State of the peloton 2022

[noob]

We will have to hope something similar will happen.

If there were something going on behind the scenes with an investigation... we wouldnt know about it. Just hope that there is.

Let's just hope Lopez turns himself into a wistle blower. If he does I hope people won't turn his back on him.

 

[wansteadimp]

Let's just hope Lopez turns himself into a wistle blower. If he does I hope people won't turn his back on him.

If that happens Movistar will be super happy they split on such good terms!

 

[Salvarani]

Let's just hope Lopez turns himself into a wistle blower. If he does I hope people won't turn his back on him.

Unfortunately, I think he will be treated like a paria now. He wouldnt be deemed credible either if he were to make allegations. It wouldnt hold up.

You need to get at someone at the very top of the hierarchy, not necessarily a rider, and make them co-operate. Before they get caught like Lopez. You need to go at them before that happens and win them over on your side.

Only if Lopez may face some serious time behind bars and he could provide valuable information to take people down, he might be useful. Something to bargain with to reduce his own time. I doubt he would know much about other teams and so on though. Just hearsay. They would just deny and without any evidence nothing happens.

 

[noob]

Unfortunately, I think he will be treated like a paria now. He wouldnt be deemed credible either if he were to make allegations. It wouldnt hold up.

You need to get at someone at the very top of the hierarchy, not necessarily a rider, and make them co-operate. Before they get caught like Lopez. You need to go at them before that happens and win them over on your side.

Only if Lopez may face some serious time behind bars and he could provide valuable information to take people down, he might be useful. Something to bargain with to reduce his own time. I doubt he would know much about other teams and so on though. Just hearsay. They would just deny and without any evidence nothing happens.

I think you're right. But he also was at Movistar. Not just Astana.

 

[Salvarani]

I think you're right. But he also was at Movistar. Not just Astana.

He still would need to have some proof. Otherwise it would be word against word. He loses that battle since he is the one being accused of some serious stuff. Where is his credibility?

Also, it is the biggest teams they have to go after. It will be really hard because they are probably very thorough and backed by higher-ups with a lot of money at stake. It is big business.

Nobody knows more than what they are supposed to know. It is a system and they are many steps ahead. Everyone knows what to do and say. You have to get someone on the inside to give you information. A source. Finding that is the most difficult thing though. Identifying someone that either wants to get out or someone you could black mail, that gets caught doing something they are not supposed to do be doing. Because thats what you need to fill in the blanks and gather evidence. Otherwise you have nothing more than speculation. Dope tests obviously dont work. They are too far behind. You have to be stupid to get caught in one of those.

 

[SafeBet]

This isn't hard to understand for me. Obviously everyone involved has an incentive to pretend nothing's up. It's basically the social contract in cycling.

What's perplexing to me is how many fans are willing to eat it up.

Fans eat it up in every sport, why not in cycling?

 

[noob]

He still would need to have some proof. Otherwise it would be word against word. He loses that battle since he is the one being accused of some serious stuff. Where is his credibility?

Also, it is the biggest teams they have to go after. It will be really hard because they are probably very thorough and backed my higher-ups with a lot of money at stake. It is big business.

Nobody knows more than what they are supposed to know. It is a system and they are many steps ahead. Everyone knows what to do and say. You have to get someone on the inside to give you information. A source. Finding that is the most difficult thing though. Identifying someone that either wants to get out or someone you could black mail, that gets caught doing something they are not supposed to do be doing. Because thats what you need to fill in the blanks and gather evidence. Otherwise you have nothing more than speculation. Dope tests obviously dont work. They are too far behind. You have to be stupid to get caught in one of those.

It's a start. I believe in 10 to 20 years there has been another takedown or Festina scandal. It's just it will take time until it happens.

Conspiracies rarely lasts a long time. Keeping up with the lies is exhausting for everyone involved and eventually someone cracks.

 

[Red Rick]

Fans eat it up in every sport, why not in cycling?

Because unlike cycling in most sports there isn't actually scrutiny against it or there's no real top players getting busted in big headline cases.

 

[noob]

Because unlike cycling in most sports there isn't actually scrutiny against it or there's no real top players getting busted in big headline cases.

Not recently, but once upon a time there was a guy in Argentina called Diego. At that time he was in very good company with other athletes, like Carl and Ben in running, and the doping scandals were more or less everywhere. But it's a generation since.

 

[fbjim]

Serena Williams literally once hid in a panic room when a tester showed up and nobody cares.

 

[noob]

Feel like the whole forum is turning into the clinic as there's no way to keep the clinic out of the forum this tour. It's a "reality" show.

I was hoping for a documentary called The least expected drug.

 

[BR2]

Fans eat it up in every sport, why not in cycling?

There are few sports in which physiology is so important, technique in comparison is so unimportant, doping makes such a big difference.

Scrutiny in athletics, especially sprinting/ running, is also big (and correctly so).

 

[firefly3323]

Serena Williams literally once hid in a panic room when a tester showed up and nobody cares.

All time home run leader - Barry Bonds
#4 - Alex Rodriguez

 

[Ricco']

What fascinates me the most is why Ineos, who was the mighty team of the last decade and has one of the biggest budgets around (and bigger than TJV i think) can't come up with an answer to what Jumbo and UAE are doing. Sure they have been on the podium the last 2 years but neither Carapaz last year nor Thomas this year have showed signs of being capable of more than that.

And the team who brought Wiggins, Froome and Thomas to the pinnacle of GT racing, despite buying continuously the biggest young talent available, hasn't come out with a new freak to dominate it all.

Even the Bernal reign was shortlived. I know he had back problems that could have hampered is progression, but could the 2019 Bernal be of any match this year? His 2021 Giro and 2021 Vuelta versions don't seem to have the speed and consistency to hang around to this pace.

 

[PhiLiz]

Doping will always be a step ahead of testing, there will be always limitations and ways to keep results negatives, you just need good science with you. So, justice investigations are the best away to know what is really going on the peloton. I'm looking forward to see which substances were found in recent police raids. Doping was, is and will be part of cycling, if you want to continue to love the sport you must accept it. What I don't want to see again is some teams and riders having special protections from institutions because of financial and prestige reasons, like it was in the past.

I don't disagree with the idea that testing is always one step ahead but the truth is that positives are even rarer than they were 10/15 years ago. Something changed for the worse in that department.

 

[Sciatic]

There are few sports in which physiology is so important, technique in comparison is so unimportant, doping makes such a big difference.

Scrutiny in athletics, especially sprinting/ running, is also big (and correctly so).

Power, speed, size, injury recovery = NFL

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Marcos Maynar's in the news, riders who contest bunch sprints are dropping favourites in the mountains, speeds are approaching 90s levels, heat's getting up toward 40º in the biggest race of the month... it's August in July!

 

[Ripper]

Marcos Maynar's in the news, riders who contest bunch sprints are dropping favourites in the mountains, speeds are approaching 90s levels, heat's getting up toward 40º in the biggest race of the month... it's August in July!

Perhaps the rest of the cycling world will go full Portugal. Of course, where will Portugal go?

 

[spalco]

All time home run leader - Barry Bonds
#4 - Alex Rodriguez

I'm not saying Americans are more honest about doping (lol!), but it's worth noting, neither of them are in the Hall of Fame, or ever will be.

 

[noob]

In the meantime I also think studies like these are interesting. This is also why I ask a lot of noob questions because I don't believe marginal gains is complete bull either. It's just both.

(Or they are actually using mechanical or rather electric doping after all.)

Link to the study is here: Double blind controlled study of epo use in cyclists shows no difference between epo and placebo up Venteux. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28669689/

 

[fbjim]

What fascinates me the most is why Ineos, who was the mighty team of the last decade and has one of the biggest budgets around (and bigger than TJV i think) can't come up with an answer to what Jumbo and UAE are doing. Sure they have been on the podium the last 2 years but neither Carapaz last year nor Thomas this year have showed signs of being capable of more than that.

And the team who brought Wiggins, Froome and Thomas to the pinnacle of GT racing, despite buying continuously the biggest young talent available, hasn't come out with a new freak to dominate it all.

Even the Bernal reign was shortlived. I know he had back problems that could have hampered is progression, but could the 2019 Bernal be of any match this year? His 2021 Giro and 2021 Vuelta versions don't seem to have the speed and consistency to hang around to this pace.

You say that and they have a classics rider who won Alpe d'Huez.

 

[Nick2413]

What fascinates me the most is why Ineos, who was the mighty team of the last decade and has one of the biggest budgets around (and bigger than TJV i think) can't come up with an answer to what Jumbo and UAE are doing. Sure they have been on the podium the last 2 years but neither Carapaz last year nor Thomas this year have showed signs of being capable of more than that.

And the team who brought Wiggins, Froome and Thomas to the pinnacle of GT racing, despite buying continuously the biggest young talent available, hasn't come out with a new freak to dominate it all.

Even the Bernal reign was shortlived. I know he had back problems that could have hampered is progression, but could the 2019 Bernal be of any match this year? His 2021 Giro and 2021 Vuelta versions don't seem to have the speed and consistency to hang around to this pace.

Getting Thomas to the position he’s in this Tour is probably the equivalent of getting Pog and V to where they are. Ineos will take one of their young guns from the classics season and bring them to the top, and maybe get a new signing, and they’ll be back in the fray.

 

[noob]

Getting Thomas to the position he’s in this Tour is probably the equivalent of getting Pog and V to where they are. Ineos will take one of their young guns from the classics season and bring them to the top, and maybe get a new signing, and they’ll be back in the fray.

Rodriguez maybe.

 

[firefly3323]

I'm not saying Americans are more honest about doping (lol!), but it's worth noting, neither of them are in the Hall of Fame, or ever will be.

True, but that really isn't as much of a penalty as it might have been in the past if they can still be involved in the sport.

 

[firefly3323]

Rodriguez maybe.

Sheffield, get him the yellow and reap the benefits of American fandom.