Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Divergence]

They allow for more aggressive racing so fans IMHO shouldn't complain. As for Remco and what he said or didn't say. He was punished enough by that fall so it's all good.

Yes, they do allow for divebombing and maybe a slightly faster descends. Both are not what road cycling is about imho and they just make road cycling more dangerous.

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Or simply it was a freak accident, which can happens to anyone. He may have had his head down, looked up, didn't realize the round about was so near, braked suddenly, perhaps hitting a small bump in the tarmac and did a summersault.🤷

This is definitely the most likely answer. He panic grabbed the brake for some reason and took himself out. Most likely reason is he was in his head thinking about how to approach the finale or was annoyed by Vingegaard and just didn’t see the roundabout at all, looked up, and instinctively grabbed the brake. The wrong brake. Like 40 riders go through right afterwards with no issues. It was not a pothole that did it.

 

[CyclistAbi]

Yes, they do allow for divebombing and maybe a slightly faster descends. Both are not what road cycling is about imho and they just make road cycling more dangerous.

To be honest i am not sure if it's more dangerous because of it, could be the opposite. We would need more data to back either up. All i can say is when going fast and having worse brakes, that doesn't improve safety.

 

[Divergence]

To be honest i am not sure if it's more dangerous because of it, could be the opposite. We would need more data to back either up. All i can say is when going fast and having worse brakes, that doesn't improve safety.

In this context idk if "worse" is the correct characterization of rim brakes. Sure, on a wet descend you can stop quicker with disc brakes, but disk brakes also tend to lock up more readily and this is exactly what happens when you panic brake. And, I believe, Remco panic braked and he crashed. So if he had rim brakes I do not believe he would have crashed.

 

[CyclistAbi]

@Divergence

But then again there are panic brake usages that do resolve the situation, due to disc brakes being vastly superior in the act of braking. As Remco has demonstrated.

Anyway, yesterday's news.

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

Zero holes, zero touches, this is a rider who clearly got surprised by the roundabout and braked too much and too fast. But he clearly lives in an alternative world, he imagines things that don't happen. What hole did he see?

Assuming is not imagining

 

[Low is rhe new high]

He obviously wanted to brake check Jonas because of all the wheel sucking, unfortunately Remco is not so good with left and right yet so he pulled the wrong brake.

 

[peterfin]

It's easy to say his crash was because of technical inabilities just because it's him. He was racing his heart out to stay ahead of the peleton while it happened. A hole, blurred vision, slower reaction time, not thinking sharp ... whatever happened it's not because he can't pass a roundabout that he crashed.

 

[Extinction]

I can't say you're wrong, something has to explain it. Braking alone is hard for me to grok.

But at the same time we also gotta say that the number of crashes is just...a lot. IMO he's truly a crap bike handler.

Nah, he just got third in the Ronde and descended very well in Catalunya. It's not bike handling skills now, I don't think, but just being unusually prone to being the victim of stupid sh!t happening. In this he's not very different to Roglic.

 

[red_flanders]

Nah, he just got third in the Ronde and descended very well in Catalunya. It's not bike handling skills now, I don't think, but just being unusually prone to being the victim of stupid sh!t happening. In this he's not very different to Roglic.

Both riders have had bad luck, yet at some point the bad luck mounts because...they're just not good bike handlers. Being "unusually prone" generally has a root cause.

He certainly rode well in the Ronde, great to see. But to my view that he's improved doesn't mean at the core he's just not natural on the bike.

 

[Extinction]

Both riders have had bad luck, yet at some point the bad luck mounts because...they're just not good bike handlers. Being "unusually prone" generally has a root cause.

He certainly rode well in the Ronde, great to see. But to my view that he's improved doesn't mean at the core he's just not natural on the bike.

But I don't consider what happened to him in Catalunya to be about poor bike handling skills, rather a lack of attention in a critical moment that led to a freak accident. Now, you could say that he zones out at the wrong moments too often or makes poor choices at times, and I would say that's more the issue than poor bike handling skills.

 

[AmRacer]

But I don't consider what happened to him in Catalunya to be about poor bike handling skills, rather a lack of attention in a critical moment that led to a freak accident. Now, you could say that he zones out at the wrong moments too often or makes poor choices at times, and I would say that's more the issue than poor bike handling skills.

What's included in 'bike handling skill' is debatable.

 

[red_flanders]

But I don't consider what happened to him in Catalunya to be about poor bike handling skills, rather a lack of attention in a critical moment that led to a freak accident. Now, you could say that he zones out at the wrong moments too often or makes poor choices at times, and I would say that's more the issue than poor bike handling skills.

Ok. I think of that, as well as potentially having massively overcorrected as being under the umbrella of bike handling skills. To me situational awareness is part of that skillset, but I can appreciate the distinction you’re making.

 

[Extinction]

What's included in 'bike handling skill' is debatable.

And it's a fine line between errors of judgement and actual poor bike handling skills.

 

[Divergence]

@Divergence

But then again there are panic brake usages that do resolve the situation, due to disc brakes being vastly superior in the act of braking. As Remco has demonstrated.

Anyway, yesterday's news.

Yes, this is true. But knowing you have rim brakes makes you ride in a way that panic braking with rim brakes can resolve (i.e. a bit more cautious). On the other hand not having the possibility of locking up out of nowhere is what makes rim brakes safer.

 

[Berniece]

These guys are on the bike every single day, for hours. The notion of being technically inept is ridiculous

 

[Extinction]

These guys are on the bike every single day, for hours. The notion of being technically inept is ridiculous

Well, to a degree. For me Remco's biggest problem early in his career was that he came late to cycling and then went pro right out of the juniors. As a junior he basically rode away from everyone going solo and never really raced in the mountains. He thus did not have the time or the situational environments to develop a solid craft. His near fatal accident in Lombardia I believe was owing to this, as was his poor descending and difficulty on unpaved or cobbled roads. Clearly he has overcome much of these deficits, however, he'll always lack the crucial development years of under-23 cycling that likely would have prepared himself much better for the pros in this sense. At the same time, it's not to be excluded that he's just a bit of a bonehead in getting distracted or making poor decisions riding sometimes. The recent Catalunya incident seems to apply to the former, whereas getting doored by the postman because riding too close to parked cars to the latter.

 

[veganrob]

These guys are on the bike every single day, for hours. The notion of being technically inept is ridiculous

In the same way some riders are simply faster than others, Another group are simple better bike handlers and aware of their surroundings.

 

[Berniece]

Well, to a degree. For me Remco's biggest problem early in his career was that he came late to cycling and then went pro right out of the juniors. As a junior he basically rode away from everyone going solo and never really raced in the mountains. He thus did not have the time or the situational environments to develop a solid craft. His near fatal accident in Lombardia I believe was owing to this, as was his poor descending and difficulty on unpaved or cobbled roads. Clearly he has overcome much of these deficits, however, he'll always lack the crucial development years of under-23 cycling that likely would have prepared himself much better for the pros in this sense. At the same time, it's not to be excluded that he's just a bit of a bonehead in getting distracted or making poor decisions riding sometimes. The recent Catalunya incident seems to apply to the former, whereas getting doored by the postman because riding too close to parked cars to the latter.

Yes, but he’s now doing his 8th season

 

[jotafap]

Yes, but he’s now doing his 8th season

Even though I also think Remco nowadays has very decent skills on the bike, being in his 8th season doesn’t tell us much, does it? Look at Mas, he’s still a horrible descender after what, a decade as a pro cyclist? 😂

 

[jmdirt]

These guys are on the bike every single day, for hours. The notion of being technically inept is ridiculous

Not true.

 

[jmdirt]

What's included in 'bike handling skill' is debatable.

Staying upright when exhausted isn't debatable.

 

[elguapo]

Would the UCI return the U23 Category to hone the skills of the young recruits in bike handling and riding in a tightly packed peloton before moving in to WT? Most of the younger generation of cyclists like those who followed Remco's trajectory in WT by not spending some years in U23, are the most prone to crashes and DNFs. They are strong and agressive, but when it comes to positioning and shoving, they are always at the receiving end. Again, Ayuso just left the Tour of Basque Country due to a crash.

 

[Extinction]

Yes, but he’s now doing his 8th season

Right and he's clearly gotten much better, but he still, I think, is subject to errors those missed formative years as an amateur could have corrected.

 

[BubbaChuck]

how is remco struggling being from belgium,those roads are tricky.no.