't always break after one contact, sometimes it takes several crunches in the snow or by another pole or ski for it to snap. It may have been loosened before it actually broke.

What's obvious is that Klaebo clearly sees the Russian coach running with the spare poles down the hill to get it to Bolshunov. Once he sees that, there is an injection of pace, clearly. Obviously there are no rules on that, and that's fine, it doesn't mean it isn't bush league. Aukland on NRK said that they didn't see what happened, but the Coach was running down the hill, not from behind, they absolutely knew what had happened.

Sorry, I mean his left pole is intact, not the right. It's obviously his right pole basket that snapped, not the left. Let's see if there are any quotes from the athletes so we can understand it better.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY