Politics in Sports

[King Boonen]

It was more a question of why you didn't voice the opinion when the original discussion came up, considering you were posting in the thread at the time.

Do I really have to explain how the Israeli government is using the Giro for political point-scoring and the impact this could have on the race? It seems really, really obvious to be honest.

 

[jmdirt]

Re:

It was more a question of why you didn't voice the opinion when the original discussion came up, considering you were posting in the thread at the time.

Do I really have to explain how the Israeli government is using the Giro for political point-scoring and the impact this could have on the race? It seems really, really obvious to be honest.

The posts above are talking about politics.<That's a period. They aren't talking about how politics are affecting or will affect the race.

I didn't question it before because I hoped that people would realize that they should post this topic in World Politics or a Mod would direct them to do so.

Every country who hosts an event is buying political capitol, but that's not the point of this discussion nor or this thread.

 

[King Boonen]

viewtopic.php?p=2252352#p2252352

viewtopic.php?p=2252370#p2252370

viewtopic.php?p=2252378#p2252378

All three of these posts are, in some way discussing how this use of the Giro for political gain might affect the race, especially if we consider that Froome's large appearance fee is no doubt funded in some way by the money the Israeli government is paying. How about the forced change of the stage 1 location naming from West Jerusalem to Jerusalem. Clearly an attempt to use the Giro as a "political pawn", to quote your first post.

We could discuss the recent deaths of Palestinian protestors and how hosting events like this are a way to draw attention away from these actions.

We could discuss articles like this:

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/giro-ditalia-palestinian-amputee-cyclist-condemns-race1657653742

This seems like the place to discuss this. We can move it to a new thread if it really bothers you?

 

[Scott SoCal]

Re:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/viewtopic.php?p=2252352#p2252352

viewtopic.php?p=2252370#p2252370

viewtopic.php?p=2252378#p2252378

All three of these posts are, in some way discussing how this use of the Giro for political gain might affect the race, especially if we consider that Froome's large appearance fee is no doubt funded in some way by the money the Israeli government is paying. How about the forced change of the stage 1 location naming from West Jerusalem to Jerusalem. Clearly an attempt to use the Giro as a "political pawn", to quote your first post.

We could discuss the recent deaths of Palestinian protestors and how hosting events like this are a way to draw attention away from these actions.

We could discuss articles like this:

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/giro-ditalia-palestinian-amputee-cyclist-condemns-race1657653742

This seems like the place to discuss this. We can move it to a new thread if it really bothers you?

Seems like the Giro start in Israel is drawing attention to these actions, not away from.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/viewtopic.php?p=2252352#p2252352

viewtopic.php?p=2252370#p2252370

viewtopic.php?p=2252378#p2252378

All three of these posts are, in some way discussing how this use of the Giro for political gain might affect the race, especially if we consider that Froome's large appearance fee is no doubt funded in some way by the money the Israeli government is paying. How about the forced change of the stage 1 location naming from West Jerusalem to Jerusalem. Clearly an attempt to use the Giro as a "political pawn", to quote your first post.

We could discuss the recent deaths of Palestinian protestors and how hosting events like this are a way to draw attention away from these actions.

We could discuss articles like this:

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/giro-ditalia-palestinian-amputee-cyclist-condemns-race1657653742

This seems like the place to discuss this. We can move it to a new thread if it really bothers you?

Seems like the Giro start in Israel is drawing attention to these actions, not away from.

Really? Got any articles you could point me to? I've seen little to no coverage in the UK press discussing the issue with regard to the Giro and I've seen no increase in articles discussing the situation. Possibly it's mentioned in US news sources?

Remember that Land Day was on the 30th March and there are six weeks leading up to the anniversary of the Nakba that almost always sees increased protests and, as such, increased violence towards these protests.

There is this on the Telegraph (paywall so I can't read it) but what I can read does not fill me with hope...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cycling/2018/05/02/giro-ditalia-2018-starting-israel-controversy-worth-risk/

The Guardian currently has nothing on their main cycling page and you would think if any major outlet in the UK would then it would be them.

 

[Scott SoCal]

Re: Re:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/viewtopic.php?p=2252352#p2252352

viewtopic.php?p=2252370#p2252370

viewtopic.php?p=2252378#p2252378

All three of these posts are, in some way discussing how this use of the Giro for political gain might affect the race, especially if we consider that Froome's large appearance fee is no doubt funded in some way by the money the Israeli government is paying. How about the forced change of the stage 1 location naming from West Jerusalem to Jerusalem. Clearly an attempt to use the Giro as a "political pawn", to quote your first post.

We could discuss the recent deaths of Palestinian protestors and how hosting events like this are a way to draw attention away from these actions.

We could discuss articles like this:

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/giro-ditalia-palestinian-amputee-cyclist-condemns-race1657653742

This seems like the place to discuss this. We can move it to a new thread if it really bothers you?

Seems like the Giro start in Israel is drawing attention to these actions, not away from.

Really? Got any articles you could point me to? I've seen little to no coverage in the UK press discussing the issue with regard to the Giro and I've seen no increase in articles discussing the situation. Possibly it's mentioned in US news sources?

Remember that Land Day was on the 30th March and there are six weeks leading up to the anniversary of the Nakba that almost always sees increased protests and, as such, increased violence towards these protests.

There is this on the Telegraph (paywall so I can't read it) but what I can read does not fill me with hope...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cycling/2018/05/02/giro-ditalia-2018-starting-israel-controversy-worth-risk/

The Guardian currently has nothing on their main cycling page and you would think if any major outlet in the UK would then it would be them.

Sorry. Anecdotal and my perception.. and it's not only limited to recent deaths of Palestinian protesters. I can't think of a rider interview I've read where the question of of the start location wasn't asked about. Dumoulin/Velonews. Andy Hood discusses the Israel start as well.

I was at the Tour of Flanders this year and spoke with a Belgian friend who runs a big cyclo tour organization. He was telling me how good business has been, how slammed he is and how he was very worried about having zero Giro bookings. Last year he was nearly sold out by the first weekend in April. This year he had nada. We talked about possible reasons for this and you can probably guess what his thought on the matter were.

 

[King Boonen]

No worries, perception is fine with me as that's largely what I'm going off too. I've not read any rider views on the start, I'll check out Dumoulin on Velonews, I've avoided anything Giro related.


Interesting anecdote about the Tours. I assume we mean tours to Italy? If not and you do mean Israel, was his thinking it was security or political reasons for lack of bookings?

 

[Scott SoCal]

Re:

No worries, perception is fine with me as that's largely what I'm going off too. I've not read any rider views on the start, I'll check out Dumoulin on Velonews, I've avoided anything Giro related.


Interesting anecdote about the Tours. I assume we mean tours to Italy? If not and you do mean Israel, was his thinking it was security or political reasons for lack of bookings?

He has several different possibilities for Giro related tours. As of about 30 minutes before Terpstra crossed the finish line in Oudenaarde he had zero bookings and was a bit freaked over it. Not sure how it's turned out.

 

[jmdirt]

Re:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/viewtopic.php?p=2252352#p2252352

viewtopic.php?p=2252370#p2252370

viewtopic.php?p=2252378#p2252378

All three of these posts are, in some way discussing how this use of the Giro for political gain might affect the race, especially if we consider that Froome's large appearance fee is no doubt funded in some way by the money the Israeli government is paying. How about the forced change of the stage 1 location naming from West Jerusalem to Jerusalem. Clearly an attempt to use the Giro as a "political pawn", to quote your first post.

We could discuss the recent deaths of Palestinian protestors and how hosting events like this are a way to draw attention away from these actions.

We could discuss articles like this:

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/giro-ditalia-palestinian-amputee-cyclist-condemns-race1657653742

This seems like the place to discuss this. We can move it to a new thread if it really bothers you?

First, those "three" are the same post with replies, second, they are from a few days ago, third they don't discuss how politics are affecting the Giro (unless the long transfer is "political").

The Giros roll in distracting from, or bringing attention to Israel isn't politics in sports, its world politics, IMO.

EDIT: Are the athletes taking a political stand? Are politicians responding to or reacting to the athletes? Are politicians taking action based on the athletes' action? That is politics in sport IMIO. The Giro starting in Israel is an athletic event taking place in a politically charged area at this point. Now, it could become something else, but at this point it isn't. Plus, just for giggles I asked 10 of my coworkers at the lunch table today if they knew where the Giro D' Italia was starting this year, and only one even knew what the Giro was let alone where it was starting. By the way, she said "Rome?".

I've officially hijacked my own thread by protesting its incorrect use! :lol:

 

[Jagartrott]

Re:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/viewtopic.php?p=2252352#p2252352

viewtopic.php?p=2252370#p2252370

viewtopic.php?p=2252378#p2252378

All three of these posts are, in some way discussing how this use of the Giro for political gain might affect the race, especially if we consider that Froome's large appearance fee is no doubt funded in some way by the money the Israeli government is paying. How about the forced change of the stage 1 location naming from West Jerusalem to Jerusalem. Clearly an attempt to use the Giro as a "political pawn", to quote your first post.

We could discuss the recent deaths of Palestinian protestors and how hosting events like this are a way to draw attention away from these actions.

We could discuss articles like this:

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/giro-ditalia-palestinian-amputee-cyclist-condemns-race1657653742

This seems like the place to discuss this. We can move it to a new thread if it really bothers you?

Exactly this.
I wonder if they will show lovely helicopter shots of the open-air prison that is Gaza in stage 2, when they come quite close to it.

Cycling is used for political white-washing. Pretty disgusting.

 

[jmdirt]

Re: Re:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/viewtopic.php?p=2252352#p2252352

viewtopic.php?p=2252370#p2252370

viewtopic.php?p=2252378#p2252378

All three of these posts are, in some way discussing how this use of the Giro for political gain might affect the race, especially if we consider that Froome's large appearance fee is no doubt funded in some way by the money the Israeli government is paying. How about the forced change of the stage 1 location naming from West Jerusalem to Jerusalem. Clearly an attempt to use the Giro as a "political pawn", to quote your first post.

We could discuss the recent deaths of Palestinian protestors and how hosting events like this are a way to draw attention away from these actions.

We could discuss articles like this:

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/giro-ditalia-palestinian-amputee-cyclist-condemns-race1657653742

This seems like the place to discuss this. We can move it to a new thread if it really bothers you?

Exactly this.
I wonder if they will show lovely helicopter shots of the open-air prison that is Gaza in stage 2, when they come quite close to it.

Cycling is used for political white-washing. Pretty disgusting.

So are you saying that the open air prison is because of cycling, and/or because the Giro is in Israel?

EDIT: If Netanyahu starts talking about putting doping cyclists in the open air prison then we've got something.

 

[Archibald]

The Kaep saga continues... https://www.bbc.com/sport/american-football/45407340
Dude can't get a break

 

[King Boonen]

The Kaep saga continues... https://www.bbc.com/sport/american-football/45407340
Dude can't get a break

I have huge respect for Nike for doing this.

 

[Escarabajo]

The Kaep saga continues... https://www.bbc.com/sport/american-football/45407340
Dude can't get a break

What do you mean by can't get a break?
Isn't he making millions over this?
And people already supporting his position?
On the contrary he is having a big break!

 

[jmdirt]

The Kaep saga continues... https://www.bbc.com/sport/american-football/45407340
Dude can't get a break

I have huge respect for Nike for doing this.

Yes, big props to Nike. Have you seen the new add? Kaep is only the end of a great promo.

 

[King Boonen]

Not yet, I’ve seen a list of a few of the people in it but will have to search it out on YouTube.

 

[Merckx index]

The NFL has settled with Kaepernick, and Eric Reid. Apparently gave them a lot of money (the amount is a very tightly-guarded secret, but some sportswriters have speculated it could be tens of millions) just to shut up and go away. The NFL is basically admitting they colluded, which is quite unusual. Remember, they fought Brady's case all the way. I don't know how this affects Kaep's chances of signing with some team.

https://sports.yahoo.com/sources-colin-kaepernick-withdraws-collusion-case-nfl-190149703.html

So Kaepernick wins in one sense, but what about his cause, free speech? In addition to dropping the case in return for money, it's also being reported that Kaepernick wanted $20 million to play in the new football league, AAF. The typical salary for players in this league is $75,000 a year. None of this is doing his image a lot of good, it makes it look like his case against the NFL was all about money.

http://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/colin-kaepernick-wanted-20-million-to-play-for-aaf-per-report/1ppf0e0knfc9c15etextlvg7ub

 

[veganrob]

We will never know exactly but I heard 60-80 million

 

[Koronin]

As the case is sealed, we'll never know, but 60-80 million wouldn't surprise me.

He's never going to get 20 million in the AAF. They don't have that kind of money.

 

[Unchained]

Re:

As the case is sealed, we'll never know, but 60-80 million wouldn't surprise me.

He's never going to get 20 million in the AAF. They don't have that kind of money.

It's really sad that this has ended this way..he said over and over it wasn't about money but instead a deeply held principle..
So a secret is part of that..?

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

As the case is sealed, we'll never know, but 60-80 million wouldn't surprise me.

He's never going to get 20 million in the AAF. They don't have that kind of money.

It's really sad that this has ended this way..he said over and over it wasn't about money but instead a deeply held principle..
So a secret is part of that..?

It shouldn't be sealed. Well that's my opinion. I'd love to know what all is in the settlement.

 

[jmdirt]

I don't disagree with what others have already typed, but another way to look at it is that the NFL just wants the issue to go away (*not admitting guilt), and CK might use the money (some of the money) to further his cause. I heard $25 Mil for CK and $15 Mil for ER. $60-80 Mil could REALLY do some good!

*They aren't going to do that no matter what.

EDIT: an attorney quote by ESPN thinks the settlement is in the $10 Mil range.

 

[veganrob]

Collusion was going to be very hard to prove. The NFL settled because they just didn't want their dirty, scumbaggery tricks exposed.

 

[jmdirt]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26063456/eight-ole-miss-players-kneel-anthem-response-confederacy-rally

 

[jmdirt]

So let me read between the lines here and assume that "THE Church" just couldn't handle Floyd's Cycling in the ToU. The crazy part is that "THE Church" can't handle the evils of CBD, but they're OK with beer!?

Oh well, I'm glad that the team is in!