Soccer World Cup bid

[The Hitch]

Football grounds really do have to earn 'soul' from history. Through great wins or titles. The mystique of Old Trafford, Anfield, Upton Park etc comes from the games that have been played there.

No they dont. From the list you mention, Old Trafford has been expanded on greatly in the last few decades to the point of being irrecognisable, West Ham are considering moving grounds and Liverpoll ARE moving grounds.


There aint no back in the day. Aint no nostalgia to this. Theres just the ball, and the players and what happens today.

Best example. Wembley. Supposedly the home of football. Was iconic. Was the way it had always been. There was nothing wrong with it. But meh. They changed it. They destroyed it and built a knew one.

And if you look at the last 5 world cup finals

Rosebowl
Stade France
Yokohama
Berlin Olympic stadium
soccer city

4 of those 5 were build specifically for that event.

Which is why history really DOESNT matter in football stadiums.

 

[Mambo95]

No they dont. From the list you mention, Old Trafford has been expanded on greatly in the last few decades to the point of being irrecognisable, West Ham are considering moving grounds and Liverpoll ARE moving grounds.

There aint no back in the day. Aint no nostalgia to this. Theres just the ball, and the players and what happens today.

Best example. Wembley. Supposedly the home of football. Was iconic. Was the way it had always been. There was nothing wrong with it. But meh. They changed it. They destroyed it and built a knew one.

Which is why history really DOESNT matter in football stadiums.

Now, I don't mean any offence here. But, while you may live in Britain, and may have done for a long time, you will never be British. You will never understand how things impact themselves in British culture, including the feel of football grounds.

But you're Polish. I certainly have nothing against this, but there's a certain something that you'll never get. Similarly, I was born and brought up in England with a Welsh mother and now live in Cardiff. Despite anything I try, I will never be truly Welsh.

I've seen a few of your posts trying to say things from a UK perspective, but sometimes you've missed the target hopelessly.

 

[The Hitch]

Now, I don't mean any offence here. But, while you may live in Britain, and may have done for a long time, you will never be British. You will never understand how things impact themselves in British culture, including the feel of football grounds.

.

First of all. Dont worry about offending me. So long as its not ad hominem. this is a internet forum not a girls tea party (im paraphrising stephen roche in the Tour about the Schleck chain incident)
But i do not hold back against others, and expect to be on the end of some as well. Arguments are SUPPOSED to be divisive. I would weep for a world that wasnt.

But you're Polish.

Glad to see youve been reading my posts.

I certainly have nothing against this, but there's a certain something that you'll never get. Similarly, I was born and brought up in England with a Welsh mother and now live in Cardiff. Despite anything I try, I will never be truly Welsh.

Actually im British born and have lived here always, but Polish by choice because my parents were only here as exiles from the dictatorship, and it is a language and culture i know very well.

I've seen a few of your posts trying to say things from a UK perspective, but sometimes you've missed the target hopelessly

I never look at things from a Uk perspective, or really the perspective of any country. I bring up my ties to poland on here now and again, but im not much of a patriot.

I look at things from my own international political perspective, including sport, and my love of cycling spawns almost entirely from my political views. So i dont think i have missed the target too much, because im not arguing from a British perspective in the first place.

But being british or not is slightly beside the point here because we are talking about the prestige of stadiums worldwide.

4 of the last 5 world cup finals took place in new stadiums, just like many olympic stadiums are built for the event, and sometimes brought down after, so Quatar will be doing nothing different when they also build a totaly knew stadium for the world cup.

 

[Mambo95]

Actually im British born and have lived here always, but Polish by choice because my parents were only here as exiles from the dictatorship, and it is a language and culture i know very well.

With this in view, I will apologise. You aren't a newcomer. You are as British as I am. However, you do seem to have adopted one British trait - thinking Britain is rubbish. The English seem to really go for this.

Now I'm no tattooed 'Ingerland' chanting thug. But I am quite possessive of my country. You have always portrayed yourself as a Pole. So when you have denigrated the UK, as you tend to do, I see it as a foreigner turning up and slagging us off - hence the bad reaction.

I was wrong. However, I will still maintain that stadiums get their 'soul' from history and nothing else.

 

[The Hitch]

With this in view, I will apologise. You aren't a newcomer. You are as British as I am. However, you do seem to have adopted one British trait - thinking Britain is rubbish. The English seem to really go for this.

Now I'm no tattooed 'Ingerland' chanting thug. But I am quite possessive of my country. You have always portrayed yourself as a Pole. So when you have denigrated the UK, as you tend to do, I see it as a foreigner turning up and slagging us off - hence the bad reaction.

I was wrong. However, I will still maintain that stadiums get their 'soul' from history and nothing else.

Where have i been anti British? My opposition to the world cup is anti football not anti England. I despair greatly that the european championships are coming to Poland too.

 

[Anonymous]

No they dont. From the list you mention, Old Trafford has been expanded on greatly in the last few decades to the point of being irrecognisable, West Ham are considering moving grounds and Liverpoll ARE moving grounds. .

Are they? ....

Far from certain, public opinion around liverpool is that they will improve anfield. Its what most fans want and the owners did the same with the red socks.

 

[simo1733]

By the time the 22 world cup is over, there will be a hole in the ozone layer right above Qatar. That will be their legacy.They will have to import everything. The building materials.the construction workers.the food for the construction workers.

 

[Anonymous]

dont have to worry about the heat in qatar. if blatter gets his way the tournament is being held during the european winter.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...l/blatter-backs-winter-world-cup-2163487.html

ian Holloways view
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Utb-coxjkK8
He always says it just like it is.

 

[Ferminal]

dont have to worry about the heat in qatar. if blatter gets his way the tournament is being held during the european winter.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...l/blatter-backs-winter-world-cup-2163487.html

ian Holloways view
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Utb-coxjkK8
He always says it just like it is.

I love the "give it to Qatar now and worry about the consequences later".

Which you can do to some extent because its some time away, but it just shows how much the whole thing was fixed.

 

[The Hitch]

dont have to worry about the heat in qatar. if blatter gets his way the tournament is being held during the european winter.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...l/blatter-backs-winter-world-cup-2163487.html

ian Holloways view
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Utb-coxjkK8
He always says it just like it is.

Actually that seems to me to be a bit of a parochial view.

He talks about "them" having it as if europe had some sort of divine right.

Its ironic that holloway (whoever the hell he is) uses as his argument that "its a world thing", because if its a world thing surely having it in winter to accomodate the southern hemisphere should be used once in a while.

Personally i dont really see what the problem is anyway. Why not have it in winter. So we get to watch it over Christmas rather than in July when we could be out riding our bikes.

But personally i would rather it was in july because i believe footballers should suffer for their riches and hero status. No one called off kbk when rain started pouring down, or laquilla, nor do they stop the really sunny stages where riders are losing half their body weight climbing 2 hcs and a cat 1.

If they are going to change a world cup, do it in Brazil. If your going to hold a tournament in Rio it has to be in summer.

I would also like to see the 2016 olympics in the euro winter as well. You can have your football matches in winter but swimming, triathlon, road race, marathon and most importantly rio beach volleyball need to be in the summer.

 

[Mambo95]

Actually that seems to me to be a bit of a parochial view.

He talks about "them" having it as if europe had some sort of divine right.

It's not parochial at all. The European game dominates football - international football is a side show. All the best players play in Europe. And those players get their wages from their clubs not their country. Their priority is their club.

The big European clubs hold the power in football, which is why Qatar have sponsored Barcelona to the tune of $125m. It might not be enough though.

 

[The Hitch]

It's not parochial at all. The European game dominates football - international football is a side show. All the best players play in Europe. And those players get their wages from their clubs not their country. Their priority is their club.

The big European clubs hold the power in football, which is why Qatar have sponsored Barcelona to the tune of $125m. It might not be enough though.

You talk about the domination like its a good thing. So european audiences deserve to have the world cup when they want it because their players are better and the media makes a bigger deal out of it? Im not convinced by this argument.

And when i said parochial i was reffering to the whole rant. He uses the them and us structure
"its so vital that they have our tournament".

He then talks about being a "world person".
"it belongs to the world"

Well if "it belongs to the WORLD" then surely EUROPEAN domination of football shouldnt matter. if "it belongs to the WORLD" maybe we should consider others in the WORLD?

I always thought football managers were idiots brought up to the status of "tactical geniuses" by the media. You can see it with ego maniacs like narcisinho calling himself "special" with a straight face and taunting opposition fans " then calling himself special once again.
You see it when Spains "world class" manager Aragonez is caught making the most horrible racist remarks and zenits succesful manager justifies racism in his club.

This interview does nothing to change my view.

 

[simo1733]

You talk about the domination like its a good thing. So european audiences deserve to have the world cup when they want it because their players are better and the media makes a bigger deal out of it? Im not convinced by this argument.

And when i said parochial i was reffering to the whole rant. He uses the them and us structure
"its so vital that they have our tournament".

He then talks about being a "world person".
"it belongs to the world"

Well if "it belongs to the WORLD" then surely EUROPEAN domination of football shouldnt matter. if "it belongs to the WORLD" maybe we should consider others in the WORLD?

I always thought football managers were idiots brought up to the status of "tactical geniuses" by the media. You can see it with ego maniacs like narcisinho calling himself "special" with a straight face and taunting opposition fans " then calling himself special once again.
You see it when Spains "world class" manager Aragonez is caught making the most horrible racist remarks and zenits succesful manager justifies racism in his club.

This interview does nothing to change my view.

Of course the game does not belong to Europe. No european countries were even in contention to host the 2022 world cup. Personally I think it is a good idea to host the world cup in a Arabic/Muslim country, but not Qatar.

 

[Archibald]

Football grounds really do have to earn 'soul' from history. Through great wins or titles. The mystique of Old Trafford, Anfield, Upton Park etc comes from the games that have been played there.

Upton Park???!!! since when is there any mystique about that sh*thole?

there will be no "soul" or mystique to the qatari world cup... absolutely none.

 

[The Hitch]

Despite the evil that is sepp blatter and how corrupt FIFA is, they (or whoever is behind the award) have done something right today.

They actually gave the title of best player in the world to the best player in the world

All the talk was how theyd give it to the little alien dude because he scored 1 goal. No matter how important that goal was the title is for "best player in the world". Spain won but they did not have the best player in the world. Messi didnt win the world cup because he didnt such a great a team. But over the whole season it was clear he was heads and shoulders above the rest. (use of neuter pronoun deliberate).

 

[The Hitch]

Despite the evil that is sepp blatter and how corrupt FIFA is, they (or whoever is behind the award) have done something right today.

They actually gave the title of best player in the world to the best player in the world

All the talk was how theyd give it to the little alien dude because he scored 1 goal. No matter how important that goal was the title is for "best player in the world". Spain won but they did not have the best player in the world. Messi didnt win the world cup because he didnt such a great a team. But over the whole season it was clear he was heads and shoulders above the rest. (use of neuter pronoun deliberate).