Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[AmRacer]

Remco's riding diaries, 'My life as a fatco'

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Talked with him on Discord. First thing he said after Wednesday was that apparently still no one sees that he's overweight for climbing long or hard climbs. He specifically said:

Remco with Logic as his coach would be unbeatable but Luck Merchant strikes again!

 

[Gratemans]

To bad there's no Logic anymore. He would give us exciting updates about Remco's weight during this time.

Yeah, whats up with that, he had his account deleted or something?

 

[Berniece]

Yeah, whats up with that, he had his account deleted or something?

Tired of the forum. I get it, have thought about it too. If it's not fun anymore, why bother.

 

[Berniece]

damn hed have won by one and a half minute if only the fat bastard could skip a meal ( more than two minutes faster than pogis fastest time on that climb ever )

So you don't think weight has any influence on how fast you can go on a climb? Interesting take

 

[AmRacer]

So you don't think weight has any influence on how fast you can go on a climb? Interesting take

There's only one rider who is struggling with weight

 

[Netserk]

So you don't think weight has any influence on how fast you can go on a climb? Interesting take

can you read

 

[Salvarani]

Isnt just clear, as I think the team and even Lefevere said years ago, that Remco needs specific preparation to be at a good climbing level.

They always said and Remco himself, I believe, that preparation needs to be "perfect".

Likely meaning altitude + losing a couple of kgs, which probably requires great dedication and some sacrifices to get to that level.

He may be able to do that for a short amount of time and a pin-point effort, but he has a hard time staying there. For whatever reason.

It also has to be looked into regarding things like his recovery as well. Too many collapses and big drops at this point.

Great one-day racer and time trialist. Stage-racing, he struggles now and then for different reasons.

Some been saying this for a long time and we keep ending up here.

With that said, Remco has showed that he can deliver... when preparation has been perfect. It just seems hard to get right. Or did he just get "lucky" and had the perfect race a couple of times in the GTs? Maybe it is just hard to produce such outcomes often, as we have seen it often ending up in collapses or DNFs in other instances. Anyway... the team and mostly Remco himself has to take some accountability in that or admit it is a flaw, which I very much understand why he wouldnt do.

Still believe he can podium the Tour, if everything goes right for him, and scenarios where he could still even win it.

 

[Ilmaestro99]

The hard thing with the weight issue in the modern era is how much carbs are needed for fuel.

15 years ago everyone starved themselves to prep a GT. So if you needed to drop kilos to be competitive, you weren't preparing worse than your competitors if you starved yourself to lose weight.

Now on training camps and at races, you need to stuff your face and be able to digest high amounts of carbs. If someone like Remco naturally holds a higher weight, losing weight to be competitive on climbs, without underfueling/underrecovering relative to his competitors, is gonna be really really hard.

 

[AmRacer]

Isnt just clear, as I think the team and even Lefevere said years ago, that Remco needs specific preparation to be at a good climbing level.

They always said and Remco himself, I believe, that preparation needs to be "perfect".

Likely meaning altitude + losing a couple of kgs.

He may be able to do that for a short amount of time and a pin-point effort, but he has a hard time staying there. For whatever reason.

It also has to be looked into regarding things like his recovery as well. Too many collapses and big drops at this point.

Great one-day racer and time trialist. Stage-racing, he struggles now and then for different reasons.

Some been saying this for a long time and we keep ending up here.

With that said, Remco has showed that he can deliver... when preparation has been perfect. It just seems hard to get right. Or did he just get "lucky" and had the perfect race a couple of times in the GTs? Maybe it is just hard to produce such outcomes often, as we have seen with it often ending up in collapses or DNFs in other instances. Anyway... the team and mostly Remco himself has to take some accountability in that or admit it is a flaw, which I very much understand why he wouldnt do.

Still believe he can podium the Tour, if everything goes right for him, and scenarios where he could still even win it.

Maybe that weight level is unhealthy for him and then he gets sick.

 

[chickenlips]

It's like he's a prop forward trying to play the scrum half position. Ain't gonna work, unless he plays against teams 2 divisions down.

 

[Berniece]

can you read

Yes, you are diminishing the impact of his weight on his performance.

 

[Divergence]

I wouldn't say they mean nothing. You just don't go very hard all the time in training. They need Z4 and Z5 sessions (for peak aerobic performance as well as maximizing lactate steady-state level) but they need a lot of volume in lower zones as well (so called base, majority of training time). Even 1500-meter runners do 10-15 km runs regularly (base). Both types of training are needed to gradually improve sporting level.

Of course there is a difference between going hard and going easier. What I am saying is that even if you do not have any knowledge about zones and such, you would sometimes go hard and sometimes not so hard. The important thing is to train and to train a lot.

 

[James M]

Whats up with this weight thing still? People do understand its just cope at this point right?

If not then Remco would have to be the most unprofessional rider in the peloton. (which he isnt) Maybe expecting him to change his innate character is the real stretch by now. Thoughts?

 

[Berniece]

Whats up with this weight thing still? People do understand its just cope at this point right?

If not then Remco would have to be the most unprofessional rider in the peloton. (which he isnt) Maybe expecting him to change his inner character is the real stretch by now. Thoughts?

It doesn't have to do with being unprofessional, it has to do with putting the wrong emphasis on his weaknesses/strengths. He stated himself that during spring classics he weighs more than during GT's. Like easily 3kg difference, because they work more on intervals and he builds up more muscle.

This isn't Ullrich that had 10kg of fat after winter season. This is specifically training differently to work on other strengths. Rolling terrain, short fast climbs, dropping everyone in Valencia, compared to weighing less and working on long climbs. You don't see a difference in his physique between his GT and spring form?

And there's the rule of thumb, but I don't know where people got this from, that for each kg you lose 30s on a 10km climb (30min effort).

 

[Divergence]

It doesn't have to do with being unprofessional, it has to do with putting the wrong emphasis on his weaknesses/strengths. He stated himself that during spring classics he weighs more than during GT's. Like easily 3kg difference, because they work more on intervals and he builds up more muscle.

This isn't Ullrich that had 10kg of fat after winter season. This is specifically training differently to work on other strengths. Rolling terrain, short fast climbs, dropping everyone in Valencia, compared to weighing less and working on long climbs. You don't see a difference in his physique between his GT and spring form?

And there's the rule of thumb, but I don't know where people got this from, that for each kg you lose 30s on a 10km climb (30min effort).

Do you really think that if you work on 1-2 min hills you will gain 3 kg of muscle compared to working on 30min sustained efforts?

 

[Salvarani]

Maybe easy to say in hindsight, but this start of doing: Mallorca, Valenciana and then UAE Tour made little sense imo for him. I dont know what the purpose was other than getting some feel good vibes and easy wins, but it failing in the end.

 

[Berflamand]

I'm disappointed.

I don't know what went wrong but way more worrying is that the team (and Remco) themselves don't seem to know what went wrong.

It's clear that they didn't expect these results at all.

For all his early season wins, I feel like the only really 'impressive' moment (according to his standards) was when he rode away from Tiberi/Almeida/McNulty on the Cumbre del Sol in Valenciana.

Apparently he had specifically trained those efforts during the winter but it looks like his overall level didn't improve at all.

I mean even in 2020 he would have solo'ed those races in Mallorca and in TT's he's been elite for years now. Actually I already had a little bit of doubt (easy to say in hindsight ofcourse) when he had trouble getting rid of Rondel in Mallorca or when he didn't really extend his gap in Valenciana after his attack and he looked quite labored.

All this talk about him not being (and never becoming) an elite climber may hold some truth but that cannot be the (only) reason for this lacklustre UAE performance imo. In 2023 only Yates was better uphill while last week he was getting dropped by Byron Munton and Svestad-Bårdseng among others.

I hope they can get their acts together and he can at least fight for the podium at Catalunya, even if he gets dropped by Vingegaard on every mountain.

 

[Berniece]

Do you really think that if you work on 1-2 min hills you will gain 3 kg of muscle compared to working on 30min sustained efforts?

Evenepoel naturally has a stockier, more muscular build compared to the typical skinny climber, and he puts on muscle quite easily. His training for the Spring Classics, which involves a lot of interval work to build explosiveness for rolling terrain and short, punchy climbs, only increases this muscle mass. Conversely, when he shifts his training focus to long mountain climbs, he naturally drops weight and loses some of that muscle.

The Red Bull team is well aware of this dynamic. While they don't plan to alter his physique this season, Dan Lorang has stated that if Evenepoel's performance doesn't hit the required marks, they may intentionally reduce his muscle mass in the future to make him a lighter rider.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

At least there's no more Fatco but Muscleco now.

 

[James M]

It doesn't have to do with being unprofessional, it has to do with putting the wrong emphasis on his weaknesses/strengths. He stated himself that during spring classics he weighs more than during GT's. Like easily 3kg difference, because they work more on intervals and he builds up more muscle.

This isn't Ullrich that had 10kg of fat after winter season. This is specifically training differently to work on other strengths. Rolling terrain, short fast climbs, dropping everyone in Valencia, compared to weighing less and working on long climbs. You don't see a difference in his physique between his GT and spring form?

And there's the rule of thumb, but I don't know where people got this from, that for each kg you lose 30s on a 10km climb (30min effort).

I do but its not easy for him hence changing his innate character is the real stretch imo that should be obvious by now.

You guys present this as this is news every year and not common knowledge, like the teams and he arent aware of this himself and just a matter of doing it..its wishful thinking to a new lvl at this point.

 

[Divergence]

Evenepoel naturally has a stockier, more muscular build compared to the typical skinny climber, and he puts on muscle quite easily. His training for the Spring Classics, which involves a lot of interval work to build explosiveness for rolling terrain and short, punchy climbs, only increases this muscle mass. Conversely, when he shifts his training focus to long mountain climbs, he naturally drops weight and loses some of that muscle.

The Red Bull team is well aware of this dynamic. While they don't plan to alter his physique this season, Dan Lorang has stated that if Evenepoel's performance doesn't hit the required marks, they may intentionally reduce his muscle mass in the future to make him a lighter rider.

So he gains biceps, triceps and gets a double chin when he rides the muur de huy?

 

[Berniece]

I do but its not easy for him hence changing his innate character is the real stretch imo that should be obvious by now.

You guys present this as this is news every year and not common knowledge, like the teams and he arent aware of this himself and just a matter of doing it..its wishful thinking to a new lvl at this point.

Maybe they feel it's too difficult for him to stay at such a weight all season long. That it's not healthy, and will drain him throughout the season. Which is fine, but then don't show up at UAE Tour. Go ride Algarve or Ruta Del Sol if it suits you more. Doesn't mean he doesn't need to go for that weight and goal during TDF though.

 

[Berniece]

So he gains biceps, triceps and gets a double chin when he rides the muur de huy?

Not sure what you want me to say. There are pictures of him without a shirt in spring classics, there's no fat, he's lean and muscular. You don't see a difference compared to what he looked like at TDF 2024?

 

[James M]

Maybe they feel it's too difficult for him to stay at such a weight all season long. That it's not healthy, and will drain him throughout the season. Which is fine, but then don't show up at UAE Tour. Go ride Algarve or Ruta Del Sol if it suits you more. Doesn't mean he doesn't need to go for that weight and goal during TDF though.

He might have won Algarve, and if he wanted a mental boost he would have gone there but that aint helping.

The reality is that if he wants to contend for the Tour, being just good isnt enough either. He needs to improve right, and for that something has to give.