- Feb 25, 2011
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I've been thinking about starting this thread for quite some time and I hope it promotes some good discussion. How bad is the doping in the US domestic pro peloton? I'd be curious peoples thoughts on what drugs are being used and by what portion of the peloton. JoePapp, 131313 and Chase's input would be especially welcomed.
REASONS TO BE OPTIMISTIC
1) If you believe Vaughters, Europe is getting cleaner, and that the gains achieved by 02 Vector doping are being negated by the passport. Climbing speed and power is down. So if the domestic peloton was dirty, we should be seeing the domestics competing closer to the pro tour guys at races like California Utah and Colorado. With the exception of some wins out of breakaways (Sutherland) this hasn't really happened. This would lead you to believe that the doping has dropped off proportionally in the US to Europe. To put this differently, if the top guys in the sport who primarily race in Europe, were not using 02 vector drugs, then the second tier guys should have been flying past them when they race or they aren't using either.
2) Ben Jacques Maynes - One of the first domestic riders (or any level) to break the omerta on Armstrong and actually come out against doping. And he's been fairly successful in the US. That has to be reason for hope.
3) Presence in the clinic - 13s and Chase being active in here has to be a good sign.
REASONS TO BE PESSIMISTIC
1) The Papp List - It sure seems like there were probably a lot more guys in this ring that should have been caught and never were. Chuck Coyle claimed he was buying for teammates on Successful Living, some of whom are still racing. Add in Zajicek, OBee, Oneal, Leogrande and "Clark Hilton" and there seems to have been a pretty prevalent group of riders playing with hot sauce. I have to think that there were people who were way smarter than the above mentioned and had the drugs shipped to a girlfriend or PO box and used public computers for correspondence and therefore will never be caught. Main point, were these guys friends and teammates all oblivious to the above named's practices or were they complicit and just better at covering their tracks. I think the latter.
2) Continued Omerta - Some of these guys are still so well received in the cycling community. Leogrande and Zajicek raced together on Monster Media. How'd their teammates feel about racing with guys who got caught and effectively pulled an Armstrong, fighting til the end. How come no one spoke up. Chuck Coyle still runs the pros closet and is, by all accounts, quite popular in Boulder, "The mayor of Boulder cycling." Jesse Anthony made some pretty disturbing comments re Armstrong, supporting omerta (might have been on twitter.) It sure seems like people just aren't willing to speak up. Is this solely out of fear or are they doing stuff themselves.
3) Complete lack of testing - This may be the most discouraging. No one gets tested domestically it seems. Even at the big races, the UCI wants to give USADA the boot and do the testing themselves. I raced the NRC for a while and was not only never tested, but rarely saw ANYONE get tested. Plenty of races mentioned USADA in the race bible, but they were no where to be found at the end of the day.
4) Incentive - Vaughters talked about trying to remove the choice between results and racing clean for the slipstream guys. But for a guy like JV, it was a choice between top 20 and a podium, but even with the top 20 he was making 6 figures a year. For the domestic racer who is most likely making less than 20k per year, the choice has a much greater affect on their own livelihood. Doping vs not doping domestically may be the difference between being able to continue racing and making enough money to support yourself or... having to find a job (which may be challenging if you've devoted your life to cycling), train less, race less and eventually find yourself out of the sport.
If I had to guess, just based on the above points, I would say that out of a pool of the best 8 guys on every Division 2 or 3 team racing in the US that:
~50% have used a banned substance at some point
~25% use recovery enhancing drugs, like HGH, currently
~10% use o2 vector drugs currently
But those are just wild guesses. What are others thoughts.
REASONS TO BE OPTIMISTIC
1) If you believe Vaughters, Europe is getting cleaner, and that the gains achieved by 02 Vector doping are being negated by the passport. Climbing speed and power is down. So if the domestic peloton was dirty, we should be seeing the domestics competing closer to the pro tour guys at races like California Utah and Colorado. With the exception of some wins out of breakaways (Sutherland) this hasn't really happened. This would lead you to believe that the doping has dropped off proportionally in the US to Europe. To put this differently, if the top guys in the sport who primarily race in Europe, were not using 02 vector drugs, then the second tier guys should have been flying past them when they race or they aren't using either.
2) Ben Jacques Maynes - One of the first domestic riders (or any level) to break the omerta on Armstrong and actually come out against doping. And he's been fairly successful in the US. That has to be reason for hope.
3) Presence in the clinic - 13s and Chase being active in here has to be a good sign.
REASONS TO BE PESSIMISTIC
1) The Papp List - It sure seems like there were probably a lot more guys in this ring that should have been caught and never were. Chuck Coyle claimed he was buying for teammates on Successful Living, some of whom are still racing. Add in Zajicek, OBee, Oneal, Leogrande and "Clark Hilton" and there seems to have been a pretty prevalent group of riders playing with hot sauce. I have to think that there were people who were way smarter than the above mentioned and had the drugs shipped to a girlfriend or PO box and used public computers for correspondence and therefore will never be caught. Main point, were these guys friends and teammates all oblivious to the above named's practices or were they complicit and just better at covering their tracks. I think the latter.
2) Continued Omerta - Some of these guys are still so well received in the cycling community. Leogrande and Zajicek raced together on Monster Media. How'd their teammates feel about racing with guys who got caught and effectively pulled an Armstrong, fighting til the end. How come no one spoke up. Chuck Coyle still runs the pros closet and is, by all accounts, quite popular in Boulder, "The mayor of Boulder cycling." Jesse Anthony made some pretty disturbing comments re Armstrong, supporting omerta (might have been on twitter.) It sure seems like people just aren't willing to speak up. Is this solely out of fear or are they doing stuff themselves.
3) Complete lack of testing - This may be the most discouraging. No one gets tested domestically it seems. Even at the big races, the UCI wants to give USADA the boot and do the testing themselves. I raced the NRC for a while and was not only never tested, but rarely saw ANYONE get tested. Plenty of races mentioned USADA in the race bible, but they were no where to be found at the end of the day.
4) Incentive - Vaughters talked about trying to remove the choice between results and racing clean for the slipstream guys. But for a guy like JV, it was a choice between top 20 and a podium, but even with the top 20 he was making 6 figures a year. For the domestic racer who is most likely making less than 20k per year, the choice has a much greater affect on their own livelihood. Doping vs not doping domestically may be the difference between being able to continue racing and making enough money to support yourself or... having to find a job (which may be challenging if you've devoted your life to cycling), train less, race less and eventually find yourself out of the sport.
If I had to guess, just based on the above points, I would say that out of a pool of the best 8 guys on every Division 2 or 3 team racing in the US that:
~50% have used a banned substance at some point
~25% use recovery enhancing drugs, like HGH, currently
~10% use o2 vector drugs currently
But those are just wild guesses. What are others thoughts.
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