Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Peyroteo94]

Remco's raw overall talent is great Ive acknowledged this several times, it's just the truth. But just as thats true, the reality is that Remco, by fans here, is extremely overrated when you put him next to Pogacar, where he simply doesn't belong at all, like why would u do that, not even helping Remcos case.

The reality is, Remco isn't close to the likes of MvdP in the classics or Jonas in the GT. Before even mentioning Pogacar who is better than both of them in both aspects—Remco needs to learn to walk before he can run.

This is not true. MVP isn't close to Remco in hilly classics like Ardennes and Remco isn't close to MVP in classics like PR or RVV. They don't compete in the same type of classics.

 

[Peyroteo94]

MVDP literally won MSR and PR from Pogacar, and only lost RvV because he was sick. And you say Pogacar is better in classics?

Like 2023, where he was sick too.

 

[James M]

This is not true. MVP isn't close to Remco in hilly classics like Ardennes and Remco isn't close to MVP in classics like PR or RVV. They don't compete in the same type of classics.

I was talking in general sense, take one look at their palmares then come back. who is the best 'classic rider' its obviously MvdP is in a league different to Remco there as a whole.

MvdP also has the same execuse as Remco, both facing the same bogeymonster, just in different races.

 

[Charlyghoul]

Remco is the best time trialist on flattish courses, he isn’t the best at anything else.
He is the second best all rounder, bar Pogacar

 

[Berniece]

Like 2023, where he was sick too.

Nope, beaten fair and square. But just like Pogacar in 2024, MVDP was also a different beast after winning WC in 2023.

 

[Berniece]

You are incredible. It’s not even debatable, MvdP competes in cobble classics where you can argue he is better than Pogacar for sure 100%, not in classics overall it’s not even debatable. Like genuinly shouldnt have to even exaplain that to someone who watch every race under the sun, it shouldnt honestly be needed if where having an objective conversation. It’s not even a debate. If MvdP can win Fleche, Liege, Lombardia vs the best in same season while being his usual self in cobbles, then we can talk but as I said its not even a debate in reality..

From the moment there are enough meters in altitude, Pogacar is better. Doesn’t mean he is better in classics.

 

[Berniece]

Remco is the best time trialist on flattish courses, he isn’t the best at anything else.
He is the second best all rounder, bar Pogacar

When isn’t a course flat according to you? Because he’s the best timetrialist, period. Or you mean MTT’s or at the end of a GT?

 

[Charlyghoul]

From the moment there are enough meters in altitude, Pogacar is better. Doesn’t mean he is better in classics.

Pogacar is the best all round classics guy.
VdP is the next best, he edges Pogacar at the moment in the big cobbles, Pogacar is best overall.
Remco is third best at classics

 

[Peyroteo94]

From the moment there are enough meters in altitude, Pogacar is better. Doesn’t mean he is better in classics.

Jesus Christ. I don't even know what to say.
So LBL and GdL aren't classics?

 

[James M]

From the moment there are enough meters in altitude, Pogacar is better. Doesn’t mean he is better in classics.

What are you measuring it on, if not all the classics as a whole? We cant cherry-pick races cause you want something to be true, we obviously have to evaluate it based on all the races together, If not the whole premis is just objectively wrong, like what..

Nvm its obvious and not debatable in any objective conversations. Cobble classic is another story there you can easily argue MvdP is the best.

 

[Charlyghoul]

When isn’t a course flat according to you? Because he’s the best timetrialist, period. Or you mean MTT’s or at the end of a GT?

No I mean that Remco only beat Pog by a few seconds in a flat tt at the tour, he is the best on flat tt’s, rolling tt’s I think Pog is very close to him now.
Mountain tts of course Remco is in the bus.

 

[Berniece]

Jesus Christ. I don't even know what to say.
So LBL and GdL aren't classics?

Huh, that’s not what I said…

 

[Berniece]

What are you measuring it on, if not all the classics as a whole? We cant cherry-pick races and expect it to be reality just cause you prefer it for whatever reason, we obviously we have to evaluate it based on all the races together, If not the whole premis is just objectively wrong, like what..

Yeah all races together, most of them MVDP beat Pogacar, because MVDP barely races classics with a lot of altitude meters. Last year he tried LBL once and he isn’t going to do that again. MVDP would win Omloop, Kuurne, E3, GW against Pogacar.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Huh, that’s not what I said…

You are saying he is better in classics, maybe you are excluding hilly classics.

 

[AmRacer]

From Remco to Pogi vs Mathieu 🤣

 

[James M]

Yeah all races together, most of them MVDP beat Pogacar, because MVDP barely races classics with a lot of altitude meters. Last year he tried LBL once and he isn’t going to do that again. MVDP would win Omloop, Kuurne, E3, GW against Pogacar.

This is why I mostly dont reply to you, because you genuinely argue based on what you want to be true, and I can’t be expected to take that seriously.

You're talking about cobbled classics in a vacum, but were obviously supposed to differentiate those from the classics as a whole and put every classic into the equation? The whole presmis is just wrong if not.. Thats pretty obvious, and honestly not worth explaining further if we're operating at that level. It’s simply not objective, Im sorry.

If MvdP wins fleche, Lombardia in same season while being his usual self in cobbles we can talk objectively, im not into telling myself stuff.

 

[Berniece]

This is why I mostly dont reply to you, because you genuinely argue based on what you want to be true, and I can’t be expected to take that seriously.

You're talking about cobbled classics, but were obviously supposed to differentiate those from the classics as a whole? The whole presmis is just wrong if not.. Thats pretty obvious, and honestly not worth explaining further if we're operating at that level. It’s simply not objective, Im sorry

No, you can include any classics below 2.000 altitude meters too. You are the one only including hilly classics, instead of all of them.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Yeah all races together, most of them MVDP beat Pogacar, because MVDP barely races classics with a lot of altitude meters. Last year he tried LBL once and he isn’t going to do that again. MVDP would win Omloop, Kuurne, E3, GW against Pogacar.

What the hell? Ahahah. So MVP is better because he doesn't race hilly classics against Pogacar. So you ignore CSS, GdL, AGR, FW, Emilia, GP Montreal, SB, etc but to fit your narrative you mention Omloop, Kuurne, E3, GW since Pogacar is probably weaker than MVP there.

 

[Berniece]

What the hell? Ahahah. So MVP is better because he doesn't race hilly classics against Pogacar. So you ignore CSS, GdL, AGR, FW, Emilia, GP Montreal, SB, etc but to fit your narrative you mention Omloop, Kuurne, E3, GW since Pogacar is probably weaker than MVP there.

No, I’m saying you are excluding too many classics and only focusing on hilly ones. Like you include Montreal and then don’t say anything about how MVDP would do Quebec. Says enough really.

 

[Charlyghoul]

Even Van Aert at the moment has better classics palmares than Remco, though you’d think Remco can overtake this.
At the moment Remco is the best at flat time trials.

Also Pogacar if he wanted to concentrate on cobbles like van der poel and drop everything else , he dominates van der poel there too.

 

[Peyroteo94]

No, I’m saying you are excluding too many classics and only focusing on hilly ones. Like you include Montreal and then don’t say anything about how MVDP would do Quebec. Says enough really.

One is a 9 monuments winner,other is 8. Pogacar is on his way to become the first rider to win 3 monuments since Merckx and the first rider ever to be on the podium in all 5 monuments in a season. There is really no debate here. I'm trying to measure my words to not get a ban but like I said multiple times, you just dislike a rider so much because he is what you would want and expected your beloved rider to be. I'm sorry to say it but it's not gonna happen.

Edit: I didn't exclude classics at all. Overall Pogacar is clearly better. If I did a quick research, Pogacar would probably beat MVP in 70% of WT classics. But one day, I will do that just to kill your wishful thinking once again.

 

[James M]

Even Van Aert at the moment has better classics palmares than Remco, though you’d think Remco can overtake this.
At the moment Remco is the best at flat time trials.

Also Pogacar if he wanted to concentrate on cobbles like van der poel and drop everything else , he dominates van der poel there too.

I'm genuinely starting to feel like some Remco fans need a good dose of reality in order to move forward. Maybe it's my fault for being surprised knowing some Belgians genuinely believed that Nys would challenge Pogacar in Fleche. Maybe its a Belgian thing? I don't know, but it's strange to me when the discrepancy in what we're discussing is this massive and shouldnt need to even be explained to begin with.

Anyway, back to Remco. Letting him walk before expecting him to run is simply a sensible approach for all Remco fans. And if anyone takes offense to that, they really shouldnt, it’s actually the opposite in reality. Good for him.

 

[Peyroteo94]

New conclusion. MVP is better than Pogacar in classics and using the same logic, I can say Freire is a better "classicomano" than Boonen. If we talk about WC and monuments, Freire won more races against Boonen than the opposite.

 

[Ulle97]

I'm genuinely starting to feel like some Remco fans need a good dose of reality in order to move forward. Maybe it's my fault for being surprised knowing some Belgians genuinely believed that Nys would challenge Pogacar in Fleche. Maybe its a Belgian thing? I don't know, but it's strange to me when the discrepancy in what we're discussing is this massive and shouldnt need to even be explained to begin with.

Anyway, back to Remco. Letting him walk before expecting him to run is simply a sensible approach for all Remco fans. And if anyone takes offense to that, they really shouldnt, it’s actually the opposite in reality. Good for him.

Yes. Amen to that.

 

[Berniece]

One is a 9 monuments winner,other is 8. Pogacar is on his way to become the first rider to win 3 monuments since Merckx and the first rider ever to be on the podium in all 5 monuments in a season. There is really no debate here. I'm trying to measure my words to not get a ban but like I said multiple times, you just dislike a rider so much because he is what you would want and expected your beloved rider to be. I'm sorry to say it but it's not gonna happen.

Edit: I didn't exclude classics at all. Overall Pogacar is clearly better. If I did a quick research, Pogacar would probably beat MVP in 70% of WT classics. But one day, I will do that just to kill your wishful thinking once again.

I don’t dislike Pogacar, that’s all in your head. I do think MVDP is the better 1 day racer. It just changes when the amount of altitude meters gets too high. Somewhere around 3.000 meters