Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Big Doopie]

He said in advance that he would be aiming for a podium spot in the TdS and he' a long way off, despite half the peloton dropping out.

well sure. Based on Norway and the numbers he pushed, that was perfectly reasonable goal. You do realize that HE didn’t know in advance that he would have bad days. You do realize that right? U really can’t hold that against him. He has underperformed. He knows he has underperformed. The stage that MOST suited him was the one he lost most time in. He’s not clairvoyant you know.

 

[Riek s]

I don't believe the peaked to soon, it was his first race back.
It is also not like being overtrained,. Its not like the last part of 2021 where he did many races because he was again reaching his old level.

But you just don't loose 70W in a week (at least not if it isn't a race every day. There is something else going on that he yet doesn't understand. Either heat got to him (as 'rode duivels' aludes to, or he is sick but has lack of other symptoms. (wouldn't be the first who feels more fatigued without other complaints). I still think the sickness is the most likely scenario given his roommate is out with Covid + a lot of others in the peleton.

 

[Andre]

He said in advance that he would be aiming for a podium spot in the TdS and he' a long way off, despite half the peloton dropping out.

half the peloton? no..29 riders I believe as of yesterday...riders that gave up, unlike Remco, who is still battling through heat exhaustion. He hasn't given up as of yet anyway.

 

[peterfin]

Heat exhaustion looks like the most plausible explanation for his drop in performance. The combination of relatively hot conditions (~30 deg) and high humidity are sufficient to result in excessive sweating. Without sufficient drinking, the loss of water and electrolytes results in a rise in the body core temperature. As a result he may experience dizziness, confusion, feeling of exhaustion, a loss in performance and even cramps. As mentioned, an athlete normally recovers in 24-48 hours but it depends on his treatment.

 

[Savant12]

Is this the Remco is the new ....... he should work on a sprint and concentrate on classics thread?

As long as those classics are 100% tarmac.

 

[dazaau]

half the peloton? no..29 riders I believe as of yesterday...riders that gave up, unlike Remco, who is still battling through heat exhaustion. He hasn't given up as of yet anyway.

Lol. This is gold. Do you think riding with covid is an option? Did Remco tell you he has heat exhaustion? If he does get a positive covid test I'm glad to hear he will keep going though, and not give up like those other soft as excuses for cyclists

 

[peterfin]

Btw, if heat exhaustion is the problem, QST has again no clue that this the real cause is. It's clear that Remco didn't get any wiser as he believes that he peaked too early and is now facing a dip.

His power issues during climbs in very cold weather are a similar issue. Literature suggest that it's likely related to a drop in core body temperature. Hydratation may also play a role here. I also believe that QST has neither a clue.

This and the strategy of the team regarding Remco's weight casts serious doubt over the capabilities of QST to properly support a GT rider. Things are different if you focus on the typical classics guy who are not exposed to climbing in extreme conditions or at least have nothing to win in those conditions.

 

[Cookster15]

Hmmm, Remco seems fragile? I can't wait until he finally puts all these excuses behind him so all this never ending conjecture over what he is truly capable of in grand tours he has never finished might be worth enduring. He is 22 now which is older than Andy Schleck at 2007 Giro or of course Pogacar at the 2020 TdF both of whom were just 21.

 

[Big Doopie]

Hmmm, Remco seems fragile? I can't wait until he finally puts all these excuses behind him so all this never ending conjecture over what he is truly capable of in grand tours he has never finished might be worth enduring. He is 22 now which is older than Andy Schleck at 2007 Giro or of course Pogacar at the 2020 TdF both of whom were just 21.

andy schleck performances can only be discussed in the clinic. absolutely pointless comparison.

it will be remco's bane that he was born in the era of pog -- not in any way a normal trajectory to be compared to, a generational freak.

 

[Cookster15]

andy schleck performances can only be discussed in the clinic. absolutely pointless comparison.

it will be remco's bane that he was born in the era of pog -- not in any way a normal trajectory to be compared to, a generational freak.

Disagree, it is valid and I think yours is too simple an explanation. And we have been led to believe Remco is also a generational freak - on paper at least? Feel free to take it to the clinic where I could explain.

I was in awe of Remco after his performances at the 2018 worlds when still a junior. But now I, like many am impatient for him to stop teasing us and deliver at a Grand Tour. LBL was impressive but that race has also been won by riders like Simon Gerrans and Jakob Fuglsang.

He didn't help his cause at the 2021 Giro when he and others hyped up his battle with Bernal then crashed out. After a very strong start he started leaking time on the dirt of stage 11 before suffering on the Zoncolan stage and eventually crashing out on stage 17.

I look forward to being proven wrong about him.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Disagree, it is valid and I think yours is too simple an explanation. And we have been led to believe Remco is also a generational freak - on paper at least? Feel free to take it to the clinic where I could explain.

I was in awe of Remco after his performances at the 2018 worlds when still a junior. But now I, like many am impatient for him to stop teasing us and deliver at a Grand Tour. LBL was impressive but that race has also been won by riders like Simon Gerrans and Jakob Fuglsang.

He didn't help his cause at the 2021 Giro when he and others hyped up his battle with Bernal then crashed out. After a very strong start he started leaking time on the dirt of stage 11 before suffering on the Zoncolan stage and eventually crashing out on stage 17.

I look forward to being proven wrong about him.

And the Giro has been won by Hesjedal. And the Tour has been won by Pereiro Sio.

 

[Cookster15]

And the Giro has been won by Hesjedal. And the Tour has been won by Pereiro Sio.

This is a sideshow that does nothing to convince me Remco's hype is justified at this time. When he finishes a grand tour we will know. Until then I remain sceptical.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

This is a sideshow that does nothing to convince me Remco's hype is justified at this time. When he finishes a grand tour we will know. Until then I remain sceptical.

Just pointing out the BS in your post regarding winners of races in order to downplay a major win. You can remain sceptical, i have no interest in convincing you of whatever. If the hype isn't justified for a 22 year old who has already won a monument (youngest LBL/monument winner since the 1960's IIRC) with 30 pro victories and WCC/ECC medals, well i guess you are the one with the problem, not Remco.

 

[Cookster15]

Just pointing out the BS in your post regarding winners of races in order to downplay a major win. You can remain sceptical, i have no interest in convincing you of whatever. If the hype isn't justified for a 22 year old who has already won a monument (youngest LBL/monument winner since the 1960's IIRC) with 30 pro victories and WCC/ECC medals, well i guess you are the one with the problem, not Remco.

Calm down, nobody has a "problem" for merely sharing an opinion. Did I not state I was in awe of him after 2018 worlds or that I look forward to being proven wrong about him ?

When Remco wins a grand tour I will be the first to acknowledge it, you don't have to convince me of anything that is up to Remco. Perhaps I will concede I put too much weight on the 2021 Giro. But he has shown plenty of chinks in his amour in various aspects of racing even if obviously he is still young and a huge talent.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Calm down, nobody has a "problem" for merely sharing an opinion. Did I not state I was in awe of him after 2018 worlds or that I look forward to being proven wrong about him ?

When Remco wins a grand tour I will be the first to acknowledge it, you don't have to convince me of anything that is up to Remco. Perhaps I will concede I put too much weight on the 2021 Giro. But he has shown plenty of chinks in his amour in various aspects of racing even if obviously he is still young and a huge talent.

It gets tiresome when people come up with disingenuous arguments to downplay what he has already achieved. Nick Nuyens won RVV, so i guess Van der Poel has little to show for the hype of the past 11 years. Right? And he wasn't even 22 when he won.

The problem with the 2021 Giro is that as time went by we started to hear about all sorts of things that had gone wrong. And while you may have felt ''duped'' at the time, considering the circumstances, he did better than you could realistically expect. The problem is that a lot of those circumstances might not have been clear at the time. Also, him and the team have always said to take it day by day in the 2021 Giro. You seem to feel somewhat entitled saying ''But now I, like many am impatient for him to stop teasing us and deliver at a Grand Tour. '' You also seem to forget he basically lost at least an entire year of his development. So i think a big part of you feeling ''impatient and teased'' has in fact been waiting and sitting through roughly a year of him fighting to come back, in bed, in a wheelchair, walking on crutches, zwift rides... and expecting him to hit it out of the park the moment he pinned on a bib. I can definitely relate and obviously i would have hoped him to have been further by now but at i think what i said in my previous post is actually quite accurate. If you can't put that- every high and low - and your own expectations into perspective, the problem lies with you.

I have no problem with being sceptic about what has been going wrong since his comeback. WIth asking questions as to what causes him to have these off-days. I wonder myself. But ignoring the difficult trajectory he's been on and downplaying the things he has actually achieved in the meanwhile, is simply unfair.

 

[Savant12]

Btw, if heat exhaustion is the problem, QST has again no clue that this the real cause is. It's clear that Remco didn't get any wiser as he believes that he peaked too early and is now facing a dip.

His power issues during climbs in very cold weather are a similar issue. Literature suggest that it's likely related to a drop in core body temperature. Hydratation may also play a role here. I also believe that QST has neither a clue.

This and the strategy of the team regarding Remco's weight casts serious doubt over the capabilities of QST to properly support a GT rider. Things are different if you focus on the typical classics guy who are not exposed to climbing in extreme conditions or at least have nothing to win in those conditions.

Remco excels when it is not too hot and not too cold? He is the Goldilocks of cycling. The conditions have got to be "just right".

 

[Rackham]

It gets tiresome when people come up with disingenuous arguments to downplay what he has already achieved. Nick Nuyens won RVV, so i guess Van der Poel has little to show for the hype of the past 11 years. Right? And he wasn't even 22 when he won.

I'm reading this fascinating conversation & this right here is the underlying cause of your issue, i.e. you're too emotionally invested. You shouldn't get 'tired' or bothered when reading views you don't like about your favorite rider. Ironically, Cookster15 is literally bending over backwards to repeatedly stating Evenepoel is a massive talent, yet that's not good enough for you.

As for my opinion, I say Evenepoel should be more like Roglic. I mean literally in terms of his mental approach to racing. Roglic goes into his biggest races with a "ah it's hard to win!" or "I try to be the best version of myself" or "lots of guys are strong" etc. He smashed the Vuelta last summer... without actually even stating he was there to win before the race.

So Evenepoel shouldn't go into the Tour de Suisse announcing ambitious objectives before the race (especially when he doesn't reach them). This adds unnecessary pressure on himself... & his fans.

He needs to learn this fast before the Vuelta because the opposition in Spain will be no joke.

 

[Oldermanish]

Just pointing out the BS in your post regarding winners of races in order to downplay a major win. You can remain sceptical, i have no interest in convincing you of whatever. If the hype isn't justified for a 22 year old who has already won a monument (youngest LBL/monument winner since the 1960's IIRC) with 30 pro victories and WCC/ECC medals, well i guess you are the one with the problem, not Remco.

Remco has to ride the bike, not the casual commentarian. He's had tremendous progress since his injury and deserves the opportunity to have a valley in that process without a group of monks examining his skat every stage. Half of this race has quit or wants to.

 

[GuntherL1]

half the peloton? no..29 riders I believe as of yesterday...riders that gave up, unlike Remco, who is still battling through heat exhaustion. He hasn't given up as of yet anyway.

152 started, 87 still in the race. 43%. Give it another day.

 

[yaco]

Remco has encountered one stage with multiple 30+ minute climbs and he struggled - Let's see what happens today ? Then I'd like him to repeat the same in another stage race - Then I can make a more definitive claim as to his ability to complete longer climbs.

 

[Velolover2]

Remco's ideal climb is 2 km of 8-9%.

I still don't get why people except him to be among the best at Ventoux or Angliru.

That's the same as expecting 2011-Gilbert to compete with Cadel Evans for GC stages.

 

[Red Rick]

The TT should be a barometer for how bad his form is right now.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

So the CN forum experts concluded it was heat exhaustion, right? It seems a logical explanation. No need to worry then - despite this setback he still had almost the same time as King Küng yesterday.

 

[houtdffan]

Remco's ideal climb is 2 km of 8-9%.

I still don't get why people except him to be among the best at Ventoux or Angliru.

That's the same as expecting 2011-Gilbert to compete with Cadel Evans for GC stages.

He got dropped on that Thursday. Did better on the diesel climb Friday

 

[Red Rick]

He got dropped on that Thursday. Did better on the diesel climb Friday

You take this as evidence he's as good in the big mountains as on the short hills?

They raced a lot harder on Thursday, I think if you're ill or suffering from the heat, it's the intensity that's gonna mess you up more than specific race characteristics.