Saxo-Bank to SRAM

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Mar 10, 2009
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patswana said:
Try riding all three yourself.

Campag Super Record is the standout!
It works better
It is more reliable
It is much less likely to have problems
If you do have problems, they can be fixed (as opposed to chuck it away and get a new one)
It is very comfortable
It is lighter
It lasts about twice as long
It looks better
You can change 4 gears at once in either direction with the RD
You'll never have issues with the gear and brake lever being the same

Comparing Dura Ace and Super Record is like comparing a Sony Vaio and an Apple MacBook Pro. Both will get the job done but the Mac is just the better option for a few dollars extra.
Now, I haven't ridden any Campag much to my eternal dismay. I simply can't afford it. However, some of what you have written is quite plainly factually misleading:
Campag is lighter - than DA, yes. But not SRAM Red which, after all, is what this thread is about. And lighter, as others have said, does not neccessarily equal better.
It is more reliable - again, versus new DA, maybe. I don't know. However, I have been riding the same SRAM Rival components for the last 12 months (c300km/week) and aside from cables and chain have not need to replace anything. For sake of even-handedness, FD shifting on Rival is rubbish.
It looks better - debatable. ATMO, new DA is damn fine looking.


Plus ca change :D
 
Apr 1, 2009
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LugHugger said:
Now, I haven't ridden any Campag much to my eternal dismay. I simply can't afford it.
That is a false economy. Although the initial outlay is a little more (and only a little if you shop around), it lasts much longer. Kind of like Assos knicks: yes they cost more but 5 years later they are still going strong.

LugHugger said:
Campag is lighter - than DA, yes. But not SRAM Red which, after all, is what this thread is about. And lighter, as others have said, does not neccessarily equal better.
Dura Ace '09 groupset: 2087g
SRAM Red groupset: 1953g
Campagnolo Super Record groupset: 1958g

I stand corrected!
 
Mar 18, 2009
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I own and ride all the groups being talked about here and I'd like to add my 2 cents. I don't have any vested interest in saying any of them are the best, and honestly, I think all of them are quite good. But here is what I'd say the weak points of each group are.

7900:
some issues with quick links failing. Shimano has recommended using 10spd pins instead.
Issues with the rear mech plates not being stiff enough and allowing chains to come off and destroy rear mechs. Shimano will fix this quickly as it's an easy fix.
The big problem for 7900 is based on their new hidden cable routing. It creates more friction than previous models. So add a little dirt and shifting deteriorates quickly. This will be a major problem for 7900 and 6700.
Not as compatible with aftermarket brakes as 7800 was.

Sram Red:
Some issues with chains failing, still.
Some issues with imprecise shifting. Some pros when tired at the end of a race mis-shift by either not pushing far enough or pushing too far. This has been the most common yet least reported complaint about Sram.
Cassette packs up with dirt and road crap much worse than others.
Crank design. What design, there's no design it's just a rebadge truvativ from several years ago, much like Bontrager is doing.
Front shifting is the worst of the bunch.(combination of derailleur, chain and chainring)

Campy:
Compatibility problems with some wheels.
Compatibility problems with some frames, based on hanger placement, chain stay length and chainline.
New lump at the rear of the shifter body puts pressure on the ulnar. Forces many people to choke up on the shifter or ride way back.
Is re-buildable, but often the replacement parts cost as much as the whole component.
Lacks widespread availability. If you have a problem on the road, you can't always just go to the closest shop and get a chain, cassette, chainring, chainring bolt, etc...

I guess you just need to understand the problems with each group and pick the one that fits your needs best. Honestly, all 3 of them work well in the right circumstances. For consumers, I'd rate Shimano the best. For pro racers I'd rate Campy the best. For club racers I'd rate Sram the best.

Honestly though, I think 7800 was better than 7900. Record 10 was better than Record11 or SR11 and Sram Red is still the same as Sram Red.
 
Mar 11, 2009
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justme said:
I own and ride all the groups being talked about here and I'd like to add my 2 cents. I don't have any vested interest in saying any of them are the best, and honestly, I think all of them are quite good. But here is what I'd say the weak points of each group are.

7900:
some issues with quick links failing. Shimano has recommended using 10spd pins instead.
Issues with the rear mech plates not being stiff enough and allowing chains to come off and destroy rear mechs. Shimano will fix this quickly as it's an easy fix.
The big problem for 7900 is based on their new hidden cable routing. It creates more friction than previous models. So add a little dirt and shifting deteriorates quickly. This will be a major problem for 7900 and 6700.
Not as compatible with aftermarket brakes as 7800 was.

Sram Red:
Some issues with chains failing, still.
Some issues with imprecise shifting. Some pros when tired at the end of a race mis-shift by either not pushing far enough or pushing too far. This has been the most common yet least reported complaint about Sram.
Cassette packs up with dirt and road crap much worse than others.
Crank design. What design, there's no design it's just a rebadge truvativ from several years ago, much like Bontrager is doing.
Front shifting is the worst of the bunch.(combination of derailleur, chain and chainring)

Campy:
Compatibility problems with some wheels.
Compatibility problems with some frames, based on hanger placement, chain stay length and chainline.
New lump at the rear of the shifter body puts pressure on the ulnar. Forces many people to choke up on the shifter or ride way back.
Is re-buildable, but often the replacement parts cost as much as the whole component.

--Spring carrier is $15, shift springs are $5 per(2), labor generally $35-$40(takes about 15 minutes). If ya find a 2008 Record, Chorus lever or 2006 Centaur, Veoce for $55-$65, let me know. If ya change the shift disc(and I have never seen one wear out in 17 years of overhauling these), it's only another $50.


Lacks widespread availability. If you have a problem on the road, you can't always just go to the closest shop and get a chain, cassette, chainring, chainring bolt, etc...

I guess you just need to understand the problems with each group and pick the one that fits your needs best. Honestly, all 3 of them work well in the right circumstances. For consumers, I'd rate Shimano the best. For pro racers I'd rate Campy the best. For club racers I'd rate Sram the best.

Honestly though, I think 7800 was better than 7900. Record 10 was better than Record11 or SR11 and Sram Red is still the same as Sram Red.
--I think the ergonomics and much more robust innards of 2009 Campagnolo a huge advantage. I have not seen any wheel or frame compatibiliy issues and I have installed more than a few. 11s is a not a reason to get 2009 Campagnolo.--
 

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