I always try to believe that riders are clean... But for basically the first time i just cannot believe Froomes HUGE jump in TT performance... Its a joke, Wiggins, hes a TT specialist, always has been, i can believe that.... just...
- Mar 10, 2009
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Yesterday and Saturday people were defending the performance with saying this and guy are not there and they had good form and a good day. Today the same, with different competitors. Next week again.
One such result wouldn't be that suspicious, it can happen. It's going on day after day and I'm done with the Tour de France 2012.
One such result wouldn't be that suspicious, it can happen. It's going on day after day and I'm done with the Tour de France 2012.
- Jun 7, 2010
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maxmartin said:either SKY put cycling sport into future
or put the sport back 10 years
I am afraid the later
Right, how likely is a sudden "training breakthrough".
Will there be fat time trialists starving themselves now? Will there be Froome, Westra and Martin in the GT top 5 3 years from now?
Stay tuned.
- Mar 17, 2009
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maxmartin said:either SKY put cycling sport into future
or put the sport back 10 years
I am afraid the later
Yes- I'm afraid this is just not this Tour alone, but they're going to carry on with whatever the methods they're using for this one.
Will they reach a level that even a "prepared Contador & Andy" cannot even get near them?
- Jun 7, 2010
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Parrot23 said:Okay, like the three best climbers in the world absent this tour too: Alberto, Andy S., and Rodriguez.
This reminds me of the arguments about Cobo in the last Vuelta. Who did he beat, Monfort, Menchov who is past it and Wiggins
D). Nothing suspicous about that. maxmartin said:
Well the thing is, losing all this weight definetely makes him a better climber and at the very least makes his recent climbing performance seem legit. The thing that I can't understand and is very suspicious is that he seems to be TTing better than ever, even though is so much lighter that he ever was.
I never write on this board before but seeing Sky running away with the tour this years is making me reethink that the sport was getting cleaner...
Proper high mountains comin up. Now sky have been putting the best climbers in the world to the sword in the smaller stuff. What will they do in the high stuff?
I hope they get dropped but I think its gonna be more of the same.
I hope they get dropped but I think its gonna be more of the same.
Here are just some of the questions that I desperately hope some brave journalist will ask Bradley Wiggins and / or Dave Brailsford today at the post stage press-conferences:
1. Brad, after you improved dramatically in 2009 to finish fourth overall at the Tour de France, you were interviewed by Daniel Benson from cyclingnews.com (interview published here: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-calls-for-biological-passport-data-to-be-made-public).
You stated in that interview that you understood why some people thought you doped. Specifically, you said “I think it was the natural thing. Everyone thought I was on gear after that and I can’t blame people for that.” You also said ““I would have thought the same thing about someone who had come from absolutely out of nowhere from the gruppetto and finished fourth on the Tour”.
Yesterday, you stated that people on the internet that think you and or Team Sky are doping are “c*nts”, “w*ankers” and “bone-idle”.
Can you please explain why you thought it was natural to speculate you were doping in 2009, but now anyone who speculates that you dope is a “c*nt”?
2. Brad, in an interview with L’Equipe earlier this year, you stated that “It would be nice to be part of it in a positive way, because there aren’t a lot of Tour winners who you can believe in. For the first time last year, you had a Tour winner who everyone could believe in. He is a fantastic ambassador for the sport, he works hard, he didn’t win by showing off, but with great determination. So to be able to follow on from somebody like him would be nice, rather than doing it after somebody had a positive test hanging over his head for a year or two.” (Source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-wants-to-be-a-credible-tour-de-france-winner).
Since even you don’t believe that many Tour de France winners have been clean, does that mean that you too are a are “c*nt”, “w*anker” and “bone-idle”, or are you just a hypocrite?
3. Earlier this year, Team Sky met with the owners of le Tour de France, ASO, and presented them training data, power details and information to justify your performances this year (source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sky-meeting-with-aso-is-routine-team-says).
Can you confirm that you presented ASO with your training data to allay suspicions about your performance? Can you also advise if you think the ASO are “c*nts”, “w*ankers” and “bone-idle”?
4. In response to the news that Team Sky had met with ASO, a spokesman for the team told cyclingnews.com that: ““We felt it’s our job to be transparent and tell people what we’re doing, and the more we can tell people the less mystery there is. We’re not doing it to try and convince them we’re clean, we are clean. We’re meeting them because we’re genuinely proud of the work we doing and they enjoyed what we had to show them.”
If Team Sky is genuinely proud about the work you are doing, why have you been transparent with the ASO and given them access to your data, but not been transparent with the fans and general public? In order to allay suspicions, will you publish on the internet all training data, training plans, blood testing data and the like not just for Brad Wiggins, but for every rider on Team Sky?
5. In July 2009, in a bid to prove that you had raced clean at the 2009 Tour de France, where you finished 4th, you published your blood passport data for the period February 16, 2008 to July 28, 2009. You later told cyclingnews.com, in an interview, that:
“I think they should make these things public. The whole blood passport should be on [the] internet, every rider in the peloton. I don’t see why it shouldn’t be. It’s got to that stage now where if there’s nothing to hide why aren’t they up there? You can pull up in any walk of life, company accounts, people’s tax and that’s public knowledge, so I don’t see why the blood passport shouldn’t be public knowledge. It will silence people or challenge certain things but I don’t see what harm it would do. It would give you credibility in the public’s eyes … but I don’t think everyone would agree to it, maybe for moral reasons or people thinking that it might be an invasion of privacy.” (Source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-calls-for-biological-passport-data-to-be-made-public).
Since you have not published any of your blood passport data since that time, does that mean, by your own words, that you have something to hide? Again, if you have nothing to hide, will you now publish your blood passport data on the internet for the period July 29, 2009 to today’s date?
6. You have been quoted as saying that when you concentrated on your track career, you weighed 82 kg, and that now you weigh 71 kg (source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tour-shorts-losing-interest-time-trial-preparation-and-drinking) .
When you were a track athlete, you were an elite athlete, a multiple world and Olympic champion. You were in peak physical condition. Your BMI would have been very low, and there would have been little if any fat on your frame that you could lose. Realistically therefore, when you lost the 11kg after concentrating on road racing, you primarily lost 11kg of muscle mass.
According to the book "Human Anatomy and Physiology" the average male adult is made up of approximately 42 percent skeletal muscle. (Source: http://www.livestrong.com/article/368497-percentage-of-body-mass-bone/). At 82kg, you would therefore have had 33.62kg (approximately) of skeletal muscle mass.
Can you please explain to the internet skeptics how you could lose one third of your skeletal muscle mass, but not lose any power? Indeed, can you please explain how you can lose one third of your muscle mass, and actually increase your power?
7. You stated in 2007, when your team Cofidis was ejected from the tour, that:
"Hopefully in two years time when I return to the Tour I might be the Prologue winner or I might win the Time Trial and be a credible Time Trial winner because I haven't beaten someone by two and a half minutes. Credible, clean riders are what's gonna be the future of the sport." (Source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/angry-wiggins-sees-hope-in-new-generation).
Since your winning time today was 57 seconds quicker than the 4 time world time trial champion, 1min 43s quicker than a noted time trailer like Cadel Evans, or 2min 08s quicker than multiple grand tour winner and noted time trialist Dennis Menchov, and 2min 16s quicker than the current world time trial champion, can you explain to the skeptics why they should think your performance today was credible?
8. You have claimed that you no longer drink any alcohol (source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tour-shorts-losing-interest-time-trial-preparation-and-drinking). If that is true, can you please explain your ridiculous sideburns?
1. Brad, after you improved dramatically in 2009 to finish fourth overall at the Tour de France, you were interviewed by Daniel Benson from cyclingnews.com (interview published here: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-calls-for-biological-passport-data-to-be-made-public).
You stated in that interview that you understood why some people thought you doped. Specifically, you said “I think it was the natural thing. Everyone thought I was on gear after that and I can’t blame people for that.” You also said ““I would have thought the same thing about someone who had come from absolutely out of nowhere from the gruppetto and finished fourth on the Tour”.
Yesterday, you stated that people on the internet that think you and or Team Sky are doping are “c*nts”, “w*ankers” and “bone-idle”.
Can you please explain why you thought it was natural to speculate you were doping in 2009, but now anyone who speculates that you dope is a “c*nt”?
2. Brad, in an interview with L’Equipe earlier this year, you stated that “It would be nice to be part of it in a positive way, because there aren’t a lot of Tour winners who you can believe in. For the first time last year, you had a Tour winner who everyone could believe in. He is a fantastic ambassador for the sport, he works hard, he didn’t win by showing off, but with great determination. So to be able to follow on from somebody like him would be nice, rather than doing it after somebody had a positive test hanging over his head for a year or two.” (Source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-wants-to-be-a-credible-tour-de-france-winner).
Since even you don’t believe that many Tour de France winners have been clean, does that mean that you too are a are “c*nt”, “w*anker” and “bone-idle”, or are you just a hypocrite?
3. Earlier this year, Team Sky met with the owners of le Tour de France, ASO, and presented them training data, power details and information to justify your performances this year (source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sky-meeting-with-aso-is-routine-team-says).
Can you confirm that you presented ASO with your training data to allay suspicions about your performance? Can you also advise if you think the ASO are “c*nts”, “w*ankers” and “bone-idle”?
4. In response to the news that Team Sky had met with ASO, a spokesman for the team told cyclingnews.com that: ““We felt it’s our job to be transparent and tell people what we’re doing, and the more we can tell people the less mystery there is. We’re not doing it to try and convince them we’re clean, we are clean. We’re meeting them because we’re genuinely proud of the work we doing and they enjoyed what we had to show them.”
If Team Sky is genuinely proud about the work you are doing, why have you been transparent with the ASO and given them access to your data, but not been transparent with the fans and general public? In order to allay suspicions, will you publish on the internet all training data, training plans, blood testing data and the like not just for Brad Wiggins, but for every rider on Team Sky?
5. In July 2009, in a bid to prove that you had raced clean at the 2009 Tour de France, where you finished 4th, you published your blood passport data for the period February 16, 2008 to July 28, 2009. You later told cyclingnews.com, in an interview, that:
“I think they should make these things public. The whole blood passport should be on [the] internet, every rider in the peloton. I don’t see why it shouldn’t be. It’s got to that stage now where if there’s nothing to hide why aren’t they up there? You can pull up in any walk of life, company accounts, people’s tax and that’s public knowledge, so I don’t see why the blood passport shouldn’t be public knowledge. It will silence people or challenge certain things but I don’t see what harm it would do. It would give you credibility in the public’s eyes … but I don’t think everyone would agree to it, maybe for moral reasons or people thinking that it might be an invasion of privacy.” (Source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-calls-for-biological-passport-data-to-be-made-public).
Since you have not published any of your blood passport data since that time, does that mean, by your own words, that you have something to hide? Again, if you have nothing to hide, will you now publish your blood passport data on the internet for the period July 29, 2009 to today’s date?
6. You have been quoted as saying that when you concentrated on your track career, you weighed 82 kg, and that now you weigh 71 kg (source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tour-shorts-losing-interest-time-trial-preparation-and-drinking) .
When you were a track athlete, you were an elite athlete, a multiple world and Olympic champion. You were in peak physical condition. Your BMI would have been very low, and there would have been little if any fat on your frame that you could lose. Realistically therefore, when you lost the 11kg after concentrating on road racing, you primarily lost 11kg of muscle mass.
According to the book "Human Anatomy and Physiology" the average male adult is made up of approximately 42 percent skeletal muscle. (Source: http://www.livestrong.com/article/368497-percentage-of-body-mass-bone/). At 82kg, you would therefore have had 33.62kg (approximately) of skeletal muscle mass.
Can you please explain to the internet skeptics how you could lose one third of your skeletal muscle mass, but not lose any power? Indeed, can you please explain how you can lose one third of your muscle mass, and actually increase your power?
7. You stated in 2007, when your team Cofidis was ejected from the tour, that:
"Hopefully in two years time when I return to the Tour I might be the Prologue winner or I might win the Time Trial and be a credible Time Trial winner because I haven't beaten someone by two and a half minutes. Credible, clean riders are what's gonna be the future of the sport." (Source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/angry-wiggins-sees-hope-in-new-generation).
Since your winning time today was 57 seconds quicker than the 4 time world time trial champion, 1min 43s quicker than a noted time trailer like Cadel Evans, or 2min 08s quicker than multiple grand tour winner and noted time trialist Dennis Menchov, and 2min 16s quicker than the current world time trial champion, can you explain to the skeptics why they should think your performance today was credible?
8. You have claimed that you no longer drink any alcohol (source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tour-shorts-losing-interest-time-trial-preparation-and-drinking). If that is true, can you please explain your ridiculous sideburns?
I've been very forceful in my defence of Bradley, but this is worrying. This morning when I saw his strong defence complete with swearing, I thought "good lad".
However, the fact is Sky are smashing this Tour. And we've seen this before. If they don't want to lose the PR battle they better come up with some legit answers cause at the moment it is USPS v2.0. The onus is on them to prove themselves clean, not for us to prove they're dirty.
I'm praying my worst fears aren't being realised.
However, the fact is Sky are smashing this Tour. And we've seen this before. If they don't want to lose the PR battle they better come up with some legit answers cause at the moment it is USPS v2.0. The onus is on them to prove themselves clean, not for us to prove they're dirty.
I'm praying my worst fears aren't being realised.
- Apr 11, 2009
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roundabout said:This reminds me of the arguments about Cobo in the last Vuelta. Who did he beat, Monfort, Menchov who is past it and Wiggins
Correct. Cobo I never believed. Problem with him is that he has all sorts of self-admitted depression problems too. Can't motivate himself to get on the bike at times.
SiAp1984 said:
It reminds me way more of when Stefan Schumacher beat Cancellara in both the ITTs at the Tour!
Fabian didn't take well to that one at all. I think it's coming to the point where the peloton is going to start turning on these guys.
- Apr 11, 2009
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rghysens said:
No, they had extremely strong opposition and yet spanked them easily. This whole Tour is an outlier favouring Sky. Just wait till Bertie and Andy return next year in a Tour with a lot of big mountain top finishes. It'll be real dogfight then. Not like this year so far.
There's no way Sky will blow them away in the mountains. Alberto and Andy can change the pace and recover.
The future of cycling announced itself today. Funnily enough, it looks just like the past.
I guess I just don't believe in miracles anymore.
Wish I did.
I guess I just don't believe in miracles anymore.
Wish I did.
The worst thing about this is the last team to do this is only getting their final justice (maybe) now, 14 years after it all started.
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