The revenge of Rasmussen ...

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Oct 16, 2010
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pmcg76 said:
Can you point to anyone on any of Floyds or Tyler's teams(not Postal) who were sanctioned beacuse of their confessions. How about team-mates of Manzano or Simeoni perhaps?? Maybe buddies of Kohl or Jaksche?? How many people were sanctioned because of Sella's confessions? Only 2-3 people cos that's how many people were doping at his team!!!

Saying as I like to grind on Kimmage, he has former team-mates who are still running Pro-Teams today. Has he ever outed them? Nah, must be ometra mate.

What about Basson's? Did Mr Clean give up any names or throw anybody under the bus?

Fact of the matter is this, in most walks of life normal people take responsibility for their own personal actions and behaviour and don't willingly throw other people to the wolves, even if those peoples actions might have impacted on them and especially not when they were doing the same things themselves. That is not ometra, that is human nature.

How many people here would report a friend or colleague to the police for driving under the influence?

What if you yourself had done it, would this may you even less likely to report someone?

How many people would admit to seeing a friend or colleague driving under the influence if called to testify or give evidence in court?

Everyone can rant on about ometra and try and take the moral highground but you can be guranteed 99% of people would act in the exact same manner.
fair points to some extent.
But you cannot compare the cases of guys like Floyd, Jaksche and Rasmussen with the case of Boogerd or JV.
Floyd, Jaksche, Rasmussen got their friggin carreer taken away from them and imo had all the right to feel great injustice was being done. They had a reasonable trigger (from a psychological pov) to snitch on others.
This all was not the case for Boogerd or a guy like JV, both of whom had already stopped cycling when they got outed and were already planning their return as DS/manager.
 
Mar 12, 2014
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Jagartrott said:
Dutch cycling union using the same tired old "the past is behind us, we should look forward" routine. I f**ing hate it.

With such an attitude, I'm afraid the sport still has a long way to go.
If I read the dutch news correctly today, they even went as far as to say that "Boogerd has already been punished enough." Can anyone explain how he has actually been punished? If he has, I seem to have missed it.
 
HSNHSN said:
If I read the dutch news correctly today, they even went as far as to say that "Boogerd has already been punished enough." Can anyone explain how he has actually been punished? If he has, I seem to have missed it.
That's the point!

Keeping the doping controversy down to a quiet whisper.;)
 
Jul 11, 2013
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Maybe Vino didn't volunteer for the "thruth" comisssion...
Same as Riis...
Meanwhile Ulissi and Impey get's a free pass...
Hmm....
 
I was thinking about this in relation to my job (I'm a scientist).
It would be like a person who made up data to get papers published in big journals, then they're on the verge of promoting him to professorship (so he can guide PhD students in how science should be done...), someone says "hey, but this guy cheated!" and the uni goes "ah, that's all in the past - let's look forward".

It's such utter bull****e, this kind of reasoning.
 
theyoungest said:
Where does he position himself as the victim? He's spent 18 months telling everyone who wanted to hear that it was his own choice to dope, and his own fault. You even say it yourself, but you call it omerta.

I don't like Boogerd, nor do I consider it a great idea for him to run a team, but more because he's just a dumbas.s.
Did you hear the interview he gave on te radio? Because he made it quite clear that he thought it was wholly unjustified that they would come after him now after more than 18 months had past since his (forced) confession. Also he slammed the Dutch journalist who had set the ball rolling again by asking the Belgian ADA what the lowdown was on Boogerd becoming a DS given his self-confessed hand unpunished PED-abuse. That combined with his self-confessed lack of action and the use of the word "traitor" and "snitch", makes it quite clear where he stand on tho and that is to the side of transparency.
 
Apr 20, 2012
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GJB123 said:
Did you hear the interview he gave on te radio? Because he made it quite clear that he thought it was wholly unjustified that they would come after him now after more than 18 months had past since his (forced) confession. Also he slammed the Dutch journalist who had set the ball rolling again by asking the Belgian ADA what the lowdown was on Boogerd becoming a DS given his self-confessed hand unpunished PED-abuse. That combined with his self-confessed lack of action and the use of the word "traitor" and "snitch", makes it quite clear where he stand on tho and that is to the side of transparency.
At least Boogerd confessed, how about all those others from his Rabo team who were pretty succesfull at that same team and have a nice job in cycling nowadays?

What purpose does this 'investigation' have? Let the Belges do some research in their teams, or even better: their doctors. Why havent we heard anything about Geertje Leinders? Why is Yvan Vanmol still in cycling? How come Ibarguren Taus is still welcome?

This is the reverse omerta working at best: when you confess you will be blacklisted.
 
Jan 11, 2010
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Fearless Greg Lemond said:
At least Boogerd confessed, how about all those others from his Rabo team who were pretty succesfull at that same team and have a nice job in cycling nowadays?
From the Austrian connection, I think only Thomas Dekker still rides, Leinders has disappeared, and Theo de Rooij has been pretty much sidelined. So who do you mean?
 
Apr 20, 2012
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theyoungest said:
From the Austrian connection, I think only Thomas Dekker still rides, Leinders has disappeared, and Theo de Rooij has been pretty much sidelined. So who do you mean?
Do you think the number 2 of the Barcelona Olympics was cleans? Good thing the our anti-doping agency is looking at him...
 
Jan 11, 2010
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Fearless Greg Lemond said:
Do you think the number 2 of the Barcelona Olympics was cleans? Good thing the our anti-doping agency is looking at him...
Yeah, I already guessed you meant Erik Dekker, because somehow most Dutchies want him to hang (ever hear anyone about Karsten Kroon, for instance?) But I don't think the ADA has anything to go on, other than circiumstantial evidence of the "he rode like crap, and suddenly he won three stages in the Tour!" kind.

And of course the infamous armband.
 
May 12, 2010
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theyoungest said:
Yeah, I already guessed you meant Erik Dekker, because somehow most Dutchies want him to hang (ever hear anyone about Karsten Kroon, for instance?) But I don't think the ADA has anything to go on, other than circiumstantial evidence of the "he rode like crap, and suddenly he won three stages in the Tour!" kind.

And of course the infamous armband.
That's hardly something to brush aside though...probably enough to result in a biopassport ban these days. But it's true there is probably little they have to hang Dekker on, then again, that guy might as well be invisible these days, can't remember the last time I saw an interview with him.

Anyway, concerning Boogerd, although he hasn't been officially punished, he got a mountain of s**t on his head after his confession, that was somewhat out of free will, the Belgians had had a lot of time to proscecute him. If you haven't done anything after 18 months, I think it's fair to let it go, they had enough time to do something if they wanted.
 
May 19, 2010
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Lanark said:
That's hardly something to brush aside though...probably enough to result in a biopassport ban these days. But it's true there is probably little they have to hang Dekker on, then again, that guy might as well be invisible these days, can't remember the last time I saw an interview with him.

Anyway, concerning Boogerd, although he hasn't been officially punished, he got a mountain of s**t on his head after his confession, that was somewhat out of free will, the Belgians had had a lot of time to proscecute him. If you haven't done anything after 18 months, I think it's fair to let it go, they had enough time to do something if they wanted.
The SOL is 8 years, not 18 months.

And "somewhat out of free will"...! :rolleyes:
 
May 12, 2010
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neineinei said:
The SOL is 8 years, not 18 months.

And "somewhat out of free will"...! :rolleyes:
Statute of limitations concerns the time since the offense, not the time since the relevant facts are known. I think even those evil dopers have a right to a trial at a reasonable time after their offense is known, 18 months after a television confession clearly is not. If they wanted to ban him, they had all the time in the world.
 
Apparently, they were trying to assess under whose jurisdictian Boogerd could be prosecuted - that's why it took so long (still not very efficient, but that seems to be normal - see other doping cases).
But I don't care, I'd like all people that knowingly and willingly doped to not be involved in guiding cyclists. It just is not right.
 
Jagartrott said:
Apparently, they were trying to assess under who's jurisdictian Boogerd could be prosecuted - that's why it took so long.
But I don't care, I'd like all people that knowingly and willingly doped to not be involved in guiding cyclists. It just is not right.
Yes but as with suspended riders who are allowed to come back they can't or won't ban the same riders from holding team management positions when they retire which has always been farcical.
 
Mar 12, 2014
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theyoungest said:
Yeah, I already guessed you meant Erik Dekker, because somehow most Dutchies want him to hang (ever hear anyone about Karsten Kroon, for instance?) But I don't think the ADA has anything to go on, other than circiumstantial evidence of the "he rode like crap, and suddenly he won three stages in the Tour!" kind.

And of course the infamous armband.
Quite often, actually. Usually he's mentioned in one sentence with Erik Dekker, though. And usually in the context of probable, but unproven past drugs usage.

Are there any others who were active back then in Rabobank, who actually fulfill some role in cycling these days? (If possible, who are seen somewhat more than Erik Dekker; it must've been ages, indeed, since I last saw him.)
 
May 19, 2010
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Boogerd could face a life suspension from the sport if found guilty, but remains defiant and says that he will not discuss others to get a shorter ban. ““The Belgian federation had the same proposal as the Dutch Doping Authority had. I will be suspended for a long period, or I will have to talk about other people. I refuse to do that. I rather be suspended for life,” he told the newspaper .
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/news-shorts-yates-and-julich-to-join-tinkoff-saxo

First, a lifetime ban seems highly unlikely. It will be max two years, or maybe four (2015 Code).

But refusing to talk about others and making it sound like he is a martyr, well done.

Rasmussen relies on Christina Wathches. It is impossible to see him get a DS job anywhere else. Boogerd on the other hand has no problem getting a good job. They both doped as much as they could muster. Telling it as it is doesn't pay in cycling.
 
May 19, 2010
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A. MICHAEL RASMUSSEN

28 Michael Rasmussen provided sworn testimony on behalf of USADA pursuant to a corperation agreement he entered into on January 25, 2013. In that agreement, Mr. Rasmussen admitted to using banned performance enhancing substances and methods, including EPO, testosterone, blood transfusion and cortisone from 1998 to the date og the agreement.
http://www.usada.org/wp-content/uploads/AAA_decision_Leinders_December_2014.pdf (page 8)

According to his testimony to USADA Rasmussen doped up to the confession, in January 2013. At the press meeting 31 January 2013 Claus Hembo (owner Christina Watches) said Rasmussen had been doping from 1998 to the spring of 2010, and in Anti doping Danmark press release from 31 January 2013 it also says:
According to Michael Rasmussen, his use of doping has taken place continuously from 1998 to 2010.
http://www.antidoping.dk/om-add/aktuelt/2013/01/michael_rasmussen_uk

??
 

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