Rant about amature dopers

[chase196126]

So I just looked at the cutting edge muscle forum. I am absolutely sickened by the people who post on that site and their mentalities. Using doping products to improve your performance just for the sake of it is one thing, but competing while doped is simply unforgiveable. These jerks justify their use of PEDs in Masters and other low level racing because "all the top competition is doing it".

Pro riders aside for a moment. If you are an amateur rider and need doping to compete at the Masters or cat 2,3,4 level you are absolutely pathetic. If you cant compete without cheating you shouldn’t play the game. There are rules in place to make the game work, and if you dont follow them what is the point in playing? Is monopoly any fun if you show up to the game with a wad of fake $500 bill stuffed up your shirt sleeve, just so you can demolish the other players?

I wish there was a way for USADA or WADA to investigate that site and go after some of the posters there. They deserve to be banned from the sport for a long while.

EDIT: Sorry about the miss spelled "Amateur" in the title... Little slip up there.

 

[Ripper]

Dingle dongle dingle dongle.

Someone's calling.

Goulet!

 

[forty four]

yeah i myself question whether some amateur racers dope the nature of competitive cycling would suggest plenty do. im a cat3 in socal the fields are big and its competitive im sure there are a few who do dope it would anger me to no end if i knew i lost a race to someone cheating.

 

[MacRoadie]

yeah i myself question whether some amateur racers dope the nature of competitive cycling would suggest plenty do. im a cat3 in socal the fields are big and its competitive im sure there are a few who do dope it would anger me to no end if i knew i lost a race to someone cheating.

You already have...

 

[Libera]

I post on that site...guess I should be banned from the human race and for good measure send me to the gallows. I am such a horrible person.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

I post on that site...guess I should be banned from the human race and for good measure send me to the gallows. I am such a horrible person.

If you're doping to win amateur races, you're a douchebag. If not, I doubt the OP was referring to you.

 

[Hairy Wheels]

I brought this up in a forum a few years ago. If you follow the postings of some people on CEM you can get a pretty good idea of where they might be from, mostly from the US (definitely Socal and Colorado) but with some Canuck dopers thrown in for good measure. Boggles the mind.

 

[Libera]

If you're doping to win amateur races, you're a douchebag. If not, I doubt the OP was referring to you.

Oh, now while taking me to the gallows, be sure to write Douchebag on my head for all to see.

Seriously folks, it is cycling nothing more nothing less.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Oh, now while taking me to the gallows, be sure to write Douchebag on my head for all to see.

You've apparently written it yourself.

Seriously folks, it is cycling nothing more nothing less.

Seriously, it's cheating, nothing more, nothing less. But, it's funny to see losers spending their cash on doping products just so they don't get smoked in the local weekly crits.

 

[Deagol]

I brought this up in a forum a few years ago. If you follow the postings of some people on CEM you can get a pretty good idea of where they might be from, mostly from the US (definitely Socal and Colorado) but with some Canuck dopers thrown in for good measure. Boggles the mind.

I could believe that, just given the mentality of a lot of racers I have competed with. People seem to get really vicious and lose sight of the fact that for most of us, THIS IS JUST A HOBBY

 

[BikeCentric]

yeah i myself question whether some amateur racers dope the nature of competitive cycling would suggest plenty do. im a cat3 in socal the fields are big and its competitive im sure there are a few who do dope it would anger me to no end if i knew i lost a race to someone cheating.

The thing that really sucks about amateurs doping is that it really is a "shortcut" and it really is "being lazy." When pros dope that's not really the case because those guys already do everything possible to be at the top level - they train as much as their bodies can take, they eat perfectly, they sleep as much as possible, they don't go out partying and stay up late drinking with seedy women (or at least very rarely). They mostly live like monks and the drugs for them are the way to squeeze out that last little % of performance. I'm not justifying it mind you, just trying to clarify a difference here.

Anyway, amateur racers, being non-pro, are very rarely constrained by their optimum genetic potential. They aren't guys who deserve to be pros (because a true "natural" can indeed kick the *** of your typical amateur even while he's out of shape) but my point is that they have a huge amount of room to make improvements because they are usually limited in their time to train, and diet and rest is usually lacking. Plus most haven't been training for many years as pros have.

So the point I'm making is that when an amateur dopes they truly ARE being lazy and taking a shortcut. Because the vast majority of amateurs haven't come close to reaching their genetic ceiling (the best they can be) and most never will. Couple this with the fact that as an amateur the sport is just a hobby and then people look like massive egocentric d-bags to dope up just to barely beat their fellow amateurs in a Cat 3 or 4 office park crit.

 

[fatterboy]

Oh, now while taking me to the gallows, be sure to write Douchebag on my head for all to see.

Seriously folks, it is cycling nothing more nothing less.

I can understand to a point why pro's dope ,but weekend warriors and master's?
I was at the UCI master's track worlds and saw a US master champ who got caught
for DHEA at the US champs and the first thing in my mind to pop up was what the f#*K are you doing here you are a ***, do think your going to get a pro deal or somethink, Master,s doping what a joke!!!

 

[flicker]

I can understand to a point why pro's dope ,but weekend warriors and master's?
I was at the UCI master's track worlds and saw a US master champ who got caught
for DHEA at the US champs and the first thing in my mind to pop up was what the f#*K are you doing here you are a ***, do think your going to get a pro deal or somethink, Master,s doping what a joke!!!

That guy probably cheats in every way conceivable in his personal life.

 

[Libera]

I can understand to a point why pro's dope ,but weekend warriors and master's?
I was at the UCI master's track worlds and saw a US master champ who got caught
for DHEA at the US champs and the first thing in my mind to pop up was what the f#*K are you doing here you are a ***, do think your going to get a pro deal or somethink, Master,s doping what a joke!!!

That guy probably cheats in every way conceivable in his personal life.

What's so strange is that on the cutting edge forum, everyone is civil. No name calling, swearing at other members, etc.

Here, where the 'good' guys are, everyone is ****sed and angry.

 

[Anonymous]

Master's doping for a local crit win? Christ, that is pathetic...you can't get much more idiotic than that...

 

[Anonymous]

What's so strange is that on the cutting edge forum, everyone is civil. No name calling, swearing at other members, etc.

Here, where the 'good' guys are, everyone is ****sed and angry.

maybe everyone is all drugged up over there...?

 

[Libera]

Just to clarify...if you read my post I do not admit nor deny anything. The conclusions you make are solely your own.

 

[chase196126]

To clarify, if someone wants to use PEDs to improve their performance just for the hell of it, i really dont care. I dont see the substances themselves, or use of them as inherently bad or evil.

What I have a problem with is those people who want to use these drugs in competition. Cycling is a game, and if you are unwilling to follow the rules you should not be playing. It is simple as that.

The people who post about how to dope in competition on that site should be investigated and banned from the sport.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Just to clarify...if you read my post I do not admit nor deny anything. The conclusions you make are solely your own.

I conclude that it's not worth wasting any more time on you.

 

[Libera]

I conclude that it's not worth wasting any more time on you.

That is mighty nice of you. I too feel the same about you. You see it is not that hard to be civil.

PS: You are a cauck sucker

 

[Anonymous]

If you're doping to win amateur races, you're a douchebag. If not, I doubt the OP was referring to you.

Seriously, it's cheating, nothing more, nothing less. But, it's funny to see losers spending their cash on doping products just so they don't get smoked in the local weekly crits.

...........
So the point I'm making is that when an amateur dopes they truly ARE being lazy and taking a shortcut. Because the vast majority of amateurs haven't come close to reaching their genetic ceiling (the best they can be) and most never will. Couple this with the fact that as an amateur the sport is just a hobby and then people look like massive egocentric d-bags to dope up just to barely beat their fellow amateurs in a Cat 3 or 4 office park crit.

I can understand to a point why pro's dope ,but weekend warriors and master's?
I was at the UCI master's track worlds and saw a US master champ who got caught
for DHEA at the US champs and the first thing in my mind to pop up was what the f#*K are you doing here you are a ***, do think your going to get a pro deal or somethink, Master,s doping what a joke!!!

That guy probably cheats in every way conceivable in his personal life.

All great posts.

I'm struggling to really rationalise all this, I was not aware that mature age amateurs (that are unlikely to turn pro, or are too old to turn pro) would be doping to this extent just to win/lose a local race.

Like, i'm really shocked. I think Bikecentric probably nailed it that one, it is just lazy, and two some kind of ego-centric pyschologically fukced up mentality...

Is this just a US thing or does anyone know of this kind of activity happening in the Australian local amatuer/masters scene?

Browsing cutting edge muscle now to see what these guys talk about.

Either way, why risk your health for all this? Just seems crazy to me.

 

[Berzin]

Instead of these judgmental, holier-than-thou rants, how about pulling back a bit with the attitudes? Maybe you'd learn something.

Amateur cycling circles involve small cliques of guys who are pretty obsessed with the whole weekend warrior thing. I know plenty of guys who train like pros, get remarkably skinny, and never do anything at races. They are pack jelly, year in and year out.

So they hear the whispers of who does what, who can get what and decide to join the club. They cozy up to whomever is supplying the stuff. The dealer, almost always a rider himself, gets to make money off his friends. Bad information about usage-dosages, cycles, etc. are then passed on from one ignorant a-hole to the next, who then spews it like the gospel truth to the next rider who may mind up getting sick.

Some of you guys may think it's pathetic that weekend warriors stoop to this level, but many more than you think do so with absolutely no moral qualms about it.

Human nature being what it is, these people run the gamut of personality types-from the guy who gets along with everyone and is soft-spoken and polite to the guy who goes out on a group ride in November and tries to hammer everyone into the tarmac for absolutely no good reason.

Amateur cycling in the US is a free-for-all when it comes to PEDs. Why do some of these riders engage in such activities when there really is nothing in it for them in the grand scheme of things is besides the point. We all walk around living our daily lives for the most part getting involved in and becoming frustrated by the pettiness that surrounds us all.

Why? Because there is no "grand scheme of things". I'm not condoning PED use, but I just wanted to get this off my chest because it seems as if people are either a bit too shocked over something many riders engage in or are so quick to call these people names and belittle them, as if taking PED's to win a weekend crit makes a rider the biggest loser in the world. It doesn't. It just makes him a cheater, and we have those in all walks of life. Cycling is no more immune to cheating than any other endeavor we choose to participate in.

Mark McGuire sincerely believes he did not cheat the game of baseball. Well, guess what? He's now coaching for the St. Louis Cardinals. This is the last guy you'd want out there teaching anybody anything, but society has given him an intentional walk.

Like it or not, this doping subculture is tremendous. Just because you don't see someone putting a needle in his arm right in front of you does not mean they are not doing it. A lot of these guys who DO train hard and watch what they eat also dope. It's disingenuous to think that those who dope on the amatuer level do so because they are lazy. Newsflash for you guys-PED's allow you to train even harder, so holding down a full-time job AND training like a maniac suddenly becomes easier.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Instead of these judgmental, holier-than-thou rants, how about pulling back a bit with the attitudes? Maybe you'd learn something.

Amateur cycling circles involve small cliques of guys who are pretty obsessed with the whole weekend warrior thing. I know plenty of guys who train like pros, get remarkably skinny, and never do anything at races. They are pack jelly, year in and year out.

So they hear the whispers of who does what, who can get what and decide to join the club. They cozy up to whomever is supplying the stuff. The dealer, almost always a rider himself, gets to make money off his friends. Bad information about usage-dosages, cycles, etc. are then passed on from one ignorant a-hole to the next, who then spews it like the gospel truth to the next rider who may mind up getting sick.

Some of you guys may think it's pathetic that weekend warriors stoop to this level, but many more than you think do so with absolutely no moral qualms about it.

Human nature being what it is, these people run the gamut of personality types-from the guy who gets along with everyone and is soft-spoken and polite to the guy who goes out on a group ride in November and tries to hammer everyone into the tarmac for absolutely no good reason.

Amateur cycling in the US is a free-for-all when it comes to PEDs. Why do some of these riders engage in such activities when there really is nothing in it for them in the grand scheme of things is besides the point. We all walk around living our daily lives for the most part getting involved in and becoming frustrated by the pettiness that surrounds us all.

Why? Because there is no "grand scheme of things". I'm not condoning PED use, but I just wanted to get this off my chest because it seems as if people are either a bit too shocked over something many riders engage in or are so quick to call these people names and belittle them, as if taking PED's to win a weekend crit makes a rider the biggest loser in the world. It doesn't. It just makes him a cheater, and we have those in all walks of life. Cycling is no more immune to cheating than any other endeavor we choose to participate in.

Mark McGuire sincerely believes he did not cheat the game of baseball. Well, guess what? He's now coaching for the St. Louis Cardinals. This is the last guy you'd want out there teaching anybody anything, but society has given him an intentional walk.

Like it or not, this doping subculture is tremendous. Just because you don't see someone putting a needle in his arm right in front of you does not mean they are not doing it. A lot of these guys who DO train hard and watch what they eat also dope. It's disingenuous to think that those who dope on the amatuer level do so because they are lazy. Newsflash for you guys-PED's allow you to train even harder, so holding down a full-time job AND training like a maniac suddenly becomes easier.

I'm sorry but what's the point of your post? Everyone knows doping is part of cycling. Doping at the amateur level is for absolute losers. It just means you're too much of a chicken**** to play fair. Who cares if cycling is cliquish? If someone else in your group is doping, that doesn't somehow excuse you for doing it also. Just because there are other losers who cheat, doesn't mean the amateur-level doper isn't one.

 

[Willy_Voet]

Instead of these judgmental, holier-than-thou rants, how about pulling back a bit with the attitudes? Maybe you'd learn something.

Like it or not, this doping subculture is tremendous. Just because you don't see someone putting a needle in his arm right in front of you does not mean they are not doing it. A lot of these guys who DO train hard and watch what they eat also dope. It's disingenuous to think that those who dope on the amatuer level do so because they are lazy. Newsflash for you guys-PED's allow you to train even harder, so holding down a full-time job AND training like a maniac suddenly becomes easier.

Great post. This has helped me with a real life situation I've been dealing with recently.

My teenage son has a lot of homework to do and he runs track/cross-country. He wants to get better, but doesn't have the time to properly train and recover. He got in touch with someone at the local meatfest gym and was taking a "shortcut". I found out about it this week and was pretty upset at first, but after reading your post I realize that in the 'grand scheme of things' it doesn't really matter. After all, my neighbor probably cheats on his taxes, and he's a nice guy (we have cookouts together all the time), so why should I be that upset that my son is cheating, too. It's just human nature!

Thanks Berzin

 

[Berzin]

You're welcome.