Teams & Riders Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

[portugal11]

Re: Re:

only the frenchies to think that pinot is on the same level as aru...

Only you to think that's not the case.

we will see mate...

 

[Red Rick]

I think Aru is marginally better in GTs, and Pinot is definitely better everywhere else. Also Pinot was better in 2017.

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

Miguel Angel Lopez might have some problems on the downhill sections, while Aru's inconsistency is his big Achilles heel. Hence, why I thought it was Pinot's big chance for overall glory. Yet, I in fact forgot about Chaves.

Aru, Pinot, Lopez, Chaves & Kruijswijk is a pretty even field looking forward to on paper. Maybe even Pozzovivo if he improves a bit in the TT once again.

Normally though, with these opponents, Landa absolutely has to change back his season schedule to Giro & Tour. He just can't afford to let go these golden chance to become a gt winner if Froome doesn't start the Giro! Mikel certainly tops Aru & Pinot on paper. At least on a course like this.

Same can be said about guys like Fuglsang even. Pinot is doing it right IMHO. Zakarin absolutely clueless!

Lopez no doubt can win stages but I have trouble seeing him on the podium after three weeks. I still think it's too early yet for him. But he has huge potential.

 

[Bot. Sky_Bot]

Re: Re:

only the frenchies to think that pinot is on the same level as aru...

Only you to think that's not the case.

we will see mate...

Not only.
Yes, it would have been battle between Aru and Pinot if Froome, Thomas, Nairo, Landa, Nibali, TomD, ..., hadn't participated.

 

[Chrispol]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/aru-could-join-dan-martin-and-kristoff-in-uae-tour-de-france-super-team/

it seems that Aru is afraid to know the truth.

 

[Tonton]

...or his team, after Movistar, is betting on Froome not racing Le Tour and see a unique opportunity to triumph in July. Dumoulin should go too, we'll see. Tibogiro again...I love it .

 

[monsieur_hulot]

At this stage very hard to know what Froome's race programme will end up being next year! It might still be possible that he skips the Giro (due to a ban or sitting out while fighting his case) but is back for the Tour.

Either way I think Thibot is generally better suited to the Giro than the Tour, and it's healthy for French cycling in general that not all efforts are focused solely on July.

 

[Tonton]

In l'Equipe, Marc Madiot makes the Giro possible but not sure. We don't know. Like everybody else, it's a Froome watch stance. Dawg was weak last year but doubled. He still scares DS, or rather Sky does. Froome gone considering what is happening and we are in '87 or '88, even '89 (who knew that GL would resurrect?), or '08, '11...a Tour up for grabs. A unique opportunity.

Thibaut can beat Dumoulin in this 8 MTF Giro. Dumoulin should be ambitious and go for the Tour. Portugal11 should stop betting with me. . That's all we know.

What I read about build up is showing Tibopino doubling. I hope that he does, goes for the Giro GC, does a Majka in the Tour. Rainbow jersey. Alexandre changes avatar...

Froome watch. See Aru. Plans will change as things evolve. Le Tour is the big prize, they all know it. For us, maybe the Giro or Vuelta are more entertaining, but the best wins the Tour.

If Madiot targerts the Tour, no Demare.

 

[yaco]

My take is there maybe dissension between key riders and staff - Possibly management is trying to have a bite of both cherries to keep sponsors at bay - Realistically, Pinot's main focus should be on the Giro in 2018, especially as the parcours for the TDF will be a challenge for Pinot - You've got Demare who can win a stage at the TDF - Pinot must go back to GC at the TDF in 2019 - You have to be careful in keeping your team leaders happy as evidenced at Mitchelton Scott in 2017.

 

[drebelo]

Re:

At this stage very hard to know what Froome's race programme will end up being next year! It might still be possible that he skips the Giro (due to a ban or sitting out while fighting his case) but is back for the Tour.

Either way I think Thibot is generally better suited to the Giro than the Tour, and it's healthy for French cycling in general that not all efforts are focused solely on July.

I tottaly agree with you, and with the team size reduction, sending both demare and pinot to the tour would be a tremendous error. And at this point of Pinot's carrer I highly doubt he can make a tour podium again, even more if he doesn't have a full dedicated team to support him.

 

[Tonton]

Re: Re:

At this stage very hard to know what Froome's race programme will end up being next year! It might still be possible that he skips the Giro (due to a ban or sitting out while fighting his case) but is back for the Tour.

Either way I think Thibot is generally better suited to the Giro than the Tour, and it's healthy for French cycling in general that not all efforts are focused solely on July.

I tottaly agree with you, and with the team size reduction, sending both demare and pinot to the tour would be a tremendous error. And at this point of Pinot's carrer I highly doubt he can make a tour podium again, even more if he doesn't have a full dedicated team to support him.

I soooo disagree. If Bardet can do it, Pinot can do it. Behind Froome and Dumoulin (his Giro win was very impressive), it's wide open between Quintana (can he bounce back?), Nibali, Uran, Landa, Chaves, and the two Frenchies. Porte if he can finish a GT. I don't put Wilco, Zakarin in that group, but they are close. Valverde...

I agree with the team composition: you can't get it both ways. It's either Demare or Pinot. In the end, Thibaut's contract ends in '18, so politics are big: please him with Il Giro, please the sponsor with Le Tour. If they agree, fine, but recovery will be a big issue. And as a fan, it hurts to see such a great rider at 70%, struggling in climbs alongside the likes of Arashiro...

 

[portugal11]

Re: Re:

At this stage very hard to know what Froome's race programme will end up being next year! It might still be possible that he skips the Giro (due to a ban or sitting out while fighting his case) but is back for the Tour.

Either way I think Thibot is generally better suited to the Giro than the Tour, and it's healthy for French cycling in general that not all efforts are focused solely on July.

I tottaly agree with you, and with the team size reduction, sending both demare and pinot to the tour would be a tremendous error. And at this point of Pinot's carrer I highly doubt he can make a tour podium again, even more if he doesn't have a full dedicated team to support him.

I soooo disagree. If Bardet can do it, Pinot can do it. Behind Froome and Dumoulin (his Giro win was very impressive), it's wide open between Quintana (can he bounce back?), Nibali, Uran, Landa, Chaves, and the two Frenchies. Porte if he can finish a GT. I don't put Wilco, Zakarin in that group, but they are close. Valverde...

I agree with the team composition: you can't get it both ways. It's either Demare or Pinot. In the end, Thibaut's contract ends in '18, so politics are big: please him with Il Giro, please the sponsor with Le Tour. If they agree, fine, but recovery will be a big issue. And as a fan, it hurts to see such a great rider at 70%, struggling in climbs alongside the likes of Arashiro...

are you trying to convince us or yourself?

 

[Breh]

Quintana, Nibali, Uran, Bardet and Zakarin atleast podiumed a GT last year.
Last year, Quintana was better in every single stage race they both participated.

It's not even close between these two.

 

[yaco]

Re: Re:

At this stage very hard to know what Froome's race programme will end up being next year! It might still be possible that he skips the Giro (due to a ban or sitting out while fighting his case) but is back for the Tour.

Either way I think Thibot is generally better suited to the Giro than the Tour, and it's healthy for French cycling in general that not all efforts are focused solely on July.

I tottaly agree with you, and with the team size reduction, sending both demare and pinot to the tour would be a tremendous error. And at this point of Pinot's carrer I highly doubt he can make a tour podium again, even more if he doesn't have a full dedicated team to support him.

I soooo disagree. If Bardet can do it, Pinot can do it. Behind Froome and Dumoulin (his Giro win was very impressive), it's wide open between Quintana (can he bounce back?), Nibali, Uran, Landa, Chaves, and the two Frenchies. Porte if he can finish a GT. I don't put Wilco, Zakarin in that group, but they are close. Valverde...

I agree with the team composition: you can't get it both ways. It's either Demare or Pinot. In the end, Thibaut's contract ends in '18, so politics are big: please him with Il Giro, please the sponsor with Le Tour. If they agree, fine, but recovery will be a big issue. And as a fan, it hurts to see such a great rider at 70%, struggling in climbs alongside the likes of Arashiro...

Is there any chance Pinot will leave for another team in 2019 - That is a non-French team - He'll have plenty of offers and most likely will get his wish to ride a more Italian program - Though his wages may go down.

 

[drebelo]

Re: Re:

At this stage very hard to know what Froome's race programme will end up being next year! It might still be possible that he skips the Giro (due to a ban or sitting out while fighting his case) but is back for the Tour.

Either way I think Thibot is generally better suited to the Giro than the Tour, and it's healthy for French cycling in general that not all efforts are focused solely on July.

I tottaly agree with you, and with the team size reduction, sending both demare and pinot to the tour would be a tremendous error. And at this point of Pinot's carrer I highly doubt he can make a tour podium again, even more if he doesn't have a full dedicated team to support him.

I soooo disagree. If Bardet can do it, Pinot can do it. Behind Froome and Dumoulin (his Giro win was very impressive), it's wide open between Quintana (can he bounce back?), Nibali, Uran, Landa, Chaves, and the two Frenchies. Porte if he can finish a GT. I don't put Wilco, Zakarin in that group, but they are close. Valverde...

I agree with the team composition: you can't get it both ways. It's either Demare or Pinot. In the end, Thibaut's contract ends in '18, so politics are big: please him with Il Giro, please the sponsor with Le Tour. If they agree, fine, but recovery will be a big issue. And as a fan, it hurts to see such a great rider at 70%, struggling in climbs alongside the likes of Arashiro...

I'm not saying is already to old to go for something big, but Yeah he podium when he was just 24 years old, in a GT that had much off the biggest figures already out of the race (Note that I'm not playing down is achievement or anything like that, I'm just stating the facts) but since then although he has been strike with some bad luck, we hadn't saw much of Pinot. Last year Giro, although it wasn't terrible leave some questions about the future. If he cant podium in a Giro (I recognize it had a somewhat strong field, but not comparing to the tour) how can he beat the likes of riders like the Landa Bardet Porte Uran or Froome that didn't went (or in case of Landa, fell early in the race) to the Giro plus the ones that went to the giro (Quintana Nibali and Dummolin). For me he his clearly behind this 8 fellas, and unless some big improvements or big luck I find it hard to get a podium.
I have to say that I personally like Pinot as a racer and I has chering for him last Giro, I just dont see him making big Waves

 

[Escarabajo]

Sending Pinot to these 2 races is a big mistake IMHO. Not sure what the objective is. Just pick one and focus on that one.

 

[Alexandre B.]

In l'Equipe, Marc Madiot makes the Giro possible but not sure. We don't know. Like everybody else, it's a Froome watch stance. Dawg was weak last year but doubled. He still scares DS, or rather Sky does. Froome gone considering what is happening and we are in '87 or '88, even '89 (who knew that GL would resurrect?), or '08, '11...a Tour up for grabs. A unique opportunity.

Thibaut can beat Dumoulin in this 8 MTF Giro. Dumoulin should be ambitious and go for the Tour. Portugal11 should stop betting with me. . That's all we know.

What I read about build up is showing Tibopino doubling. I hope that he does, goes for the Giro GC, does a Majka in the Tour. Rainbow jersey. Alexandre changes avatar...

Froome watch. See Aru. Plans will change as things evolve. Le Tour is the big prize, they all know it. For us, maybe the Giro or Vuelta are more entertaining, but the best wins the Tour.

If Madiot targerts the Tour, no Demare.

Madiot said that the Tour will be the main highlight of Pinot's season, so he's not going here to do a Majka.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Re: Re:

At this stage very hard to know what Froome's race programme will end up being next year! It might still be possible that he skips the Giro (due to a ban or sitting out while fighting his case) but is back for the Tour.

Either way I think Thibot is generally better suited to the Giro than the Tour, and it's healthy for French cycling in general that not all efforts are focused solely on July.

I tottaly agree with you, and with the team size reduction, sending both demare and pinot to the tour would be a tremendous error. And at this point of Pinot's carrer I highly doubt he can make a tour podium again, even more if he doesn't have a full dedicated team to support him.

I soooo disagree. If Bardet can do it, Pinot can do it. Behind Froome and Dumoulin (his Giro win was very impressive), it's wide open between Quintana (can he bounce back?), Nibali, Uran, Landa, Chaves, and the two Frenchies. Porte if he can finish a GT. I don't put Wilco, Zakarin in that group, but they are close. Valverde...

I agree with the team composition: you can't get it both ways. It's either Demare or Pinot. In the end, Thibaut's contract ends in '18, so politics are big: please him with Il Giro, please the sponsor with Le Tour. If they agree, fine, but recovery will be a big issue. And as a fan, it hurts to see such a great rider at 70%, struggling in climbs alongside the likes of Arashiro...

Why is that? Bardet seems much stronger than Pinot these days. The fact is, Pinot hasn't podiumed a GT since 2014 whereas Bardet was 2nd and 3rd in the Tour the last two years.

 

[Tonton]

BS if you ask me. Pinot was seconds away from a podium, Bardet one second away from losing his, that's about the same. With the amount of ITT in the Giro, Bardet would have been 5th or 6th at best.

Regardless, I like Bardet too, but besides Froome and Dumoulin, possibly Quintana and Nibali, I take PInot over the rest. The double is a bad idea, Madiot says one thing then another, we'll see. One year ago, you were all burying Tibopino. Read this thread. His Giro was great, the days after rest day weren't, it cost him the podium and maybe more.

Same time next year (and probably every year after that with portugal11 ), we'll circle back. I'm confident.

 

[Tonton]

...and for Zakarin, they both raced the Giro, right .

Happy New Year!!!

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

Sending Pinot to these 2 races is a big mistake IMHO. Not sure what the objective is. Just pick one and focus on that one.

I think he could do well in either race but I agree, only one of them. If Nibali and Quintana turn up to the Tour in the same form as the Giro then Pinot is in race with the doubts about Froome, the usual doubts about Porte and the other riders like Uran, Bardet etc being pretty close. I really thought Pinot blew his chances in the Giro with his TT riding. I was surprised it wasn't better. Looking at the TTs for both races maybe the Tour is a better race for him. He won't lose much in the TTT, as for the cobbles and first week, you need an element of luck to get through that anyway. If anyone is going to have trouble in the first week it would probably be Porte and Quintana but hopefully not. I prefer to see a shoot out in the final week. Too often the GTs are weakened by some of the best riders crashing out or having health issues but that's grand tour racing of course.

 

[Zaka_fan]

Hope Thibo wins something major next year, he really needs a boost

 

[portugal11]

BS if you ask me. Pinot was seconds away from a podium, Bardet one second away from losing his, that's about the same. With the amount of ITT

Same time next year (and probably every year after that with portugal11 ), we'll circle back. I'm confident.

maybe more :surprised: so you think he could have won :surprised:
this mod is going crazy he doesn't have a chance against tom and aru. he should focus on classics and polka dot jersey

 

[staubsauger]

Pinot has podiumed the Tour, was 4th at the Giro and nearly won the Tour de Suisse! Where does this nonsense of him being behind Porte come from? We're talking about real big gc races here. Not about P-N. Pinot is miles ahead of Porte who lost the Dauphine against Jakob Fuglsang.

 

[tobydawq]

Re:

Pinot has podiumed the Tour, was 4th at the Giro and nearly won the Tour de Suisse! Where does this nonsense of him being behind Porte come from? We're talking about real big gc races here. Not about P-N. Pinot is miles ahead of Porte who lost the Dauphine against Jakob Fuglsang.

Sorry, but: lol.

What on earth elevates a near TdS win above victories in Romandie, Paris-Nice and Catalunya combined with quite obviously being the best one week stage racer for the last couple of years?