Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[Medvind]

I think you are exaggerating. Never was this gonna be a walk in the park and Vinge is still Vinge. I expected this. Seems like a lot of people underestimated Vinge, god knows why.

You know why. A Vinge without a serious crash, yes, then we thought he could follow. But now we didn't really know. Sure, the fact that he actually started the tour gave us reason to believe he was in good shape, but not how good. Guess we know better now.

 

[Salvarani]

You know why. A Vinge without a serious crash, yes, then we thought he could follow. But now we didn't really know. Sure, the fact that he actually started the tour gave us reason to believe he was in good shape, but not how good. Guess we know better now.

Yes, a lot of people know now and still a long way to go in this race. A lot can happen. Hope for great entertainment.

 

[Medvind]

In an interview after the stage Vingegaard said he feared this stage, thinking he would lose some time.

 

[Netserk]

They beat the record by almost 20seconds (5.09 vs 5.27 according to strava).
it was ridiculous fast..... so they are both in absolute fine form...

They were 10 seconds faster than Rogla was in Emilia 2019 (when they did 5 ascents in a row).

 

[Salvarani]

They were 10 seconds faster than Rogla was in Emilia 2019 (when they did 5 ascents in a row).

Damn, thats just speaks even more to how bad Roglic was today.

 

[DutchDynamite]

They were 10 seconds faster than Rogla was in Emilia 2019 (when they did 5 ascents in a row).

oh okay, thanks. i was not aware of that. i was only focusing on strava.
thanks for the enlightenment.

Still quite fast though. There is no evidence that pogacar is not at his best or playing the waiting game.

 

[Berniece]

Not that impressive if you know he said to be at his best ever and that he lost another kilo compared to the Giro

 

[solo80k]

The Tour is probably over unfortunately. If Pogacar can't drop Jonas on such climb, he won't drop him anytime soon.

 

[Miha81]

The Tour is probably over unfortunately. If Pogacar can't drop Jonas on such climb, he won't drop him anytime soon.

It is a long way to the end. He does not have to drop him. He just has to win TT's against him and not get dropped himself. Let's wait a little until any conclusions.

 

[Medvind]

It is a long way to the end. He does not have to drop him. He just has to win TT's against him and not get dropped himself. Let's wait a little until any conclusions.

But now I fear Vinge might do a spectacular tt on the last stage. But otherwise I agree, do a good tt on stage 7, take some bonus seconds and don't crack during the 3rd week, just follow Vinge.

 

[Miha81]

But now I fear Vinge might do a spectacular tt on the last stage. But otherwise I agree, do a good tt on stage 7, take some bonus seconds and don't crack during the 3rd week, just follow Vinge.

If he does another of his miracle TT's on last stage I am affraid that there is no solution for this.

Let's just wait to see where his "base" is and if he can keep this up on longer climbs. Same goes for Pogi if he came a little "undercooked" to be more competitive in 3rd week.

Magic of grand tours. Even one day can bring changes in race dynamics.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

But now I fear Vinge might do a spectacular tt on the last stage. But otherwise I agree, do a good tt on stage 7, take some bonus seconds and don't crack during the 3rd week, just follow Vinge.

Easier said than done. I think this year there are some doubts regarding 3-week consistency in case of both Pogacar and Vingegaard (for various reasons of course). So there are lots of different scenarios possible (including both having a weaker 3rd week and someone else capitalizing on it).

 

[Blobs]

The Tour is probably over unfortunately. If Pogacar can't drop Jonas on such climb, he won't drop him anytime soon.

Too early to say. Last year he couldn't drop him on stage 1, was dropped on stage 5, but then from stage 6 looked stronger for a while.

And this year it's Vingegaards prep that was compromised.

 

[James M]

Easier said than done. I think this year there are some doubts regarding 3-week consistency in case of both Pogacar and Vingegaard (for various reasons of course). So there are lots of different scenarios possible (including both having a weaker 3rd week and someone else capitalizing on it).

I agree this year is not like last year for Pogi where everyone knew he would crack last week for obvious reasons. This year its different from both as you say, both Vingegaard and Pogacar might crack last week or get better its very hard to tell, its uncharted area for both.

 

[meat puppet]

Just hours ago this thread was jubilantly overconfident: Pogo GOAT, 0,4w/kg improvement per some random podcast and whatnot.

And now.? Tis all in pieces. The center cannot hold. Because of one hill.

Generalissimus mou is being missed more than ever. Maybe wvpe (or whatever the spelling is) can stand up?

 

[James M]

Also Pogacar wasnt really full on attacking if he was I would be worried, it seems like the plan is to save and wait for stage 4 ?judging by the way the team ride, and just when he heard Roglic was back he went and wasnt sort of planned attack.

 

[kn0s]

Also Pogacar wasnt really full on attacking if he was I would be worried, it seems like the plan is to save and wait for stage 4 ?judging by the way the team ride, and just when he heard Roglic was back he went and wasnt sort of planned attack.

Pogi was attacking there always, it's what he does. Nothing unplanned about it.

 

[Lequack]

Also, why not use team strength? They didn't need much tactics in the Giro, but now you have Ayuso, Yates, Almeida, all a GC threat. Vingegaard won't be able to cover all attacks, he will be watching Pog and that's it. It would be really bad tactics from UAE if they didn't try to attack with other riders, this is how you win against a strong rider with a weaker team.

 

[Peyroteo94]

I think he is focusing his training more on long climbs. Unfortunately, after seeing the level of Vingegaard, I'm afraid he can't distance him on shallow gradients. However, I have a hard time seeing Vingegaard dropping Pogacar in any kind of climb.

 

[solo80k]

It is a long way to the end. He does not have to drop him. He just has to win TT's against him and not get dropped himself. Let's wait a little until any conclusions.

The race will be decided before the final ITT (staged 15, 19, 20), of course it's my honest opinion. 😅

And if I'm wrong, Jonas knows how good to ride exceptional TT as well.

 

[meat puppet]

Also Pogacar wasnt really full on attacking if he was I would be worried, it seems like the plan is to save and wait for stage 4 ?judging by the way the team ride, and just when he heard Roglic was back he went and wasnt sort of planned attack.

Someone on the forum said the duo smashed the record on that hill. And while at it, they dropped the others like bad habits plus took 10-15sec in a matter of a minute or so.

Let's assume this is so (correct me if this is wrong): it was a full attack.

 

[Medvind]

Also Pogacar wasnt really full on attacking if he was I would be worried, it seems like the plan is to save and wait for stage 4 ?judging by the way the team ride, and just when he heard Roglic was back he went and wasnt sort of planned attack.

Think it will take some deep digs by his doms to put Vinge in red and for Pog to succeed with an attack. I think UAE should make it hard on stage 4 but not go too deep, especially not sacrifice Yates, maybe it will be enough, otherwise go for bonus seconds in the end. Pog's best chance of taking some time is stage 7 tt. Don't think Vinge's tt shape is as good as Pog's right now (might change to the last tt).

 

[James M]

Think it will take some deep digs by his doms to put Vinge in red and for Pog to succeed with an attack. I think UAE should make it hard on stage 4 but not go too deep, especially not sacrifice Yates, maybe it will be enough, otherwise go for bonus seconds in the end. Pog's best chance of taking some time is stage 7 tt. Don't think Vinge's tt shape is as good as Pog's right now (might change to the last tt).

Agree with you. Dropping Vingegaard with his doms is not realistic but what i meant was to use them more and make it grueling for everyone then set up for a attack if hes even feeling great that is and that was a plan I myself see (mostly because of the way they have ridden so far, conservatively) But lets see stage 4 if they have any plans or not there.

 

[James M]

This also might be a nothing burger but hes talking both days so far about saving evergy for later, a bit unusual him to do so but also never heard him mention it so frequently either like he has. Personally I will feel more certain about things after stage 4.

 

[solo80k]

Think it will take some deep digs by his doms to put Vinge in red and for Pog to succeed with an attack. I think UAE should make it hard on stage 4 but not go too deep, especially not sacrifice Yates, maybe it will be enough, otherwise go for bonus seconds in the end. Pog's best chance of taking some time is stage 7 tt. Don't think Vinge's tt shape is as good as Pog's right now (might change to the last tt).

I think UAE needs to get rid of Visma doms on Galibier and force Jonas to chase down Yates/Almeida. They need to make repeated attacks with 2/3 riders (Yates, Almeida, Pog). This is the only way UAE can drop Jonas in the current form. Isolation+ repeat attacks until he's too tired or just keeps his eye on Pog but someone else will build the time gap advantage.