The Tour Wild Cards

[Libertine Seguros]

No, Big George and Ballan aren't nothing. But both have said they're not that bothered about riding the Tour.

The Classics snub is more about the UCI than the ASO. It's more about the 'preferred status' meaning that Acqua e Sapone and Androni Giocattoli get to ride Roubaix at the expense of the Belgian ProConti teams who live for those races. As compensation of sorts the ASO gave them the Ardennes invites, and Skil and Vacansoleil were the ones that had to make way. At least in the Classics, I can see why BMC have more to offer.

And sure, Cuddles has been 2nd twice, but the rosters of the '07 and '08 Tours were not as strong as the one we're projecting for the 2010 one.

 

[Mellow Velo]

Big George and Allesandro Ballan are nothing?

In terms of the TDF, they are.
Big George said he wasn't riding another Tour and Ballan will be spent, having to ride the classics and Giro. He won't be there.
Hincapie's Tour appeal, outside the US, is that of a top domestique, nothing more.

 

[hfer07]

all 18 "UCI pro teams" will be in-that's a fact, unless someone pops positive in a damaging way. no matter how bad Katusha performs-the team along with Sky with the biggest budget won't be out-I don't know where that came from...
ASO will go with 22 teams, Including Cervelo,BBT,Codofis,& BMC. why? is already on "paper"

don't say I didn't tell you.......

 

[maikel]

In purely sporting terms you are right, the decision was cuddles vs vacansoliel.

As for Evans, right now he's the 4th ranked rider in the world, finished last year 5th wearing the rainbow jersey, has twice finished 2nd, along with having a palmares noone at vacansoliel can match. He's hungry to win and proved last year he'll try suicidal breaks to win. tough to leave out no?

Vacansoliel have no GC chance, no sprinter of TDF standard, but more than a couple of stage hunters, two guys who could try for the KOM and are one of the most aggressive teams in the peloton...tough to leave out no?

The most unfair part it would seem would be the classics snubs. i think one or the other would have been more fair to a team without the budget who seems to be trying to do whatever they can and doing a great job.

Carrara is a very decent GC rider, and in Bozic they have someone who is among the sprint elite, last year he won a stage in the vuelta in a very impressing way, beating very strong sprinters. And He finished third in last years Paris-tours. And with Hoogerland they have one of the most entertaining riders, who finished eleventh in the vuelta and fifth in Lambardy. Add to that young talents like Feillu and strong stage hunters like Leukemans, Westra and Romain Feillu and you can say they have a team that brings more excitement and entertainment than BMC, footon or the french teams.

 

[issoisso]

don't say I didn't tell you.......

One thing I've realized about people in this forum is that they love to speculate so much, that if you offer them undeniable proof that what they're speculating about can't happen, they'll quite simply ignore it.

For example: Remember the "Will Cavendish go to Sky?" discussions? No matter how many times people jumped in those discussions to note the fact that Columbia has a unilateral option to extend the contract that they already said they were taking and that Cavendish has already publicly urged them to take the option........the posters involved simply completely ignored every post telling them this.

Because it's fun to speculate and it's annoying to them when that pesky thing called "reality" gets in the way.

Hope I didn't offend anyone. This post is meant in a "isn't it funny how...." way

 

[Boleyn]

Vacansoliel have no GC chance, no sprinter of TDF standard, but more than a couple of stage hunters, two guys who could try for the KOM and are one of the most aggressive teams in the peloton...tough to leave out no?

Especially when you think of a certain team that also has no GC chance, no sprinter, no stage hunters, no guys to try for the KoM, and only show aggression when going through the feed zone before being shelled out the back of the peleton

 

[CastleSprint]

I am very much in agreement with you, sir - thank you for pointing those facts out.

And let me add my own pro-Vac cheer here, while I'm at it - the fact that they have had a strong start to the season. Hoogerland 2nd on the very first race they took part in, Bozic grabbed 2 wins and a 2nd place sprinting at Besseges, 3 races won... and an amazing team to watch in action on the road. Lagutin's attack on the Criterium alone was a joy to see - and the way they always manage to mix it up front, no matter where or what's going on... wow. They were really out there on the Vuelta, too, proving that they have the right stuff when it comes to the grand tours.

Also... not having the Feillu brothers at TDF is just ~wrong~ to the point where I'm slightly concerned about the balance of the universe as a whole. ;P

 

[pmcg76]

Carrara is a very decent GC rider, and in Bozic they have someone who is among the sprint elite, last year he won a stage in the vuelta in a very impressing way, beating very strong sprinters. And He finished third in last years Paris-tours. And with Hoogerland they have one of the most entertaining riders, who finished eleventh in the vuelta and fifth in Lambardy. Add to that young talents like Feillu and strong stage hunters like Leukemans, Westra and Romain Feillu and you can say they have a team that brings more excitement and entertainment than BMC, footon or the french teams.

Why do so many people have it in for the French teams, lets see AG2R held the yellow jersey for how many days last year and Nicolas Roche was a regular animator of stages. Bbox have Fedrigo, Voeckler who are always attacking during the Tour and stage winners, Fedrigo just won Criterium International or is that not as relevant as some race in the desert. Le Mevel finished Top 10 last year and Casar is always up there for Lfdjeux. Cofidis were the poorest team last season but have take 12 victories this season already, i.e, they are perfroming better than Vacansoleil or many other teams for that matter.

Vacansoleil are on the same level as some French teams, they are not better than them. People have listed guys like Carrara, Bozic, Hoogerland but if they were at the Tour, they would be no better than the French. It is the Tour de France so only right there is French teams. Myabe the French teams shouldnt be going to the Giro or Vuelta but they should always be at the Tour.

 

[Avoriaz]

Le Mevel finished Top 10 last year

True enough, but I'll wager if asked to name the Top 10 from last year, his would be one of the names we'd all have forgotten.

 

[TRDean]

True enough, but I'll wager if asked to name the Top 10 from last year, his would be one of the names we'd all have forgotten.

Who cares if you have forgotten...top 10 is top 10...

 

[Clemson Cycling]

pro cycling continues its rapid descent towards rivalling pro-wrestling for commercial greed and corruption.

When (after performing averagely in the few races he bothers to start between commercial actions on the charity circuit) the linebacker stands on the podium in Paris and the dollars are pouring in from across the atlantic I shall know that the shafting of the sport is complete.

Yeah commercial greed and corruption... Oh wait that is every sport in the world. Apparently sponsors pay money for the event to go on. Who knew?

4 American teams in the race. The sport has come a long way on this side of the Atlantic since 1999.

 

[Avoriaz]

Who cares if you have forgotten...top 10 is top 10...

And fair play to him, but if a team of riders who animate the race but fail to make the top ten as opposed to a team of riders who don't animate the race but eke their way into a top ten position, who do you pick?

 

[TRDean]

And fair play to him, but if a team of riders who animate the race but fail to make the top ten as opposed to a team of riders who don't animate the race but eke their way into a top ten position, who do you pick?

I see your point...my choice would be animators...but I do think the French are showing very well.

 

[mr. tibbs]

I am really upset that Vacansoleil didn't make the cut. Really upset.

I can understand how a team like Shack would get an auto-invite (they do have a strong history at the Tour--though there may be a bit too much history for them to still be relevant in the GC) but BMC? After Evans rides the Giro all-out? There is no way he'll be one of the prime animators this year, and I can't see why else they would be invited over a team promising the antics of the Brothers Felliu and riding a wave of impressive (and aggressive!) results.

What am I missing? Educate me!

 

[Mellow Velo]

Latest world rankings:

1 1 CAISSE D'EPARGNE (GCE) ESP 327
2 4 TEAM HTC - COLUMBIA (THR) USA 249
3 6 TEAM KATUSHA (KAT) RUS 247
4 5 LIQUIGAS-DOIMO (LIQ) ITA 210
5 2 ASTANA (AST) KAZ 209
6 3 RABOBANK (RAB) NED 166
7 8 BMC RACING TEAM (BMC) USA 157
8 17 CERVELO TEST TEAM (CTT) SUI 132
9 7 ANDRONI GIOCATTOLI - SERRAMENTI PVC DIQUIGIOVANNI (AND) ITA 118
10 9 ACQUA & SAPONE (ASA) ITA 116
11 18 OMEGA PHARMA-LOTTO (OLO) BEL 115
12 19 COFIDIS, LE CREDIT EN LIGNE (COF) FRA 113
13 10 LAMPRE-FARNESE VINI (LAM) ITA 101
14 11 SKY PROFESSIONAL CYCLING TEAM (SKY) GBR 99
15 12 COLNAGO - CSF INOX (CSF) IRL 93
16 13 QUICK STEP (QST) BEL 92
17 20 GARMIN - SLIPSTREAM (GRM) USA 92
18 14 TEAM MILRAM (MRM) GER 76
19 16 TEAM SAXO BANK (SAX) DEN 76
20 - TOPSPORT VLAANDEREN - MERCATOR (TSV) BEL 60
21 15 EUSKALTEL - EUSKADI (EUS) ESP 56
22 26 AG2R LA MONDIALE (ALM) FRA 55
______________________________________________________________

23 24 TEAMRADIOSHACK (RSH) USA 27
24 23 FRANÇAISE DES JEUX (FDJ) FRA 12
25 21 BBOX BOUYGUES TELECOM (BTL) FRA 11
26 22 FOOTON-SERVETTO (FOT) ESP 7
27 25 SAUR - SOJASUN (SAU) FRA 6

Retirement Shack in a French baguette.
Although, where some of these teams have pick up the points, I know not.

 

[ak-zaaf]

Latest world rankings:
...

Latest CQ rankings:
1. Team HTC - Columbia PRT 2313
2. Liquigas - Doimo PRT 2204
3. Caisse d'Epargne PRT 1998
4. Cofidis, le Credit en Ligne PROF 1705
5. Team Katusha PRT 1640
6. Rabobank PRT 1582
7. Astana PRT 1543
8. Team Saxo Bank PRT 1501
9. Sky Professional Cycling Team PRT 1450
10. Garmin - Transitions PRT 1372
11. Team RadioShack PRT 1282
12. Ag2r - La Mondiale PRT 1270
13. Androni Giocattoli - Serramenti PVC Diquigiovanni PROF 1258
14. Team Milram PRT 1242
15. Bbox - Bouygues Telecom PROF 1185
16. Lampre - Farnese Vini PRT 1152
17. Française des Jeux PRT 1123
18. Vacansoleil Pro Cycling Team PROF 1103
19. OmegaPharma - Lotto PRT 1032
20. Footon - Servetto PRT 992
21. Euskaltel - Euskadi PRT 957
22. Cervélo Test Team PROF 946
23. Quick Step PRT 897
24. BMC Racing Team PROF 889

30. Saur - Sojasun PROF 587

32. Skil - Shimano PROF 436

 

[Escarabajo]

And fair play to him, but if a team of riders who animate the race but fail to make the top ten as opposed to a team of riders who don't animate the race but eke their way into a top ten position, who do you pick?

Top ten.

There is always a possibility of somebody winning on a decent breakaway "A la Pereiro". That gives changes to all potential GC contenders.


My opinion.

 

[theswordsman]

Retirement Shack in a French baguette.
Although, where some of these teams have pick up the points, I know not.

I was going to answer that question here, but it took some work and could be a good future reference, so I started a new thread on UCI points. They add together the UCI points for the top five riders on a team (if that many have points).

 

[theyoungest]

Top ten.

There is always a possibility of somebody winning on a decent breakaway "A la Pereiro". That gives changes to all potential GC contenders.


My opinion.

Yes, Pereiro, the most exciting Tour winner ever

 

[Libertine Seguros]

But it is possible for the race-animating teams to also get top 10s and they get there in a more entertaining fashion. Sandy Casar was 11th in the Tour, and was only kept out of the top 10 by Mikel Astarloza, who himself was a regular race-animator in the second half of the race. Christophe Le Mevel finished 9th, of course. Vacansoleil aren't too bad for that - Johnny Hoogerland finished 12th in La Vuelta last year, and Matteo Carrara has a top 10 at the Dauphiné and top 5s at the Tour de Suisse and the Vuelta al País Vasco.

Who on BMC's team is going to animate the race? So much of it is hinged on one person that it makes them into a complete waste of an invite if Cuddles underperforms like last year (hopefully he won't). But with a parcours not favouring the boredom-inducing "good TT, then suck on wheels" GC contender (thank god), and with a startlist likely to include at least two of Liquigas' four, Contador, Sánchez, Schleck and Schleck, Armstrong, Leipheimer, Klöden, Wiggins, Rodríguez, Vande Velde, Sastre, and then Evans on top of that, there's a chance that, if he's on poor form, he may not even make the top 10 - especially if we get somebody getting up to the lower reaches of the top 10 thanks to a break à la Le Mevel. And there's always at least one surprise package gutsing it out at the business end - Wiggins last year, Vande Velde and Kohl in 2008, and so on - which I haven't factored in.

That's why I'd go for Vacansoleil. If I had a weaker GC field, then I'd probably go for BMC. And I do admit it will be nice to see the rainbow stripes going for the yellow jersey for the first time in a while, even if I don't much care for the guy wearing them. But I just feel like he's adding to a congested GC field, and the team don't really offer anything outside of him.

 

[jaylew]

4 American teams in the race. The sport has come a long way on this side of the Atlantic since 1999.

I always find it hard to consider Columbia an "American" team with only two American members, neither of them being one of the stronger riders(for now anyway - Tejay certainly has potential). Really they're one of the very few truly international teams in the peloton with 15 nationalities represented. Cervelo would fit the bill as well with 15 nationalities and only one of them being Swiss.

 

[Escarabajo]

...

4 American teams in the race. The sport has come a long way on this side of the Atlantic since 1999.

Did the Americans started to race in the Tour de France since 1999?

What happened in 1999? I thought 7-Eleven raced in Europe in the 80's.

 

[Escarabajo]

But it is possible for the race-animating teams to also get top 10s and they get there in a more entertaining fashion. Sandy Casar was 11th in the Tour, and was only kept out of the top 10 by Mikel Astarloza, who himself was a regular race-animator in the second half of the race. Christophe Le Mevel finished 9th, of course. Vacansoleil aren't too bad for that - Johnny Hoogerland finished 12th in La Vuelta last year, and Matteo Carrara has a top 10 at the Dauphiné and top 5s at the Tour de Suisse and the Vuelta al País Vasco.

...

I meant a potential top ten to win the race, not a potential animator to make the top ten. There is a difference.

 

[theswordsman]

Here's a fun fact announced by the ASO today that might have gotten lost in the 22 team story (I hope it wasn't mentioned here already):

From 2011 on, in compliance with the agreement passed between the organisers of the main Tours and the International Cycling Union (UCI), the first 17 teams of the world ranking established at the end of 2010, according to the sporting results of the teams, will be automatically selected.

I posted the UCI points for various races in a fresh thread. The team standings combine the individual points earned by the top five riders on a team. Tirreno-Adriatico had UCI points. Radio Shack wasn't invited. The Giro d'Italia gives points for the top twenty riders in the final classification, plus the top five riders in each of the 21 stages earn points. Unless something changed this year that I haven't seen, the Tour of California does not offer UCI points. If Radio Shack continues on their current path, and Armstrong and Bruyneel walk hand in hand into the sunset after July, RS might not even be in the Tour in 2011. There's certainly no incentive for RCS to invite them to their races.

 

[Mambo95]

The reason BMC got invited is because the ASO want the best riders at the Tour de France. And Cadel Evans is one of the best GC riders around. He's come second twice and he's been in the top 4 in five of his last six GTs. He's also World Champion. The combined career palmares of the Vacansoleil team is frankly less impressive than Evans's average season.

You can say that if he's off form he may not make to top ten. This is true. But equally, if Contador's off form he might win it.

And there's not just Evans. There's the previous World Champion and three more Tour stage winners (including a man who will be doing his 15th Tour - only Zoetemelk has done more - and is one of the most successful domestiques in Tour history).

As for Vacansoleil 'animating' the race, I assume this means getting in breaks. Well there will be a breakaway every stage without them - there always is. And usually with better riders than Vacansoleil have.

They try hard and make themselves visible, usually without boneheaded attacks, but ultimately there's little in the way of end product (especially in bigger races). Essentially, they're a poor man's Bouygues Telecom.