These Amstels are making me thirsty! 2024 Women's Amstel Gold Race, April 14

[theyoungest]

I‘m just saying, doing something good doesn’t mean you‘re immune to detractors and doing wrong.

No, but this kind of character assassination is uncalled-for. Anytime Wiebes appears in a race it's how about she's the devil incarnate for breaking a contract at some point. I mean, I'm not necessarily a fan of Wiebes, although I do like her transformation to almost more of a puncheur, but this is just malicious.

And the comparison to Lance and OJ kind of proves my point...

 

[fbjim]

Most teams give riders no loyalty and are happy to dump them at any loss of form. And this isn't even something like football where you can point to some romantic club ideal, cycling teams are basically just temporary business arrangements. They give no loyalty and are owed none.

 

[Rackham]

It's the arrogance of celebrating early which never fails to entertain. Every single time. This one was particularly 'out there' in terms of suspension of disbelief because she had no reason to ever assume she was safe. Vos was right there.

And then the tears afterwards... *chef's kiss*

I only half jest as well because there's only one way such a huge mistake can be fixed & that's owning it. All Wiebes had to do was ride up to Vos, congratulate her & then apologise to her own team... & joke about it for good measure because it's only sport.

 

[jmdirt]

The only bad thing about this finish is that with Vos winning, they might not change the course.

Oh, and skinsuits. All skinsuits in road races should be banned because dignity is more important than aerodynamics.

Men's Specialized/Fjällräven Field Suit

Versatile one-piece garment combining performance and comfort on and off bike. Torso in G-1000 Lite fabric that can be waxed for enhanced wind- and wate...

www.specialized.com

 

[Libertine Seguros]

No, but this kind of character assassination is uncalled-for. Anytime Wiebes appears in a race it's how about she's the devil incarnate for breaking a contract at some point. I mean, I'm not necessarily a fan of Wiebes, although I do like her transformation to almost more of a puncheur, but this is just malicious.

And the comparison to Lance and OJ kind of proves my point...

The comparison to Lance and OJ was
a) not made by me
b) an example of the reductio ad absurdum argument.

The argument being presented was that because she had done some good for her brother, that it was unfair to call her out on things she has done that are bad. That's why I raised the Mark Cavendish example. The Lance example is just a more extreme one because most people at this stage would obviously view Lance as bad because of all the things he did and the livelihoods he destroyed in protection of his cult of personality, and at this point invoking Lance is kind of cycling's equivalent to Godwin's Law.

I don't think nicknaming Wiebes "Little Miss Contract Law" is malicious. Especially not when she's done it twice - and insisted on a clause entitling her to do it again in later contracts. While loyalty may be fleeting, the way she did it rubbed a lot of people up the wrong way, and it's the kind of stigma that stays with people and makes them less attractive signings in future if they aren't talented enough to overcome it - fortunately for Lorena, she very much is.

 

[Danskebjerge]

Vanity leading to defeat. Kind of satisfying to watch.

 

[AmRacer]

Wibes

I was little wrong with Healy, but right with Pidcok.

What a rider who in this generation can win at Alp D Huez and at Amstel.
Anyway I dont like the final now...too much flat km. With good weather is no selective.

🤔

 

[Lui98]

OJ Simpson ran for over 11 thousand yards, can't do no wrong for me.

Sad that he' ll never find the real killer

 

[DNP-Old]

Sad that he' ll never find the real killer

Didn't want to go to LA because he was afraid he might've sat next to the one who did it. Elite dedication.

 

[jmdirt]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANJtD141LY4

 

[Oldermanish]

I love Lance, he has a cancer foundation!

...had. All lost when the curtain parted. That donation money now, hopefully, goes to actual charity initiatives as opposed to private jet fuel.

 

[Oldermanish]

OJ Simpson ran for over 11 thousand yards, can't do no wrong for me.

You weren't drunk on the Roglic thread when you agreed with a drunk he was a "wheelsucker". At least your fan affiliations are consistent in their prejudice.

 

[Oldermanish]

Didn't want to go to LA because he was afraid he might've sat next to the one who did it. Elite dedication.

Probably avoided mirrors, too.

 

[DNP-Old]

You weren't drunk on the Roglic thread when you agreed with a drunk he was a "wheelsucker". At least your fan affiliations are consistent in their prejudice.

Lol.

 

[Lui98]

You weren't drunk on the Roglic thread when you agreed with a drunk he was a "wheelsucker". At least your fan affiliations are consistent in their prejudice.

C'mon man. When he was talking about OJ he was clearly joking. We don' t have to take everything so seriously

 

[Libertine Seguros]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANJtD141LY4

So even Wiebes points out that the change in parcours made it easier for her to be there at the finish.

Also that she basically had to scream at Longo Borghini to let her know she was there and stop her sprinting on the crab - I did think there was going to be a crash on that side watching it live. I mean, Wiebes (who is hardly a stranger to sprinting like a bull in a china shop) is a lot more well versed in the sprint arts than Longo Borghini and though Elisa has improved greatly in the last couple of years, she is still nevertheless far less used to mixing it up in that environment than Wiebes is. Not in a group larger than about 10 anyway, and there you have far more room to play with.

 

[Bolder]

That was a pretty egregious one, as far as early celebrations go.

Just got around to watching it. I suspect Wiebes in the heat of the moment thought the Amstel logo was the finish. Pidcock nearly did the same thing. Brutal ending.

 

[Escarabajo]

Interesting that Voss and Wiebes didn't get any votes in the poll.

I cannot believe what Wiebes did. I just saw the race. Feel really sorry for her.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Interesting that Voss and Wiebes didn't get any votes in the poll.

I cannot believe what Wiebes did. I just saw the race. Feel really sorry for her.

While Wiebes has improved her ability to get over obstacles, the Cauberg finish was likely perceived to be a bit outside her range because of the lack of recovery time afterward. Vos is never a bad bet, but isn't a bonanza bet anymore.

However, I think despite ourselves, we underestimated just how terrible the 2012 circuit has become, and with a péloton seemingly not hell-bent on going too hard today even when it came down to a single-climb shootout, they came back into it.

I think the course is due a shake-up. This is a race that does need a periodic refresh, because when the course is the same for too many years in a row, riders learn where to dose their efforts and when to go, and it becomes stale. The current Cauberg-Geulhemmerweg-Bemelerberg circuit is super stale, the men's race breathed life into it by changing the finish from being the Cauberg sprint, and reducing the repetition of the circuit to allow other climbs to have more role in the race; the women's race doesn't have anything more than a token inclusion of the climbs like Eyserbosweg and Keutenberg that offer greater opportunity for separation and would put riders like Wiebes at a disadvantage, whereas the lack of anything even resembling a challenge to all but the most miserable climber other than the Cauberg on the final circuit means that it all too frequently comes back together. The last climb other than that godawful circuit is 83km from home, and ain't nobody bothering with doing anything there at the start of Ardennes week.

The increased professionalism since the WWT has begun has started to render a lot of the old courses too easy for separation now. Elisa Balsamo winning two editions of the Trofeo Binda and Lorena Wiebes surviving to the finish of Amstel Gold should both be clear signs that these races - once preserves of the puncheuse - are no longer hard enough to fulfil the role on the calendar they are intended for, and the routes need to respond to reflect that. The women literally had a better route for the current péloton in 2003 when the race was running off the back of Leontien van Moorsel's success - using much of the same awful 2012 circuit, but extending the loop not just for the sake of extending it like they did today, but to loop around and add Keutenberg 11km from the finish - which would be around 12,5km today with the finish moved from the top of the Cauberg as it was back then to the end of the 2012 Worlds course over in Berg en Terblijt.

 

[awavey]

Just got around to watching it. I suspect Wiebes in the heat of the moment thought the Amstel logo was the finish. Pidcock nearly did the same thing. Brutal ending.

the difference with Pidcock was he doesnt lift his arms up till he's literally hitting the finish bit of the finish line, its about 3/4qtrs of a bike length away and the speed they were going its literally less than a second.

Lorena starts celebrating before shes even hit reached the Amstel logo, which looks around 4 bike lengths at least away from the finish line and its about 3 seconds later she crosses the line.

 

[awavey]

Interesting that Voss and Wiebes didn't get any votes in the poll.

I cannot believe what Wiebes did. I just saw the race. Feel really sorry for her.

well the makeup of SDWorx team, you wouldnt have expected Vollering, or Kopecky to be doing domestique jobs for a sprinter who by rights shouldnt be in the mix at the end of a race like that, none of the other teams brought their main sprinters did they ?

and the poll closed before I could pick Vos but again you look at the other teams, and you can never discount someone who has won 250, now 251, races, but it was hard to see a way through for her to beat them.

the delay and change of route obviously mixed things up, I saw ELB say it was more like a crit race in the end.

and I struggle to feel that sorry for her, maybe Ive a tiny bit of sympathy,but its such a very basic mistake for a pro rider to make that youd be embarrassed even as a first year junior to have done, and we see so often from riders who just dont ride to the line.

It equal parts annoys me that alot of the write ups of the race say Vos just won by a bike throw, and its like yes she did throw the bike which helps obviously, but actually she wins because the other rider is busy celebrating before theyve crossed the line, and the one thing you never see Vos do is celebrate before she's actually won, she carries on till the finish thats why she has won so much, and its not the first time she's caught another rider napping at the line either.

 

[Netserk]

However, I think despite ourselves, we underestimated just how terrible the 2012 circuit has become, and with a péloton seemingly not hell-bent on going too hard today even when it came down to a single-climb shootout, they came back into it.

I think the course is due a shake-up. This is a race that does need a periodic refresh, because when the course is the same for too many years in a row, riders learn where to dose their efforts and when to go, and it becomes stale.

I agree that the women's route is bad and that the circuit is bad, but I disagree that the race needs a periodic refresh. It just needs a good route. They could have the same last 105 km as the men, and then it wouldn't need any refresh, just like the men's route doesn't need any refresh.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I agree that the women's route is bad and that the circuit is bad, but I disagree that the race needs a periodic refresh. It just needs a good route. They could have the same last 105 km as the men, and then it wouldn't need any refresh, just like the men's route doesn't need any refresh.

Each time they've changed the course it's seen an uptick in the quality of editions for a while, until the péloton gets used to it, where the right places to go become 'known' and it becomes a bit more settled. The new version for the men has been very good thus far, and hopefully it will take a lot longer to become stale than the last couple (excepting the 2021 edition on the circuit because that was what they had to do to get an edition to exist at all).

Who knows, maybe this men's route is the one that sticks and becomes the permanent version, they seem to at least be accepting the role as, alongside Brabantse Pijl, a position on the continuum from the northern classics to Liège-Bastogne-Liège and accepting that some of the riders from the northern classics can play an important role in the race and its style, rather than trying to focus specifically and exclusively on the puncheurs as they tried to in the 2000s and early 2010s. But, if things start to get predictable 5-10 years down the line, then the race can look to reboot.

The women's race, on the other hand, needs urgent attention, because this circuit is beyond played out, everybody knows it like the backs of their hands, and all climbs bar the final time up the Cauberg have been rendered irrelevant, making it into a 2km race that manages to have all of the weaknesses of Flèche Wallonne and few of its strengths.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

I wouldn't mind seeing Eyserbosweg being climbed twice in the race, but another lap on the circuit is probably more likely to happen.