Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[Krzysztof_O]

Hard to tell I think. I don't know enough about training, would it make sense for him to have a form buildup, that let's him peak just a bit before the Giro?
He's also supposed to not overly stress himself I guess, so we don't know how deep he dug, except for the TT, and even there he maybe could have cone faster at the start, he kind of indicated that (or it was just really good pacing, also possible ofc)
I think the important factor is how he looks compared to his rivals and I guess we can say, they look like he's toying with them.

There is no doubt that hes toying with his rivals and his form his very good. I am just looking at a larger Giro Tour double picture. Has he peaked? I dont think so. Time will tell how he fares in week 3 and at the Tour. Only against Skeletor he needs absolute peak (which may still not be enough), definitely not against Giro competition.

Obviously peaking before the Giro makes no sense but maybe at Liege they realized he is a bit too strong too early.

 

[Cookster15]

It could be that they really are trying to target top form for the Tour and Giro week 3.

I assume this was the case. But realitically, to optmize his chances at he Tour he would win undercooked in the Giro. So far so good I'd say? He looked spent after the TT, but recovered quickly and seemed to win on Prati di Tivo very easily. Yes, toying with them. Also, he did control his instincts on the sterrato stage 6. That was telling.

 

[Cassirer]

Hard to tell I think. I don't know enough about training, would it make sense for him to have a form buildup, that let's him peak just a bit before the Giro?
He's also supposed to not overly stress himself I guess, so we don't know how deep he dug, except for the TT, and even there he maybe could have cone faster at the start, he kind of indicated that (or it was just really good pacing, also possible ofc)
I think the important factor is how he looks compared to his rivals and I guess we can say, they look like he's toying with them.

Yeah, I agree its almost impossible to rate his form, but that was clear when looking at the start list. Dominating this opposition was never gonna tell us anything. Maybe the gap could be even bigger, but we can't know if its form or chilling with july in mind.

 

[SafeBet]

What fans are irritated? Detractors might be irritated, but if they weren't criticizing him for racing hard, the would be calling him a wheel sucker so...

I can tell you most Italian fans love what he's doing. Just go to a stage start or finish and you'll see. His attacking nature, his panache, his (apparent) lack of rationality: that's exactly what the Giro has been missing the past few years... And fans recognize that.

I don't think the peloton has negative feeling towards him either. I was talking to ex Bardiani rider Alessio Nieri a few days ago and he told me Pogacar is well liked by his peers. Nieri told me: "if you have the legs to win why should you not win?" which perfectly sums up this new generation approach to cycling. Uijtdebroeks said the same thing in an interview after Prati di Tivo.

There is a niche of detractors among older journalists / ex pros / perhaps DSs (?) but that's the sad reality in every aspect of life. Old thinks everything old was better and struggles to understand change. Beppe Conti doesn't fancy Pogacar going toe to toe with sprinters in Naples? I think I can live with it.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Like I said prior to the Giro, We must wait for the Tour if we really want to know how good he is. Even his weight looks bigger than other GT's he has done.

 

[Brullnux]

I also think it's worth remembering that the anglophone cycling media is tiny. It's not particularly influential on people's opinions.

 

[Netserk]

There is no doubt that hes toying with his rivals and his form his very good. I am just looking at a larger Giro Tour double picture. Has he peaked? I dont think so. Time will tell how he fares in week 3 and at the Tour. Only against Skeletor he needs absolute peak (which may still not be enough), definitely not against Giro competition.

Obviously peaking before the Giro makes no sense but maybe at Liege they realized he is a bit too strong too early.

I would imagine that after the dominant display in Liège, they knew the form and the prep was more than good enough, so maybe they tapered more before the Giro than what would be most optimal if not for the Tour. That would probably have been the plan all along, but I guess they could still adjust it a bit and allow for more rest before the race than initially planned.

 

[Berniece]

Like I said prior to the Giro, We must wait for the Tour if we really want to know how good he is. Even his weight looks bigger than other GT's he has done.

I thought he lost 2kg's?

 

[Krzysztof_O]

I thought he lost 2kg's?

Riders weight is a popular topic (see Remco thread), Pog definitely looked leaner at the start of the season (vs early spring in previous years) and now he looks to be close to his standard GT weight (little or no change since March).

 

[ppanther92]

Even his weight looks bigger than other GT's he has done.

To me he looks less bulky than ever before.

 

[Berniece]

Riders weight is a popular topic (see Remco thread), Pog definitely looked leaner at the start of the season (vs early spring in previous years) and now he looks to be close to his standard GT weight (little or no change since March).

Doesn’t make sense to lose weight for spring classics but not for a GT. I think he’s leaner and in top form at the moment. You don’t go on altitude to be at your best for Liege, then lose form and build it again for the 3rd week of a GT. I think he’s just in best form for 5-6 weeks straight.

 

[Peyroteo94]

To me he looks less bulky than ever before.

He was skinnier last year

 

[dazaau]

Doesn’t make sense to lose weight for spring classics but not for a GT. I think he’s leaner and in top form at the moment. You don’t go on altitude to be at your best for Liege, then lose form and build it again for the 3rd week of a GT. I think he’s just in best form for 5-6 weeks straight.

Except with targeting the tour that would be three months of best form. Surely has to have some give in there somewhere.

 

[Berniece]

Except with targeting the tour that would be three months of best form. Surely has to have some give in there somewhere.

In that case it makes more sense to start dropping your form in the 3rd week of the Giro, and some weeks after the Giro, to then build it back up. Instead of building towards the 3rd week of the Giro.

 

[dazaau]

In that case it makes more sense to start dropping your form in the 3rd week of the Giro, and some weeks after the Giro, to then build it back up. Instead of building towards the 3rd week of the Giro.

I think realistically everyone loses form over the course of a GT? So that does indeed makes sense.

 

[Mina.S]

Pog has changed trainer and is apparently now doing a lot more strength work. He definitely looks both leaner and toner kind of a change in overall body tone which is pretty common when you start anyone, even elite athletes on a lot more strength work.

 

[Red Rick]

I think realistically everyone loses form over the course of a GT? So that does indeed makes sense.

No. You both get more tired but can go higher in form. The negatove effect of fatigue is a bit delayed after initial supercompensation

 

[dazaau]

No. You both get more tired but can go higher in form. The negatove effect of fatigue is a bit delayed after initial supercompensation

I had heard you just get less fatigued than others so perform better relative to them, but given some of the amazing performances in the last week of a GT your explanation makes sense to me, and i don't really know what I'm talking about

 

[Elos Anjos]

As someone already said, Pogacar looks like a kid "in a candy shop" or a kid in a playground.

It's clear he is struggling to hold on in a program and thus race more conservatively or with a view for the future. What he did yesterday, that giant pull in the pink jersey was by all means stupid, absurd but thus beautiful. Because he was having fun and not calculating the worst possible outcome.

His playful personality is clearly as strong as his ambition and prowess and I would argue that this is why he is ultimately a gift to the sport in decades and why he decided to race both Giro and the Tour.

 

[Netserk]

We've seen plenty of cases where riders have - for various reasons - been able to push more watts later in a GT. GC riders often know they have to perform their best in the third week, so they plan accordingly.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Doesn’t make sense to lose weight for spring classics but not for a GT. I think he’s leaner and in top form at the moment. You don’t go on altitude to be at your best for Liege, then lose form and build it again for the 3rd week of a GT. I think he’s just in best form for 5-6 weeks straight.

He didnt target cobbled classics (last year he weighted 67 kg in early April) so he weighted less at the start of the season focusing on stage racing more in his double attempt year. No contradiction here. I am not noticing him weighting less now but its not easy to assess obviously.

 

[Peyroteo94]

He looks bulkier in the legs compared to the 2023 Tour. @mou said Pogacar targets to lose 2 kg between the Giro and Tour. Of course it isn't probably a reliable source but sometimes he was right in things the common fan would never know.

 

[jmdirt]

It's going to happen. He's under a microscope now that he is winning so much. He has to have a thicker skin, be gracious, and smart. The past day or so he hasn't been any of those.

You are watching a different race and different interview than me then.

 

[Red Rick]

What fans are irritated? Detractors might be irritated, but if they weren't criticizing him for racing hard, the would be calling him a wheel sucker so...

This sort of line could be like the Godwins Law of CN forum

 

[Salvarani]

As someone already said, Pogacar looks like a kid "in a candy shop" or a kid in a playground.

It's clear he is struggling to hold on in a program and thus race more conservatively or with a view for the future. What he did yesterday, that giant pull in the pink jersey was by all means stupid, absurd but thus beautiful. Because he was having fun and not calculating the worst possible outcome.

He's playful personality is clearly as strong as his ambition and prowess and I would argue that this is why he is ultimately a gift to the sport in decades and why he decided to race both Giro and the Tour.

Well put, I agree with this.

His style and personality has truly been like fresh air for the sport.