We must truly be back in the Merckx era when only a handful of riders are deemed good enough. The rest are farmers and plumbers.
We must truly be back in the Merckx era when only a handful of riders are deemed good enough. The rest are farmers and plumbers.
- May 3, 2015
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Probably true (on Pogacars form) but even more impressive that he could pull it off solo after riding on a puncture for some km and having to catch up after the bike change.
Seriously, there are 5 monuments. Flanders is one of them and it is the one with most spectators along the route. And you say it is a minor race? Do you know cycling at all?
- May 3, 2015
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Had a look on Procyclingstats and that was indeed a crazy year for Jalabert. No one after scored more than 4000 points in a single season of PCS points (actually 3000 is quite rare, Pogacar has done it in the past 2 seasons). Also before, Kelly was the last over 4000, doing it three years in a row (84-86). But now the crazy thing - Jalabert 95 would have been only Merckx' 8th best season.
True, even not at his best, he wins solo...But you could tell that his form isn't the same as in Flanders. He was really "struggling" after the Keutenberg. At the ronde he could just keep on going after Kwaremont. I hope he will have enough time to rest and rebuild for the Tour.
- Sep 12, 2022
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I don’t know why you feel so attacked. Did any of those riders beat Pog in decent form? No? Then the field was a bit weak for him. If WVA, MVDP or Remco would be there you have at least riders that have beat him.
Im not feeling attacked? Saying that is just a cunning way of arguing on your side, to make me feel bad or something. A pretty toxic tactic. An actual attack and far from what has been discussed. It is not a personal discussion.
As I said in my first post earlier this morning... I just find it funny how there are now the same type of arguments against Pog, as it is against Merckx when all his records are brought up or how he could win so much. Just an observation. "There was hardly any good riders back then". "He raced against weak-fields". History repeating itself, if we are supposed to believe some on here.
Pog being so strong/great, doesnt mean 98% of the peloton are nothing to write home about. There are many capable riders around, but a few are just some of the best we have ever seen.
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- Jan 8, 2020
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- Sep 16, 2021
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I mean, it makes sense because Flanders was his main goal of the spring. Of course that was him at his peak. However, it's hard to gauge what exactly his form is right now. He is still looking really good. I didn't really think he was "struggling" yesterday. It's possible that he was simply gauging his effort on his solo and he might be holding something back for LBL. Let's see next week at LBL when Remco is there.
- Sep 12, 2022
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I'm saying you feel attacked because your way of conversation comes of very defensive.
It's not an argument only against Pog. We've had the same arguments against Remco and WVA. When a rider is much stronger than others, and he wins with ease, people just say the field wasn't that strong. That the top competitors weren't there. Which is the case here.
Well, people could be wrong when they say that about Remco and WVA.
Now it feels like you and others are saying this, because you hold some type of grudge against people that have said this about the rider you have as your avatar. Who is the one feeling attacked or taking this very personal? Who is the one being defensive?
That some great riders werent in the race, doesnt mean the field is automatically "weak". Especially not when it contains a few monument winners and another GT-winner. Many experienced riders, who has had great results. A bunch of great young riders, who are deemed to be great talents as well. It is not a weak field, just because one rider is one of the best we have ever seen and some other great riders were missing. It is only a "strong" field when those handful of riders are all at the same time participating? Where is the logic in that?
Many of the riders in the race yesterday has had a very good spring and won big races, but you still wanna claim it was a "weak" field? The only races that will have a "better" field are the five monuments, worlds and the TdF.
No other race can claim to have a "good" field then?
That just wasnt the case here. It was a good WT-race, with many good riders. The main favorite won because he was the best, but it is not like it was a training ride. Look at the gaps. Look at how many didnt finish. It wasnt an easy race at all. Anyone claiming something else needs to get a grip, to put it frankly. Everything else could be discussed in another part of the forum.
- Jan 8, 2020
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Pog in la Gazzetta dello Sport:
It's not over here: "Certainly not, we can talk about recovering energy Sunday night. I concentrated a lot on the classics, now there is Fleche and then Liege, a race that I won, but very difficult. And moreover I'll encounter Evenepoel: he'll arrive in optimal condition after a long period of training at altitude. I think he did everything to be in maximum form at the Giro. He will be a big adversary. It's difficult to make a prediction. From Monday I think of the Tour..."
It's not over here: "Certainly not, we can talk about recovering energy Sunday night. I concentrated a lot on the classics, now there is Fleche and then Liege, a race that I won, but very difficult. And moreover I'll encounter Evenepoel: he'll arrive in optimal condition after a long period of training at altitude. I think he did everything to be in maximum form at the Giro. He will be a big adversary. It's difficult to make a prediction. From Monday I think of the Tour..."
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- Feb 18, 2015
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I know a lot of people are starting to find him boring but I still find myself rooting for him. The guy is so out of this world looking so much stronger than anyone I had ever seen before him, that I still enjoy the amazement watching him gets me. A big part of me wants Pogacar to win LBL and then the Tour after that, simply to experience what it must have felt like to watch the goats in the decades before I was born.
Big Doopie
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- Oct 6, 2009
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Agree with criticism of “weak” field. He can only beat what’s there.
However not sure I have ever heard anyone say merckx’s competition was weak. Ever. You just have to see all the TDF winners that rode in his era and then remained highly competitive in Hinaults era. If anyone could be lessened by their competition it is Hinault 1978-82. Not much there.
But Merckx competed against Gimondi, Thevenet, Van Impe, Zoetemelk, Ocana, Pingeon (all TDF winners). And his monument wins were against one of the famous eras of classics riders.
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Your argument doesn't say anything, other than confirm what is an objective reality: in the absence of the other top riders, the field wasn't the best. Spin it however you like, but it doesn't change this fact. And it's not to take away from Pog's performance, but place it within its proper context. Nor does anyone begrudge him, just because the same was said of Remco's victory at Liege last year. This is all you emitting BS. It's simply applying the same standard.
We can agree to disagree. It is all good, but I think you are wrong in this dicussion we have had.
It has constantly been mentioned that Merckx only rode against a few top competitors and the rest of the field was not professional riders. Sort of a way to belittle him. A "meme" if you will.
Me just pointing something out or calling it "funny", whether I am right or wrong, sparking this type of responses is even more amusing. Whatdoknow they are frequent posters in another thread.
Cookster15
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- May 14, 2011
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I did not say it was a minor race I said it was relatively minor.
Sorry to offend but compared to the Tour de France Flanders is minor be it a monument or not. Ask any Australian if they remember that Stuart O’Grady won 2007 Paris Roubaix. For a rider like Pogacar, monuments are minor.
ps, I’ve been following the sport since the early 90s, am entitled to express my opinions and am not stupid.
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Agree to disagree, of course I think the opposite.
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Because random Australians don‘t care about it? He even said after Flanders that he could retire as a legend of the sport now and I‘m sure he couldn‘t care less what your average jock in Sydney has to say about it.
Cookster15
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Do you think Pog will be happy to lose to Vingegaard’s again if he snares a monument ? I disagree even if publicly he might agree with you. If he loses again in France of course he would say that.
Cookster15
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Elos Anjos
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Boring? Pog is one of the best things that happened to the sport. Of course I'm careful enough to accomodate any surprise that might come post ex-facto not only to him but to this whole generation. But still, my point is unassailable:
- it's not how much he wins, it's how he wins races. Sprints, long-range attacks, a will to take risks in any kind of field, all with cunning, prowess and a "I could do this all day" kind of smile.
- he's not a SKY or Jumbo bot: and with that I'm not arguing for nationalities but for a type and style of racing that really turns out cycling as boring. Like Froome's clinical and mercurial approach to riding.
- Even if he lost more often, Pogacar would be praised as a rider that gives everything. The fact he does attack and wins shouldn't have a bearing on how he appeals to fans's hearts, i.e., fans that are looking for modern day versions of courage: daring done with style and guts.
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- Sep 4, 2017
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No, British but I take your point to an extent as here Wiggins winning the Tour was a big deal whereas had he won Paris-Roubaix it would have been equally revered by core cycling fans but the wider sporting audience would not see it in true context.
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