Official xc skiing world cup thread

[Nielsa]

and he did...wow, i don't recall a kick and glide sprint at the end of a 50K.

well done, eldar !

The Kollen finish is special as it slopes upward those last metres. Looked like Cologna was too late in switching to diagonal.

ANYWAY. NEUNER is doing the SECOND leg of the relay, wtf Germany?

 

[Nielsa]

Andrea Henkel

Tina Bachmann and Gössner shooting well.

Russia's young finishers keep doing mediocre legs... Garanichev/Malyshko and now Vilukhina.

Domracheva with a monster leg but just loses out on the podium.

I loved this race so much.
But as a mass start it has lost all its grace No it's just another boring 48km procesion with a 2km sprint in the end

I agree interval 50km is best, but at least the skiers get tired from skiing in the procession. Plenty skiers drop off during the last 10km (Hellner, Angerer etc), and look at Vylegzhanin, too tired to sprint past Sundby.

But yes I agree in Holmenkollen they should do an interval race.

 

[python]

The Kollen finish is special as it slopes upward those last metres.

that's what i thought...must be at least 7% if the double poling inertia can't lift them

ANYWAY. NEUNER is doing the SECOND leg of the relay, wtf Germany?

turned out to be the right positioning by the coaching staff - henkel's experience paid off.

a very impressive race for the bronze - we don't often see DOMRACHEVA outskied,,, berger's grit and guts prevailed over grace and efficiency.

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

I loved this race so much.
But as a mass start it has lost all its grace No it's just another boring 48km procesion with a 2km sprint in the end

FIS tells us german viewers don't understand interval starts. You get confused when the first guy to cross the finish line isn't the winner.

 

[meat puppet]

a very impressive race for the bronze - we don't often see DOMRACHEVA outskied,,, berger's grit and guts prevailed over grace and efficiency.

Indeed, but I guess Darya had been on the rivet for the whole leg before, so no surprise there. Plus Berger is always an incredible "puncheur" after the last shooting.

Anyhow, I was just watching Darya's last leg. Goodness gracious! Took a minute from Henkel (okay, she celebrated a bit but still - it's 6k)

An exciting race as a whole, too. Kaisa also shot quite well, only 1 miss. Looks promising for tomorrow.

And yeah, the Kollen finish was spectacular.

 

[jsem94]

Nah, it's because of Northug. Ever since Northug started owning the mass starts, there have been many more mass starts. Especially in Norway, they want it, because they want to have their own racers win at home.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Through most of last year she did leg 2, then switched to leg 4 for the Worlds because Henkel (who had been anchor all year) was out of form. This time around Neuner's been anchor all season, moves to 2 for the Worlds.

In the end it worked. Last year the Germans won the women's relay almost solely because of Neuner; this year they won it despite her; 0+3 and 1+3 easily the worst German performance; Bachmann was on very good form, and Miriam Gößner showed what she CAN be capable of - maybe Project Gößner can continue, because she showed glimpses of her prior pace whilst still shooting with (relative) accuracy; Andrea Henkel was typically reliable, not making any mistakes with the lead.

The French were good value for second place as well; Brunet was accurate and quick, Boilley was excellent today I thought, keeping her head when faced with Kuzmina and Neuner for company, Bescond did well, but was just unable to deal with Gößner's pace, and Dorin was safe as she always is. How she's never won a solo event I have no idea, certainly the best winless athlete on the circuit at the moment.

Norway were value for the bronze; Horn struggled somewhat as she has done all season (I feel she's not developed at all this season, while Ringen and Solemdal have made stupendous improvements) but the rest of the team were solid, and Tora Berger was her typically unyielding, uncompromising self, refusing to give way to a fast and furious Darya Domracheva at the end; when you saw a group come together at the start of leg 4, then you know Tora Berger's the one that will come out ahead with medals on the line.

Two consecutive 4th places for Belarus; while last year was heartache after Kalinchik melted at shooting 8 after they'd done all the hard work, this would have been more like Germany last year; Skardino, Kalinchik and Dubarezava limited their losses and handed over in about 8th place, 1'40 behind, and she pulled a minute back. She was unlucky not to get a medal, for sure (she shot quicker than usual and shot 0+0 and 0+0 too), but Norway just shade it as a team performance for my money.

A shame for Slovakia too, as they just don't have the strength in depth. Gerekova was again excellent today, Kuzmina is obviously their trump card, and Chrapanova was very tenacious.

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

Nah, it's because of Northug. Ever since Northug started owning the mass starts, there have been many more mass starts. Especially in Norway, they want it, because they want to have their own racers win at home.

Capol and Ulvang have actually said germans (or continentals in general) can't understand interval starts.

 

[Walkman]

Capol and Ulvang have actually said germans (or continentals in general) can't understand interval starts.

Yeah, but Capol and Ulvang are total idiots.

I mean, the germans can understand this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=r4CgOKBKdVE#t=54s

So why wouldn't they understand interval starts?

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Capol and Ulvang have actually said germans (or continentals in general) can't understand interval starts.

Which is of course completely idiotic, since the Germans love biathlon, and the only event which appears at all WC meets is the interval-start sprint format. They may feel it's less successful as a TV format, but they certainly understand it.

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

Yeah, but Capol and Ulvang are total idiots.

Which is of course completely idiotic.

That's the point I wanted to get across.

 

[zapata]

Which is of course completely idiotic, since the Germans love biathlon, and the only event which appears at all WC meets is the interval-start sprint format. They may feel it's less successful as a TV format, but they certainly understand it.

well, a quick poll of the two germans i know personally confirms that they do understand interval starts, but they find them mortally boring. They also prefer biathlon to normal skiing, regardless of format. Personally, I disagree very much, and don't really get excited about holmenkollen like i used to, but then in cycling, I find timetrials boring, go figure.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

well, a quick poll of the two germans i know personally confirms that they do understand interval starts, but they find them mortally boring. They also prefer biathlon to normal skiing, regardless of format. Personally, I disagree very much, and don't really get excited about holmenkollen like i used to, but then in cycling, I find timetrials boring, go figure.

I prefer biathlon too probably a legacy of my time living in Germany. When I was first watching it I found the Individual the least accessible format; now it might be my favourite. I think that the argument Germans don't understand interval starts is complete and utter hogwash, but I do understand the argument that they are less enjoyable as a TV format.

Also, biathlon and XC seem to approach interval starts in opposite ways. With biathlon it seems everyone wants to go out early, which often means that the result is fixed from the halfway point; you can then do your punditry, interviews and so on while the stragglers complete their rounds (you can always pick up on anybody interesting or doing a good time among them). With XC you often see the big names going at the end of the day, which means that you don't have that 'dead action time' like they have towards the end of the biathlon when they're showing some unheralded Estonian managing a time that gets her to 45th place with 20/20 shooting, but instead it's lengthy buildup for the last few people (like a cycling ITT). This of course has the problem of being effectively joined-in-progress, because the early skiers sometimes are before we come on air in some countries. Certainly this happens from time to time in Germany. Similarly, there is a level of feeling that Nordic Combined is little more than a staggered-start XC race, because the ski jumping portion of the event is sometimes not shown, or only shown in highlight form.

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

Ekholm to retire.

http://translate.google.se/translat.../14744.blogg.html?visainlagg=4455&action=read

I find XC skiing mass starts to be about as exciting and eventful as a TdF sprint stage (and about as unpredictable if a certain norwegian is in the race) with few exceptions. Bavarianrider's description of the Holmenkollen mass start is pretty accurate.

 

[roundabout]

One of the disappointments of the day was seeing the second round of NC ski jumping cancelled.

It's probably a less exciting race for the fans, but I kind of miss the old 2 rounds of ski jumping + 15km format of the NC.

 

[jsem94]

Neuner and Ekholm gone. I guess Darya will completely dominate next season.

 

[Bavarianrider]

FIS tells us german viewers don't understand interval starts. You get confused when the first guy to cross the finish line isn't the winner.

Sadly that's propably true for a good junk of the german spectators.

But i really don't undertsand why the Norwegians don't insist on the 50km in Oslo to be an individual start

 

[jsem94]

They want an easy Northug win. Norwegian win on Norwegian soil. That's why I think though, take it with a grain of salt.

Northug wasn't here this year though, but luckily they got their win.

 

[goggalor]

Ekholm to retire.

http://translate.google.se/translat.../14744.blogg.html?visainlagg=4455&action=read

I find XC skiing mass starts to be about as exciting and eventful as a TdF sprint stage (and about as unpredictable if a certain norwegian is in the race) with few exceptions. Bavarianrider's description of the Holmenkollen mass start is pretty accurate.

While I prefer individual starts, I find mass starts (at least the 50 km) more entertaining than a sprint stage. Often it's more similar to a Flèche Wallonne type of race, in that it is typically decided in the last 10 minutes, but the sprint isn't between the fastest skiers, but the fastest of the best all-rounders. Also, it's not like it's a mass sprint. Today Rønning and Cologna were strong enough to gap everyone else, and the field behind arrived in pieces.

But I'd love to see some of the slower skiers challenge Cologna, Northug and Vylegzhanin for the win in an old school individual start (with loooong laps). And my impression is that is what most XC skiing fans want to see in Holmenkollen, especially Norwegians.

 

[jsem94]

Yup. I want to see that. There used be the 17km long lap - perfect for individual start. But they want tv cameras everywhere for the mass start, so you get short laps.

But remember - Northug won the 30km individual start early in the season in BIG style. So he's by no means bad at ind. start.

 

[hoerpi]

The woman 30 km mass start really shows that there's a huge difference among the riders, still I prefer this race with alot of small groups compared to the men's 50 km.

 

[Bavarianrider]

I agree.
Although with woman like Björgen who are build like the incredible Hulck, there's always a mixed feeling.

 

[meat puppet]

agree with hörpi. hope johaug does her thing on the slopes, but since it's a classic race, björgen and kowa will probably not drop.

 

[hoerpi]

I agree.
Although with woman like Björgen who are build like the incredible Hulck, there's always a mixed feeling.

This is the downside. It's a wonderful battle going on between Justina and Johaug right now, too bad they are one minute down on Björgen...

 

[python]

i was uneasy with this statement of mine
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showpost.php?p=810737&postcount=423
and a comment it caused.

.......so I decided to review the finish video again
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysQ03DH7bvE

roenning and cologna in the clear after the last downhill

at 14 seconds cologna steps over to a parallel track and begins his furious double poling sprint
at 19 seconds cologna starts clearly pulling ahead….
by 24th second cologna is ahead by a half-ski (just under a meter)
at 25 seconds - the key moment - roening swithes to striding whilst cologna still double poling. . Note this is still 9 seconds (or about 70 meters) to the finish line. The terrain is slightly upward but nothing like at the finish line. cologna planted 4 ‘doubles’ before he switched to striding too (about 4 seconds). During this time he lost his 1 meter advantage completely.

note that in the background vylegzhanin switch to striding way before sundby who double poled almost all the way to bronze.

the long story short - it was more, much more than an an uphill finish that resulted in the highly unusual striding sprint win for roenning.

It was a combination of (1) slushy snow, (2) superior classic technique and, yes, (3) upward finish

and to prove my analysis, justyna just double poled all the way up the same finish to take silver