Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[BigBoat]

http://www.cyclingpowermodels.com/ProRaceAnalysis.aspx

I actually like this & think its relatively close. Brajkovic typically averages 360 for an hour so he might be able to do 375 for 50 mins in a one day event, which would put the model just about 10-20 watts high.

So if Wiggins was 20 watts high his average would have been 460 watts which is damn close to his off the cuff 450 watts on the climbs statement post Tour. At 69 kg he'd have Lance Armstrongs "magic" 6.7 w/kg for sustainable power.

 

[roundabout]

It's probably around 460-470 for Wiggins.

That is assuming that Martin could still do about 450 in London.

 

[acoggan]

http://www.cyclingpowermodels.com/ProRaceAnalysis.aspx

I actually like this & think its relatively close. Brajkovic typically averages 360 for an hour so he might be able to do 375 for 50 mins in a one day event, which would put the model just about 10-20 watts high.

I.e., GIGO.

 

[acoggan]

Is this potential quantifiable at all and to what level of accuracy?

Can you give us an indication of the impact on potential and what that means in real terms for say:

anaerobic contribution at 85, 90 and 95%? I am guessing it's not 100% given it's a standing start from a rested state, right?

Or does this branch of the thread really die here because it's all pie in the sky conjecture and there have been no longitudinal studies whatsoever to cover this particular theory?

The contribution of anaerobic metabolism is readily quantifiable, but what that translates into in terms of "potential" is not (even though it is clearly true).

If it helps any, my wife and I tend to fall on opposite extremes re. our aerobic/anaerobic contributions during a 3 km pursuit, with her being 70%/30% and me being 80%/20% (vs. the typical 75%/25%). She was national champion in the pursuit but only top ~10 at nationals in the road TT, whereas I can barely crack the top 10 at master nationals in the pursuit but have made the podium multiple times in the TT.

Applied to some one like Wiggins, if they derived 90% of their power during a 4 km pursuit from aerobic sources, then I'd say that they'd probably be a pretty good TTer/stage racer (vs., say, someone for the classics, or more of an all-rounder).

 

[the big ring]

The contribution of anaerobic metabolism is readily quantifiable, but what that translates into in terms of "potential" is not (even though it is clearly true).

If it helps any, my wife and I tend to fall on opposite extremes re. our aerobic/anaerobic contributions during a 3 km pursuit, with her being 70%/30% and me being 80%/20% (vs. the typical 75%/25%). She was national champion in the pursuit but only top ~10 at nationals in the road TT, whereas I can barely crack the top 10 at master nationals in the pursuit but have made the podium multiple times in the TT.

Applied to some one like Wiggins, if they derived 90% of their power during a 4 km pursuit from aerobic sources, then I'd say that they'd probably be a pretty good TTer/stage racer (vs., say, someone for the classics, or more of an all-rounder).

What does it come back to, physically? Is it mitochondrial density? Muscle fibre types? Something else? Combinations of the above?

 

[armchairclimber]

What does it come back to, physically? Is it mitochondrial density? Muscle fibre types? Something else? Combinations of the above?

Combinations of the above plus other factors such as lung capacity, heart function, efficiency/economy of technique, fat burning efficiency...loads of factors.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Combinations of the above plus other factors such as lung capacity, heart function, efficiency/economy of technique, fat burning efficiency...loads of factors.

The typical O2 vector stuff we have seen before?

 

[the big ring]

Combinations of the above plus other factors such as lung capacity, heart function, efficiency/economy of technique, fat burning efficiency...loads of factors.

Are you saying fat burning efficiency affects the percentage of anaerobic vs aerobic power source in a 4km pursuit?

I'd predict the quantity of fat burnt during a 4km IP at the world class level to be close to 0, and fat burning efficiency to be irrelevant.

 

[armchairclimber]

Are you saying fat burning efficiency affects the percentage of anaerobic vs aerobic power source in a 4km pursuit?

I'd predict the quantity of fat burnt during a 4km IP at the world class level to be close to 0, and fat burning efficiency to be irrelevant.

It is all part of the equation. Fat burnt can be close to 0 AND significant at the same time. Go read up.

 

[the big ring]

It is all part of the equation. Fat burnt can be close to 0 AND significant at the same time. Go read up.

I'll wait till acoggan gets back to us thanks

 

[sittingbison]

RE: the suspicious bio passport numbers, there is only one leak set of numbers, immediately prior to 2010 TdF.

I listed the Sky teams of 2010, 2011 and 2012, and put the 2010 numbers against each rider. Of interest to me was the fact that 2011 they employed Knees who had a 6, and 2012 they further employed Rogers on a 7 and Siotsou (sic) on 8.

Another example of marginal gains

As to the numbers themselves, and indeed the bio passport in general, it does not really mean much as the UCI is not using either in the manner expected by the public

 

[jilbiker]

Konychev said, "If they [Sky] win here, it'll be an amazing year for them....An "amazing" year. Yes beyond belief....All these couched terms for "yes, that will confirm the juice". I think Froome not looking in the least bit tired after acting as domestique (which means burn yourself out for the leader) in the TDF, plus riding in the Olympics is just baffling. Just as the french suspect that the British team had something "new" they were hiding, i think Sky has something new that is 2 steps ahead of any WADA.

 

[Franklin]

Vuelta stage 6, last two km on the final climb:

Three Sky riders still on the front.

 

[the big ring]

Watching a stream so hard to tell, but 3 Sky riders looks like the dominant team at the front of the Vuelta.

SStrategyDD.

Porte backing up from an easy TdF and Uran helping out Froome post easy TdF.

2km to go to the summit.

Porte leading, about to drop Cobo. Noone can attack, according to Sean Kelly's commentator mate.

Cobo is dropped. By Porte.

 

[the big ring]

Froome drops Contador.

 

[the big ring]

Sky can win 3 GTs in a year. No problem.

 

[the sceptic]

Sky can win 3 GTs in a year. No problem.

Froome can win all 3 next year. Wouldnt surprise me.

 

[the big ring]

Amazing what you can do with a warm down and some marginal gains. All clean of course.

 

[Der Effe]

Sky can win 3 GTs in a year. No problem.

Froome will, next year.

 

[hrotha]

Watching a stream so hard to tell, but 3 Sky riders looks like the dominant team at the front of the Vuelta.

SStrategyDD.

Porte backing up from an easy TdF and Uran helping out Froome post easy TdF.

2km to go to the summit.

Porte leading, about to drop Cobo. Noone can attack, according to Sean Kelly's commentator mate.

Cobo is dropped. By Porte.

That wasn't Porte, it was Henao.

 

[the big ring]

That wasn't Porte, it was Henao.

I claim poor quality streaming. Thanks.

He was still dropping Cobo as a domestique. Cobo is a pretty good climber yeah?

 

[DominicDecoco]

I claim poor quality streaming. Thanks.

He was still dropping Cobo as a domestique. Cobo is a pretty good climber yeah?

“Personally I’m not in great shape,” Cobo said on Friday, “thanks to this infectionn I’m not in the shape I’d like to be. My idea is to improve my condition as the race progresses and do what I can

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cobo-im-not-in-great-shape

 

[the big ring]

“Personally I’m not in great shape,” Cobo said on Friday, “thanks to this infectionn I’m not in the shape I’d like to be. My idea is to improve my condition as the race progresses and do what I can

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cobo-im-not-in-great-shape

Thanks. Must be difficult as the previous year's winner to be dropped by a contender's domestiques 12 months later.

Like I said elsewhere, the fat lady ain't had breakfast yet, and there's still 2+ weeks to go. Can't imagine Sky are sending their boy up the road like that prematurely though.

 

[User Guide]

Thanks. Must be difficult as the previous year's winner to be dropped by a contender's domestiques 12 months later.

Like I said elsewhere, the fat lady ain't had breakfast yet, and there's still 2+ weeks to go. Can't imagine Sky are sending their boy up the road like that prematurely though.

Its a little disingenuous too call Uran and Henao domestiques.
Both are way better climbers than any of the TDF sky train.

 

[the big ring]

Its a little disingenuous too call Uran and Henao domestiques.
Both are way better climbers than any of the TDF sky train.

What would you call them? Team leaders? They are good climbers, sure, but Cobo does ok for a Vuelta winner too.