Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Dr. Maserati]

You must have read a different reply, no anger, straight question

Secondly, I have to put that question to each one of them individually? The quote "some people on here" should have given you a clue that it was aimed at, err, "some people"! If the cap fits. And the only thing I defend is a fair shot at what is truth, what is expressed as the truth, and what is simply an opinion based on the facts available.

Why not?
I take the time to respond to your posts - I address what you write.

You're querying (unnamed) peoples motives - not what they say. Not a very good argument.

As for facts, the information of previous wrong doing within the team proves jack about whether the top riders are doping in this Tour. I treat Sky with the same scepticism as any other team, I'm just not as prone to condemning people with no direct evidence as some on here are. Drat, that word again, do I need to go back and make the point to them individually?? Just asking...

Fine - you're perfectly entitled to that, although it would be interesting to know have you said that about other teams?
Likewise others are perfectly entitled to comment on the suspicion - what i have found both interesting and sad, is that many normally neutral posters have expressed dissatisfaction at what they saw.

 

[goober]

No need to get angry.
All I asked was what 'facts' you bring - the answer is none.
Has anyone here stated as facts that they saw such and such a rider dope?
QUOTE]

If I put the name up it would be taken down ( so please dont ask me to) and dont put the name up those of you who know who. Bit I have witnessed the neadle going in on 4 ocassions, 4 differant riders.
One is backroom staff on this TDF of a team sponsored by a major broadcaster. Go figure?
You dont need the names to say it.

Sounds like a bunch of hogwash to me.

 

[Darryl Webster]

Sounds like a bunch of hogwash to me.

Yeh, I should have took pictures eh?.

 

[Parrot23]

Sounds like a bunch of hogwash to me.

Was that Hogwash or hogwash? (Bruyneel has to be lurking somewhere).

The clinic is better than a soap opera, but I also enjoy the Radioshack Nissan thread. Four Shack guys in the finale today. Just two Sky's. By my advanced calculations this is a +2. Slam dunk.

Very suspicious, ROFLMAO.

 

[Parrot23]

"Sky=Murdoch=David Cameron=Buckingham Palace=Diana=a conspiracy in a French tunnel=Dodi Fayad=Harrods=expensive shopping=inflation rate=Phillips Curve=stagflation=global economic crises=a failure by Obama to get re-elected=a conspiracy in Kenya by Froome with Obama's birth records.

I think I've missed something here."

lol - stream of consciousness!

No, it's the iron laws of "clinical" logic.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Eurosport just played an interview with Froome from earlier before the start of today's stage and he said when they woke up early they had to do a blood doping control this morning.

Does "never tested positive" ring a bell? Marion Jones? Or, is that too much reality to contend with.

I couldn't watch the end today for fear of another Sky Pro Wrestling finish. I won't watch the ITT either. And there you have the consequences of ASO's permissive doping strategy.

 

[Fergoose]

The clinic is better than a soap opera, but I also enjoy the Radioshack Nissan thread. Four Shack guys in the finale today. Just two Sky's. By my advanced calculations this is a +2. Slam dunk.

And what about Lotto ripping up the field on the climb with only one guy doing the pacemaking (rather than shared among an entire team as Sky did)? My oh my.

More seriously, several riders that put in a massive effort yesterday (Taaramae, EBH, Porte, Rogers) were nowhere today and appeared to have suffered as a consequence.

The Sky lads not being there with Froome & Wiggins put them slightly at risk given the possible need to pull any attack back from the descent in the closing kilometres, so it's hard to think Porte & Rogers were deliberately being rested. You saw EBH getting detached on the penultimate climb, but then caught up by the foot of the final one, so he wasn't trying to take it easy either. Today is not a clear indication that EBH, Porte & Rogers are legit, but it is another piece in the puzzle that shouldn't be ignored.

 

[maxmartin]

Guess the feedback of Wiggin's yesterday interview is not too good, he changed his tone for today

 

[Parrot23]

You saw EBH getting detached on the penultimate climb, but then caught up by the foot of the final one, so he wasn't trying to take it easy either.

I think it was EBH who put in the massive injection of pace before the final climb yesterday, which did in Leipheimer, and a lot of others, etc. Lot of folks were in trouble before the climb. EBH can do that.

 

[Fergoose]

I think it was EBH who put in the massive injection of pace before the final climb yesterday, which did in Leipheimer, and a lot of others, etc. Lot of folks were in trouble before the climb. EBH can do that.

Yes. My point is that today we saw the apparent consequence of EBH putting in a strong effort yesterday. Today he was long gone well before Sagan, his nearest comparable performer.

EDIT: Ruddy quotations mucking up.

 

[Frosty]

EBH spent a lot of time on the front today, i took that to be the reason why he got dropped when he did.

 

[Parrot23]

Yes. My point is that today we saw the apparent consequence of EBH putting in a strong effort yesterday. Today he was long gone well before Sagan, his nearest comparable performer.

Yes, agree. I just added that it was indeed his pace before the climb yesterday that shredded many contenders. If doped to the gills, that wouldn't factor as much. But hey, even the Sky driver and team mechanics are juiced on this thread.

I was waiting for Greipel to be the point man for Van den Broek today, towing him to the finish. With those 2,000 watts, clinicians will be getting very suspicious. Some can't tell the difference between 480 watts for 18 minutes vs. 45 minutes and have forgotten the world's best climbers aren't here (I can think of at least three).

 

[Caruut]

Yes, agree. I just added that it was indeed his pace before the climb yesterday that shredded many contenders. If doped to the gills, that wouldn't factor as much. But hey, even the Sky driver and team mechanics are juiced on this thread.

I was waiting for Greipel to be the point man for Van den Broek today, towing him to the finish. With those 2,000 watts, clinicians will be getting very suspicious. Some can't tell the difference between 480 watts for 18 minutes vs. 45 minutes and have forgotten the world's best climbers aren't here (I can think of at least three).

Still haven't explained why Sky have Geert Leinders though. No, don't worry about answering that, just keep putting words into people's mouths and attacking strawmen, that'll silence the doubters.

 

[Parrot23]

Still haven't explained why Sky have Geert Leinders though. No, don't worry about answering that, just keep putting words into people's mouths and attacking strawmen, that'll silence the doubters.

You don't get it. On balance, I don't quite believe Sky. Certainly wouldn't put down money on their being clean, put it that way, if I had to put my money where my mouth were. I wouldn't bet on any pro team, for that matter.

But it's just the series of marshmallow heads and the amateur slanderers in search of catharsis who are parading around here who are too entertaining to miss.

 

[Caruut]

You don't get it. On balance, I don't quite believe Sky. Certainly wouldn't put down money on their being clean, put it that way, if I had to put my money where my mouth were. I wouldn't bet on any pro team.

But it's just the series of marshmallow heads parading around here who are too entertaining to miss.

Why not just be entertained, then, instead of positioning yourself as Sky's answer to Polish?

 

[roundabout]

You don't get it. On balance, I don't quite believe Sky. Certainly wouldn't put down money on their being clean, put it that way, if I had to put my money where my mouth were. I wouldn't bet on any pro team, for that matter.

But it's just the series of marshmallow heads and the amateur slanderers in search of catharsis who are parading around here who are too entertaining to miss.

So you're basically baiting people.

 

[thehog]

Wait to footage becomes available of today's press conference of Wiggins. A question in regards to doping..... he loses it!

 

[Parrot23]

So you're basically baiting people.

No, I'm parodying some ridiculous "arguments" and slanders masquerading as definitive fact.

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

Wait to footage becomes available of today's press conference of Wiggins. A question in regards to doping..... he loses it!

The thing is you can read that in different ways. Chances are what you initial view is will dictate why he reacted.

 

[Parrot23]

Wait to footage becomes available of today's press conference of Wiggins. A question in regards to doping..... he loses it!

Haven't seen it, but some of their demeanour I don't like--an avoidance of sorts, perhaps putative guilty feelings. Not the best vibes. Purely subjective and not the basis for an argument by me or anyone, just for my own sussing out or opinion. I'm not sure yet.

(And Pedro is right about initial positions shaping subsequent impressions.)

 

[roundabout]

No, no, I'm parodying some ridiculous "arguments" and slanders masquerading as definitive fact.

Even though you don't really believe in Sky. Gotcha.

 

[thehog]

Haven't seen it, but some of their demeanour I don't like--an avoidance of sorts, perhaps putative guilty feelings. Not the best vibes. Purely subjective and not the basis for an argument by me or anyone, just for my own sussing out or opinion. I'm not sure yet.

It didn't come across well at all.... fair question I thought. They have to ask it after yesterday's effort.

 

[Parrot23]

Even though you don't really believe in Sky. Gotcha.

Not at all. I'm tilting the ship the other way from what has been a ridiculously one-sided argument. This is opinion and debate for the sake of debate.

Nothing in the pro peloton is black and white, and nothing I'm saying is either.

 

[thehog]

It didn't come across well at all.... fair question I thought. They have to ask it after yesterday's effort.

He used the term "fuc_king wan)kers"........

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Wait to footage becomes available of today's press conference of Wiggins. A question in regards to doping..... he loses it!

Hoggy your mate Jv has this to say

Daniel Benson ‏@dnlbenson
Wiggins loses his cool when asked about doping during his post stage press con

Jonathan Vaughters
@dnlbenson as he well should.