Sastre

[Cerberus]

I actually disagree with almost everyone about this feud between sastre and the shlecks. If you think about carlos did attack the yellow jersey, while ut was a great attack he still attacked the yellow jersey if this was the 2009 tour and an astana rider attacked on ventoux and the yellow jersey wearer just marked the attacks of the other riders it would be a completely different scenario. I don't believe the spin out of saxo bank I'm pretty sure the schlecks were pi ssed about that, I doubt sastre was set up to win, I don't think any ds would set up a rider in 3rd place to win rather than the rider that has the yellow jersey

Sure you would if the rider in 3rd place had the strength to attack and the rider in yellow hadn't which it is my and many others impression was the case. I don't really know whether the feud is because Sastre is bitter that he wasn't undisputed captain of Saxo, because the Schlecks are bitter that he won or because of something else (or a combination), but the attack on Alpe d'huez was entirely ok.

 

[icefire]

What is the issue with Sastre and Schleck? Despite a few google attempts I can't find anything.

You can read Andy's account here

http://www.cyclingnews.com/blogs/andy-schleck/padding-my-resume

I don't remember those stages in detail to take one side of the story or another. Could it be that Saxo did not rely on Frank's TT abilities so it allowed Sastre to attack?

 

[B.Rasmussen]

Riis had told the Schlecks and Sastre that they had free reign but had to work together, and that whoever attacked first was to be supported by the others. During the entire tour the team and those 3 riders supported each other like it was expected and I doubt that Sastre would have had the 2 minute gap on L'Alpe without the work of the Schlecks behind him. I think they all have valid points in their complaints. Sastre thought he had done enough to be the sole leader during the tour and felt he wasn't given the support (by Riis) that he could expect. The Schlecks on the other hand, while riding their own chance, felt they had given Sastre all they could give and that he didn't appreciate their work.

 

[issoisso]

Basically, this:

Sastre and Andy had the legs to attack on the Bonette but were asked not to by Frank who was in yellow and didn't have the legs.

This prompted Riis to drive up next to Frank about 4 kms from the top of the climb, and yell several things at him about his lack of mental toughness, finishing with "If you want to win the Tour it's got to hurt a lot, and it's got to hurt NOW."

At this point, Sastre asked Frank to attack and Frank told him not to. Sastre simply sat up and acknowledged. This was recounted by Brian Nygaard after leaving the team.

Also, Sastre said after the Alpe d'Huez stage that he was told in no uncertain terms that if he couldn't shed the favorites early on in the climb, he wouldn't be allowed to try later on since Frank was in yellow.

I fail to see anything improper in Sastre's behaviour. In Andy Schleck's constant jibes at Moncoutié, Contador, Sastre and god knows who else, however, I see a guy who's turning into an Armstrong-type personality. Quite unlike his brother.

Also, i'd love to know how Frank attacking twice while Sastre was up the road somehow consists of "riding for Sastre". The Schlecks' faces of frustration and gloom when Sastre took the jersey said everything, really.

 

[B.Rasmussen]

Basically, this:



I fail to see anything improper in Sastre's behaviour. In Andy Schleck's constant jibes at Moncoutié, Contador, Sastre and god knows who else, however, I see a guy who's turning into an Armstrong-type personality. Quite unlike his brother.

Also, i'd love to know how Frank attacking twice while Sastre was up the road somehow consists of "riding for Sastre". The Schlecks' faces of frustration and gloom when Sastre took the jersey said everything, really.

Cheers for that info, I must have somehow failed to capture that when it came out. I agree that the Schlecks were not happy at all, but Frank attacking the way he did wasn't a problem IMO as he didn't make the rivals go faster in doing so. I have no doubt that the Schlecks were fuming though.

I'm not trying to defend them btw, Sastre is one of my favorite riders and I do think he deserved full support.

off topic, but can you relay the story with Moncutie? i somehow missed that one as well.

 

[issoisso]

off topic, but can you relay the story with Moncutie? i somehow missed that one as well.

Wasn't very widely reported for some reason (I guess Moncoutié isn't a big name ), but a couple or so months ago, Andy Schleck, out of nowhere just said something along the lines of "Moncoutié has the talent to compete for the Tour, but he doesn't because there's something wrong with him. He's *** in the head"

Completely out of the blue and uncalled for.

 

[B.Rasmussen]

Wasn't very widely reported for some reason (I guess Moncoutié isn't a big name ), but a couple or so months ago, Andy Schleck, out of nowhere just said something along the lines of "Moncoutié has the talent to compete for the Tour, but he doesn't because there's something wrong with him. He's *** in the head"

Completely out of the blue and uncalled for.

Not nice and him ****ing on another of my favorites isn't earning him any points. He does seem like the fame is getting to him.

 

[franciep10]

You can read Andy's account here

http://www.cyclingnews.com/blogs/andy-schleck/padding-my-resume

I don't remember those stages in detail to take one side of the story or another. Could it be that Saxo did not rely on Frank's TT abilities so it allowed Sastre to attack?

nobody knew sastre would TT like he did in the final tt maybe frank could've put into a solid tt performance like sastre did.

 

[US Patent Exploding Cyclist]

Wasn't very widely reported for some reason (I guess Moncoutié isn't a big name ), but a couple or so months ago, Andy Schleck, out of nowhere just said something along the lines of "Moncoutié has the talent to compete for the Tour, but he doesn't because there's something wrong with him. He's *** in the head"

Completely out of the blue and uncalled for.

I think that could've been a mistranslation of what was said, but I'll have to take your word for it.

It's a little surprising because I think people, for the most part, think that Andy's a pretty nice guy. At least that has been my perception.

Thanks for all the background on the Sastre Schleck issue too. I'm gonna have to side with Sastre in that situation as, however you look at it, Frank didn't have the legs. It's a shame cause out of the three of them I prefer Frank.

 

[lagartija]

Andy Schleck wouldn't agree...

thats ok i dont much like the schlecks..............

 

[42x16ss]

I would be very disappointed in Bjarne Riis if the talk about him wanting to leave Sastre high and dry in the 08 Vuelta are true. Sastre worked his backside off for CSC for years, helping Hamilton and then Basso and still getting consistent top 10 finishes, then leading the team himself quite admirably. Sastre gave his all for Riis year in and year out, it's a shame that it looks like they parted on bad terms as Sastre and Riis certainly seemed to work well together

 

[Angliru]

I actually disagree with almost everyone about this feud between sastre and the shlecks. If you think about carlos did attack the yellow jersey, while ut was a great attack he still attacked the yellow jersey if this was the 2009 tour and an astana rider attacked on ventoux and the yellow jersey wearer just marked the attacks of the other riders it would be a completely different scenario. I don't believe the spin out of saxo bank I'm pretty sure the schlecks were pi ssed about that, I doubt sastre was set up to win, I don't think any ds would set up a rider in 3rd place to win rather than the rider that has the yellow jersey

...let me add that IIRC there was a 3 part plan for Saxo with planned attacks coming in succession from their primaries. Riis had to know that Frank wouldn't be able to hold on to the yellow jersey without attacking Evans and increasing his lead. I believe their thoughts were that Sastre's attack being the first would get reeled in, as would Andy's if he were to be next, leaving Frank to attack a tired group/Evans, and build the gap that he needed. They likely didn't anticipate the ferocity of Sastre's attack nor the lack of willingness of everyone with the exception of Menchov to pursue Sastre.

Sorry if this repeats what has already been stated.

 

[Cerberus]

...let me add that IIRC there was a 3 part plan for Saxo with planned attacks coming in succession from their primaries. Riis had to know that Frank wouldn't be able to hold on to the yellow jersey without attacking Evans and increasing his lead. I believe their thoughts were that Sastre's attack being the first would get reeled in, as would Andy's if he were to be next, leaving Frank to attack a tired group/Evans, and build the gap that he needed. They likely didn't anticipate the ferocity of Sastre's attack nor the lack of willingness of everyone with the exception of Menchov to pursue Sastre.

Sorry if this repeats what has already been stated.

No way Andy would have been reeled in. Not just because he looked very strong, but also because he was 12 minutes behind. The only proper response by the GC contenders if Andy had attacked would be to let him go. He was a threat to nothing except the stage win (or as a way point for his brother or Sastre).

 

[Angliru]

No way Andy would have been reeled in. Not just because he looked very strong, but also because he was 12 minutes behind. The only proper response by the GC contenders if Andy had attacked would be to let him go. He was a threat to nothing except the stage win (or as a way point for his brother or Sastre).

Kind of like the way they and Evans let Sastre go (with the exception of Menchov)?

 

[Nick777]

A. Schleck seems to think that Sastre is ungrateful for the assistance that the team put in in helping him win the Tour, likely using his exodus to the Cervelo Test Team, which was already a done deal prior to the end of the Tour, as his motivation. Sastre had stated after his Tour win and IIRC during or after the Vuelta, that Riis had no confidence in Sastre's ability to win the Tour and additionally that it was Riis' plan to pull most of the team during the Vuelta, leaving Sastre to fend for himself, likely out of spite that Sastre was already known by Riis to be jumping to CTT.

Even as Sastre was Saxo Bank's last hope at a Tour win in 2008, even with Frank Schleck in yellow on Alpe D'Huez, I'm sure Andy held out hope that Frank would be able to launch an attack that would leave Cadel Evans in the dust and somehow make such a gap at the finish to make up for the inevitable time loss in upcoming ITT. Andy had already blown his chances at contending for the victory by bonking on an earlier stage, losing major minutes and dropping out of the top ten of the gc. If one recalls after the Alpe d'Huez stage there was almost a mournful appearance to the 2 Schlecks rather than a celebration for Sastre's win.

Of course there was still the possibility that Evans could make up the time loss in the ITT but Sastre's TT abilities were underestimated as were the extend of the effect of Evans injuries resulting from an earlier crash.

If any of this is incorrect or inaccurate, I'm sure there will be posts to the contrary correcting me.

He certainly pulled one out of the box that day... very unusual for a Spaniard, not to mention one riding for Bjarne Riis.

 

[lagartija]

He certainly pulled one out of the box that day... very unusual for a Spaniard, not to mention one riding for Bjarne Riis.

is that a joke?...........uh ever heard of a little rider called Miguel Indurain , or even Abraham Olamo, or how about Luis Leon Sanchez, or how about that little known guy named Alberto Contador, didnt he beat Fabian Cancellara , or how about that little team called ONCE yeah they used to be the TT powerhouse, wait where you being sarcastic........

 

[Cogombre]

is that a joke?...........uh ever heard of a little rider called Miguel Indurain , or even Abraham Olamo, or how about Luis Leon Sanchez, or how about that little known guy named Alberto Contador, didnt he beat Fabian Cancellara , or how about that little team called ONCE yeah they used to be the TT powerhouse, wait where you being sarcastic........

Botero was also a TT powerhouse, and we still would be surprised if a good colombian climber shows also a good TT skill. To be fair, Spain is a big productor of good climbers, not-that-good TTers, but that doesn't mean that there are no exceptions

 

[Willy_Voet]

Spain produces the best of everything, it's in their blood.

 

[issoisso]

Spain produces the best of everything, it's in their blood.

Especially in the one that comes in bags

 

[Winterfold]

Sastre in Final TT

In another thread a poster listed Sastre's placings in the final TT of the Tour in the previous 4 years - they were between 12th and ~20th.

So 12th in 2008 was a good performance for him, but nothing he hadn't done before, especially if you consider there is going to be a little bit extra effort from being in yellow.

Evans on the other hand performed well below his capabilities.

 

[movingtarget]

Sastre and Evans are both very consistent riders in grand tours. Sastre is more attacking because he is more of a pure climber and has the acceleration that Evan's hasn't. Sastre has a good chance to win the Giro.