Ryder Hesjedal Discussion Thread

Page 15 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.
Aug 16, 2011
10,821
0
0
Pippo_San said:
Again? He's a fluke. Deal with it.

Most ridiculous GT winner together with Pereiro 2006 and Horner 2013.
You can't compare Hesjedal to Pereiro. The two won their GT's under completely different scenarios. Pereiro won his GT thanks to a break that gained 30 minutes and Landis getting caught. While Hesjedal won his through a great battle with Rodriguez where he managed to stay strong and consistent throughout the whole race.
 
I wish Cannondale has this "fluke" in his team, at least till the day the Moser is back in shape (if any). Sagan needs this type of "unselfish" coo-leader.

His performance in L-B-L was good enought for me.

His GT win might be "lucky" but guy is not "fluke" at all.
 
Pippo_San said:
Again? He's a fluke. Deal with it.

Most ridiculous GT winner together with Pereiro 2006 and Horner 2013.
Pereiro's was gifted by idiotic tactics. Hesjedal was not a fluke. To ride the way he did for three weeks is no fluke, he reached a level he never had before or since. Horner on paper is ridiculous. Will reserve judgement on that one.
 
Pippo_San said:
Again? He's a fluke. Deal with it.

Most ridiculous GT winner together with Pereiro 2006 and Horner 2013.
A fluke is one-time thing. Hesjedal has a Tour top 10 on his record. Degendt has shown to be more of a fluke by far than Hesjedal. Of course they both have years left in their careers to prove us both wrong.
 
Jul 10, 2010
2,906
1
0
Pippo_San said:
Again? He's a fluke. Deal with it.

Most ridiculous GT winner together with Pereiro 2006 and Horner 2013.
Afrank said:
You can't compare Hesjedal to Pereiro. The two won their GT's under completely different scenarios. Pereiro won his GT thanks to a break that gained 30 minutes and Landis getting caught. While Hesjedal won his through a great battle with Rodriguez where he managed to stay strong and consistent throughout the whole race.
movingtarget said:
Pereiro's was gifted by idiotic tactics. Hesjedal was not a fluke. To ride the way he did for three weeks is no fluke, he reached a level he never had before or since. Horner on paper is ridiculous. Will reserve judgement on that one.
Angliru said:
A fluke is one-time thing. Hesjedal has a Tour top 10 on his record. Degendt has shown to be more of a fluke by far than Hesjedal. Of course they both have years left in their careers to prove us both wrong.
I agree - it was not a fluke. Anybody have time to go grab Ryder's palmares and post them? Put up Periero's, too maybe. I think a comparison to Horner is an insult - so leave that one alone, afaic. Ryder has consistently over the years been in the top finishers. Not the top 5, but frequently the top 10 or 20. His Giro was remarkable for the absence of previously known top 5 riders. It was a blessed race for Ryder. He had the luck, and the consistency and strength to win against the field that was there. I do agree that it was likely a one-off win, and we won't see him repeat it.

It's just that he has been consistent enough that it can not properly be called a fluke. IMO. I do think he will finish top five again. I don't see that he was at a level at the Giro that was massively different than before or since - just the moon was in the right phase, the angels smiled on his cards, and all that, and the competition was a little less "in the right phase". It worked out well for him.

His performance in 2013 has been, imo, far MORE unusual, in that he has been far less lucky, and performed far worse in the major GTs this year than historically. At least as I recall - if somebody heeds my palmares request - maybe we can get validation - or not.

Cheers, all! I gotta get back to work!
 
movingtarget said:
Pereiro's was gifted by idiotic tactics. Hesjedal was not a fluke. To ride the way he did for three weeks is no fluke, he reached a level he never had before or since. Horner on paper is ridiculous. Will reserve judgement on that one.
And isn't the highlighted part a way you can define a fluke?

Truth is you guys can look at his palmares the way you want, and say he already got a top 10 in the Tour. Big thing.
Paolo Bettini was 7th at the 1998 Giro D'Italia. So what? :rolleyes:

Hesjedal is not even GT podium material, go figure if he's capable of winning another GT.

Hesjedal placements in GTs:

]]] Tour de France
2008: 47º
2010: 6º
2011: 18º
2012: DNF
2013: 70°

]]] Giro d'Italia
2005: DNF
2008: 60º
2012: WINNER
2013: DNF

]]] Vuelta a España
2006: DNF
2009: DNF


HOLY **** WHAT A GREAT GT RIDER!!! :eek: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
Apr 24, 2013
58
0
0
Pippo_San said:
And isn't the highlighted part a way you can define a fluke?

Truth is you guys can look at his palmares the way you want, and say he already got a top 10 in the Tour. Big thing.
Paolo Bettini was 7th at the 1998 Giro D'Italia. So what? :rolleyes:

Hesjedal is not even GT podium material, go figure if he's capable of winning another GT.

Hesjedal placements in GTs:

]]] Tour de France
2008: 47º
2010: 6º
2011: 18º
2012: DNF
2013: 70°

]]] Giro d'Italia
2005: DNF
2008: 60º
2012: WINNER
2013: DNF

]]] Vuelta a España
2006: DNF
2009: DNF


HOLY **** WHAT A GREAT GT RIDER!!! :eek: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
@Pippo_San Are you jealous that Hesjedal won the Giro 2012? Hesjedal is a great GT rider. He can climb with the best and time trial really good. The only reason that he didn't have alot of good results in GT in the last few years, it's because he often crash. He is always in the back of the peloton( Hesjedal said that he spent less energy that if he was in the front and its not false).
If he came in a GT in big shape and if he doesn't have bad luck, he can do a podium in every Grand Tour, im sure.
I bet you that Hesjedal will win another GT, and I think it will be in 2014, more chance in the Vuelta.
 
Pippo_San said:
And isn't the highlighted part a way you can define a fluke?

Truth is you guys can look at his palmares the way you want, and say he already got a top 10 in the Tour. Big thing.
Paolo Bettini was 7th at the 1998 Giro D'Italia. So what? :rolleyes:

Hesjedal is not even GT podium material, go figure if he's capable of winning another GT.

Hesjedal placements in GTs:

]]] Tour de France
2008: 47º
2010: 6º
2011: 18º
2012: DNF
2013: 70°

]]] Giro d'Italia
2005: DNF
2008: 60º
2012: WINNER
2013: DNF

]]] Vuelta a España
2006: DNF
2009: DNF


HOLY **** WHAT A GREAT GT RIDER!!! :eek: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
tend to agree. Nevertheless I wouldn't say the way Hesjedal won the Giro was a fluke.
 
"Great GT rider"

Winning a race doesn't make you great, such a description should require a bit more of a look. As he's been mediocre for most attempts throughout his career the win should be just one factor when judging his career. I mean winning the Giro is a great achievement but doesn't put aside every other day of racing. As we've only seen his best once (well, and Tourmalet) in a lengthy career I find it hard to rate it above say Gesink or Kreuziger who despite never reaching those heights, have shown up and competed on a reasonable level on numerous occasions.

Sastre, Valverde and Evans (and Andy if you want) are all single GT winners who are infinitely "greater" GT riders. Hesjedal is rows back with Horner and Cobo. That is not to say that their victories were a fluke, they all came with fantastic form and perfect execution. Nor am I saying that he cannot find such form again.
 
Jan 11, 2010
12,582
0
0
Hesjedal is not a fluke. When I heard he'd focus on the Giro GC in 2012, I immediately put him on my CQ team. The Tour 2010 was less than 2 years before, and you already saw there that the guy has amazing recovery.

He's not the best climber, nor the best time trialist, but in the third week of a GT he loses relatively less of his capability.
 
May 19, 2011
4,857
1
0
Pippo_San said:
And isn't the highlighted part a way you can define a fluke?

Truth is you guys can look at his palmares the way you want, and say he already got a top 10 in the Tour. Big thing.
Paolo Bettini was 7th at the 1998 Giro D'Italia. So what? :rolleyes:

Hesjedal is not even GT podium material, go figure if he's capable of winning another GT.

Hesjedal placements in GTs:

]]] Tour de France
2008: 47º
2010: 6º
2011: 18º
2012: DNF
2013: 70°

]]] Giro d'Italia
2005: DNF
2008: 60º
2012: WINNER
2013: DNF

]]] Vuelta a España
2006: DNF
2009: DNF


HOLY **** WHAT A GREAT GT RIDER!!! :eek: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
before knowing his gt result, I thought he is a good gt rider. But I think fact speaks louder than anything else.
 
Panda Claws said:
It is not too hard imagining a 6th place TDF finisher winning a Giro or Vuelta.
BS, do you really think VDB2 can win the Giro or the Vuelta? Hesjedal is a fluke and was very lucky no one took him serious until the third week when his good recovery made the difference. If the other riders knew he would be that strong in the third week, his Giro would be over on the stage Pozzovivo won.

That is why he will never win a GT again.
 
Jul 10, 2010
2,906
1
0
Parrulo said:
BS, do you really think VDB2 can win the Giro or the Vuelta? Hesjedal is a fluke and was very lucky no one took him serious until the third week when his good recovery made the difference. If the other riders knew he would be that strong in the third week, his Giro would be over on the stage Pozzovivo won.

That is why he will never win a GT again.
Well, it seems we are bickering a bit about the use of the word "fluke" more than anything else. Perhaps he is a "fluke" - as we - mostly - seem to agree that he isn't likely to win another GT. While I think you are being overly harsh
no one took him serious
I do think what you have pointed out has some truth to it. I don't think they took him as seriously as they would have if it were Contador. And, if they had, it might have changed the results. Might have.

Myself, I would say he wasn't a fluke because I am not surprised he finally won one. But I also believe he had to have all his stars in the right place, and the angels smiling at him all the while. Which happened for him that year. Ryder is more like a -- hmmm - DeGendt? Hoogerland? Frequently seen, almost at the top - but not quite.

And, it is true that his GT palmares don't hold up to my impression that he was frequently near the front. Meh - whatever. I think most of us would agree that although he won one, he would have to be lucky again to make it two.
 
hiero2 said:
I agree - it was not a fluke. Anybody have time to go grab Ryder's palmares and post them? Put up Periero's, too maybe. I think a comparison to Horner is an insult - so leave that one alone, afaic. Ryder has consistently over the years been in the top finishers. Not the top 5, but frequently the top 10 or 20. His Giro was remarkable for the absence of previously known top 5 riders. It was a blessed race for Ryder. He had the luck, and the consistency and strength to win against the field that was there. I do agree that it was likely a one-off win, and we won't see him repeat it.

It's just that he has been consistent enough that it can not properly be called a fluke. IMO. I do think he will finish top five again. I don't see that he was at a level at the Giro that was massively different than before or since - just the moon was in the right phase, the angels smiled on his cards, and all that, and the competition was a little less "in the right phase". It worked out well for him.

His performance in 2013 has been, imo, far MORE unusual, in that he has been far less lucky, and performed far worse in the major GTs this year than historically. At least as I recall - if somebody heeds my palmares request - maybe we can get validation - or not.

Cheers, all! I gotta get back to work!
I think you hit the nail on the head. In that Giro, the field was weak. Basso & Scarponi were over their peak. Nibali not present. It is evident in the fact that De Gendt made it to third. Rodriguez was the only contender. Hesjedal was not given enough importance by Purito. There were tactical mistakes by Katusha. By the time the third week came, he could not be dislodged enough. IMO the stars were aligned in his favour.

Periero & Horner fall in the unbelievable category.
Periero is 3 times as miraculous- 1. Gaining 30 mins 2. Keeping with the GT contenders 3. Landis getting DQed.
Horner is 2 times as miraculous- 1. Dropping everyone in mountains 2. Winning at ~42.
 
Aug 23, 2012
193
0
0
CanSprint said:
Looks like he is doing the Giro this year...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DV8wKxf8Hzo
wow, thought he was Tour bound for sure this time around. Still he and Martin makes a pretty good team should be interesting to see what they can do, also i hope this time Hesjedal will skip the Tour and do some solid racing in the autumn instead, preferable the Vuelta, but i get it if he want's to do the Canadian races + the team probably wouldn't mind if he went to Colorado and Utah. But i think he'll do the Tour again and be an unsuccessful stage hunter.
 
Jun 25, 2013
381
0
0
Peter von said:
wow, thought he was Tour bound for sure this time around. Still he and Martin makes a pretty good team should be interesting to see what they can do, also i hope this time Hesjedal will skip the Tour and do some solid racing in the autumn instead, preferable the Vuelta, but i get it if he want's to do the Canadian races + the team probably wouldn't mind if he went to Colorado and Utah. But i think he'll do the Tour again and be an unsuccessful stage hunter.
Andrew Talansky is the Garmin TdF guy, probably for the next several years. He's the most complete GC rider on the team now that Hesjedal seems to have fallen off a bit.
 
Aug 23, 2012
193
0
0
VeloHuman said:
Andrew Talansky is the Garmin TdF guy, probably for the next several years. He's the most complete GC rider on the team now that Hesjedal seems to have fallen off a bit.
Well i don't think Garmin should give upon Hesjedal just yet. Talansky is the natural choice for the Tour yes, but given Garmins long history of having more than one leader in big races and the fact that neither are likely to contend for the overall, i don't see why Talansky and Hesjedal should rule out one another. Perhaps Hesjedal is motivated to show something at the Giro again after last year.
 
Jan 11, 2010
12,582
0
0
VeloHuman said:
Andrew Talansky is the Garmin TdF guy, probably for the next several years. He's the most complete GC rider on the team now that Hesjedal seems to have fallen off a bit.
Last year was a bit of a lost season for Hesjedal, but don't forget he won the Giro the year before. The Tour this year is a bit like the Tour when he made the top-10, I can't see Talansky do much better. But you're right, Vaughters seems to have more confidence in Talansky.
 
Dec 6, 2013
87
0
3,680
I believe Dan Martin will become the best GC rider of Garmin. He keeps getting stronger every year. He knows what he's doing. Last year he was really strong in the Tour before het got ill. This year he will make top 10 in the Giro and Vuelta, maybe top 5 already.
 
Jan 11, 2010
12,582
0
0
Amsterdam said:
I believe Dan Martin will become the best GC rider of Garmin. He keeps getting stronger every year. He knows what he's doing. Last year he was really strong in the Tour before het got ill. This year he will make top 10 in the Giro and Vuelta, maybe top 5 already.
That would really surprise me, he has never proven to be consistent over three weeks, and he'll turn 28 already. More importantly, even before he got sick he wasn't that great on the real mountain finishes. He's more of a punchy rider than a real high mountain climber.
 
May 28, 2012
2,779
0
0
theyoungest said:
That would really surprise me, he has never proven to be consistent over three weeks, and he'll turn 28 already. More importantly, even before he got sick he wasn't that great on the real mountain finishes. He's more of a punchy rider than a real high mountain climber.
I think you could've said the same about Purito seven years ago, who also showed flashes of brilliance but suffered lots of bad days. GT-wise Martin can definitely improve. Keep in mind that his 2013 TdF was significantly better than in 2012.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY