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OTC 'Juice'.

Oct 28, 2009
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Been lurking here for awhile, waiting for a worthy topic for my first post :p

After lunch today one of my coworkers needed to stop at Vitamin World to get some preworkout drink mix. So I walk in with him and follow him to the back where he grabs a box of the shelf, something called Dark Rage. The guy who was working there came up and started talking to him, and I wasnt really paying attention to anything in particular. But then the employee said, "Oh, that stuff there is great! It has something called EPO in it. It does something with your blood."

I started paying attention at that point and picked up one of the boxes. And sure enough on the front it said "EPO Blood Doping Technology". Now, Im fairly certain this stuff is a little different (less potent) than the EPO everyone bought in Italy circa ~94, but it got me thinking. How are we ever going to get clean competition if the very stuff we try and prevent athletes from using, in one form or another, is sold and advertised OTC to the general public? How do you effectively convince a young athlete, who grows up buying supplements from a Vitamin World, to not "dope" using supplements that are sold legally?

And as a silly side note, I joined in the conversation at that point, and started saying that synthetic EPO was illegal in some sports. And the guy who worked there said, "Of course, anything that works is a steroid. Thats why they work, cause there steroids. Its no big deal."
 
Oct 22, 2009
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I'm no expert on this stuff. The key ingredient appears to be Epidrol.

http://www.pumphousenutrition.ca/vmchk/Pre-Workout/MHP-Dark-Rage-894-G.html

I'm bored, so I read a few google results. This one made me laugh:
Sides experienced due to the Epidrol:
Painful back pumps when working out & some tightness in back usually 30mins after dosage.
Libido was fine throughout with a slow decrease of testicular size and amount of ‘load’ produced. No total shutdown experienced.
Face was oilier then usual with some increase in the amount of whitehead acne on forehead & shoulders.
Good: strength increased nicely (which is what I really wanted), added a few pounds of lbm as a hard gainer and side effects were minor.

http://www.bodybuildingdungeon.com/forums/supplements/33666-epidrol.html

As an avid weight lifter, I am always surprised at the lengths people will go.
As a scientist, I am disgusted by the claims product makers can get away with, and at forum posts made by pseudo-scientists testing products by how they make them feel.

I'm hoping someone more knowledgeable in this stuff will chip in their $0.02 on the list of ingredients.
 
Oct 22, 2009
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Ginko, caffeine, creatine....jeez.

Allergen Warning: Contains Milk, Egg And Fish Gelatin (Cod, Pollock, Haddock, Hake, Cusk, Redfish, Sole And Flounder)

Add in some potatoes and you have yourself a good stew.
 
Mar 11, 2009
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I'm assuming most people here have seen the film/documentary 'Bigger, stronger, faster'.

The 3 brothers are imo a perfect example for the whole of society. One denounces steroids entirely, the second is ok with it up to a certain degree and the third just went crazy with it.
 
Jun 18, 2009
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If you look at the ingredients list it says

EPODROL™: EPO Plasma Red Blood Cell Stimulator:
Glucose Polymers, Blood Building Vitamin And Mineral Complex, Aracidonic Acid, Nattokinase, Echinacea (Angustifolia, Purpurea), Portulaca Oleracea (Standardized Flavones), Glycerol Monostearate, Albumin, Cobalt (As Amino Acid Chelate), Nickel

The "EPODROL" is simply a mixture glucose, vitamins and herbal supplements. It does not contain EPO, except in the name of the mixture. Regardless, even if it did contain EPO, it would be degraded in the digestive tract since this "Dark rage" stuff is taken orally. Like almost every supplement, it is just a bunch of stuff you can buy at the supermarket mixed together, and then put in a container with a bunch of buzz words on the label. Waste of money!
 
ak-zaaf said:
I'm assuming most people here have seen the film/documentary 'Bigger, stronger, faster'.

The 3 brothers are imo a perfect example for the whole of society. One denounces steroids entirely, the second is ok with it up to a certain degree and the third just went crazy with it.
What about the one that is not OK with it but does not denounce it.:)
 
Jun 18, 2009
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luckyboy said:
They would test positive for EPO though.

No you wouldn't. EPO is a protein. So, if it were in solid form, either in a table or a capsule, ingesting it would subject it to the digestive process. This process would consume the EPO like any other protein. None of it would make it to your small intestine to be absorbed. As such, it would not become bioavailable and would not have any systemic effect whatsoever. That's why it only sold as an injectable.
 

Sprocket01

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Oct 5, 2009
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Yeah it's junk. There are loads of them out there....
http://www.epoboost.com

However, there is a socalled 'prohormone' category of supplements that bodybuilders use that are similar compounds to illegal steroids but aren't banned yet. Every time a compound is banned they come out with a new one that is similar. They potentially have some of the same side effects as steroids such as testicular atrophy and excessive estogen leading to man boobs, so you have to be careful. It's got nothing to do with EPO though.

The best legal supplement for endurance sports, that I know of, is beetroot juice. That's what I take! :)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8186947.stm
 
What's really funny to me is that the majority of the people I've met who take these supplements eat like crap. Eating your fruits and veggies (and getting enough sleep) is probably the second best thing you can do besides the actual training you do.
 
Sep 25, 2009
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Sprocket01 said:
Yeah it's junk. There are loads of them out there....
http://www.epoboost.com

However, there is a socalled 'prohormone' category of supplements that bodybuilders use that are similar compounds to illegal steroids but aren't banned yet. Every time a compound is banned they come out with a new one that is similar. They potentially have some of the same side effects as steroids such as testicular atrophy and excessive estogen leading to man boobs, so you have to be careful. It's got nothing to do with EPO though.

The best legal supplement for endurance sports, that I know of, is beetroot juice. That's what I take! :)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8186947.stm
sprakah again you're shooting your mouth w/o the necessary research or knowledge. stick to asking questions. ok?

all 'prohormones' are banned by wada under the 'anabolic androgenic steroids' chapter s1 .
check it out with your own eyes sprakah.
http://www.wada-ama.org/rtecontent/document/2009_Prohibited_List_ENG_Final_20_Sept_08.pdf

they all are easily tested for. heard of dhea for ex and tyler hamilton testing for it?

dhea is the most abused prohormone that unfortunately can be purchase freely in the us. as well as andro and dht.
 

Sprocket01

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Oct 5, 2009
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python, yes I'm aware that prohormones are banned in most professional sports. I was refering to law and enforcement authorities in nation states. Sorry for any confusion. As you highlight, many of these compounds are legal depending on where you are. Probably the most famous one was Androstenedione, made famous by baseball player Mark McGwire. It is now illegal in the US but many have taken its place.
 

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