"Tour de Bore"

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May 17, 2009
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FoxxyBrown1111 said:
Yes jrolaf, you´re right... So instead of complaining here, the fans who are not satisfied with this years tour, could complain to the UCI. That makes much more sense. Just a thought for you guys.

As for the radios, the UCI has made som attempts to get rid of them, e.g the worlds. But the teams claim that racing without radios is unsafe etc... Witch is of course utter bull****. They ride on closed, clearly marked roads, of course there are crashes, but radios have nothing to to with that.

So the UCI have already tried to get rid of the radios, with no luck. I don't think the fans have much power in this matter. The teams struggling to keep up should support the UCI, as they would benefit from less controlled racing.

As for the weight limit, I think all bike brands are already lobbying the UCI on that point.

But I'm actually staying at the same hotel as the UCI brass during the Worlds in Valkenburg, so I might try and give them a few tips during breakfast (if I'm sober enough).
 
Jun 15, 2009
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jrolaf said:
As for the radios, the UCI has made som attempts to get rid of them, e.g the worlds. But the teams claim that racing without radios is unsafe etc... Witch is of course utter bull****. They ride on closed, clearly marked roads, of course there are crashes, but radios have nothing to to with that.

So the UCI have already tried to get rid of the radios, with no luck. I don't think the fans have much power in this matter. The teams struggling to keep up should support the UCI, as they would benefit from less controlled racing.

As for the weight limit, I think all bike brands are already lobbying the UCI on that point.

But I'm actually staying at the same hotel as the UCI brass during the Worlds in Valkenburg, so I might try and give them a few tips during breakfast (if I'm sober enough).
It´s JV who loves computerized cycling & "USA franchise league cycling". In short all the BS that destroyes cycling. Unluckily he seems to have power.

Anyway, if i have time i´ll join you. Getting drunk the night before loosens the lips. A good idea, i am all in. ;)
 
FoxxyBrown1111 said:
It´s JV who loves computerized cycling & "USA franchise league cycling". In short all the BS that destroyes cycling. Unluckily he seems to have power.

Anyway, if i have time i´ll join you. Getting drunk the night before loosens the lips. A good idea, i am all in. ;)
Yr, it's the teams which are really against banning radios. They even threatened to boycott The Tour of Beijing over the issue.
 
Jul 5, 2010
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FoxxyBrown1111 said:
I think you guys throne the two stages of last year b/c that´s all it had.

The Alpe stage last year was no different than those won by Rolland & Pinot this year. And the AS escape only came out of desparation. If he hadn´t prevailed, it would be the same as Nibali´s useless attacks.... And Evans = Wiggins. So what?
Contador attacking before I even sat down and the long attack by Andy are far more exciting than anything this Tour offered. It might have been desperate, but that doesn't make it less exciting. Even Evans with his chasing of Andy showed far more than Wiggins did. Pinot is nice and all, but he was mostly just the strongest of the break of the day. His hanging on to a top 10 finish is far more surprising than his win that day. And I rate Voeckler's ride last year higher than anything Pinot did this year.
 
Jun 15, 2009
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Dutchsmurf said:
Contador attacking before I even sat down and the long attack by Andy are far more exciting than anything this Tour offered. It might have been desperate, but that doesn't make it less exciting. Even Evans with his chasing of Andy showed far more than Wiggins did. Pinot is nice and all, but he was mostly just the strongest of the break of the day. His hanging on to a top 10 finish is far more surprising than his win that day. And I rate Voeckler's ride last year higher than anything Pinot did this year.
:eek:

.........
 
Jun 15, 2009
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the asian said:
Yr, it's the teams which are really against banning radios. They even threatened to boycott The Tour of Beijing over the issue.
It´s time for the fans to boycott them... err, they even didn´t go away after 2007. :mad:
 
May 17, 2009
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the asian said:
Yr, it's the teams which are really against banning radios. They even threatened to boycott The Tour of Beijing over the issue.
So let them boycott. Some of the racing now is just as exciting as doing a quick simulation on PCM...
 
Armchair cyclist said:
I didn't say the top 10 were in the same order (or even that the podium was in the same order, though you missed that): I said that it was the same guys. Don't waste my time by misquoting me. Bye.
Fair enough - I deserve that. My humble apologies to you.
 
Jul 23, 2012
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This is my first post, although I follow cycling and this forum for some 5 years. The current outcry about the “most boring tour ever” prompted me to try and formulate my view why this Tour is regarded as boring, although it probably provided comparable entertainment to most of recent grand tours.

I blame the schizophrenic nature of cycling. It is a team sport, but the glory goes to an individual. I mean, in ice hockey the captain may get the first round with the cup, but it’s always team Russia that won, not Ovetschkin or Malkov (and everybody gets a medal). Here it is Wiggins who gets to stand on the podium and it would always be him who won the Tour, not Tem Sky.

While Sky was undoubtedly the best team, Wiggins may or may not be the best rider. He was superior in TTs but he has never shown his superiority in the mountains by an attack or even by riding in front himself for a while. Granted, he did not need to and it would be tactically unsound. But it leaves fans in a strange position. How are we supposed to believe that Wiggins was the best cyclist in this Tour when he was dragged most of the way by his team mates?

Cycling is a sport that is built on stories of the past exploits, of great champions and unbelievable feats of strength and determination. A sport, which thrives on individual achievements but due to unavoidable progress of technology and tactics, has become a sport where individual can no longer achieve anything against a well-organized team.

I believe people sense this dichotomy and search for confirmation that the individual getting the glory really deserves it. Not that he just happens to be on the best team. That’s why many people find this tour unfulfilling, and few(er) people complained about 2011 Giro.

What is the difference between Contador domination and Team Sky domination in terms of suspense? I would say none. Likewise, what is the difference between Team Sky grinding tempo and the same approach by Evans the year before? In terms of tactics employed - none.
However, both Contador and Evans have done that almost singlehandedly, with limited support from their respective teams. Would people still mention those stages from 2011 Tour where Evans dragged the whole peloton behind him to limit the losses to Contador and Andy Schleck as great examples of interesting racing if BMC had 5 riders in front winching Andy back in before the last climb?

I have no doubt that 5 years from now, we will still hear about Andy’s or Alberto’s long range attacks, but I would be seriously surprised if we would still recount Sky’s meticulous attention to detail and precision with which Wiggins kept the power meter pinned to 420 Watts.
With that said, I believe this is the future of cycling. What we have seen is the result of British dedication to sport science which started in 2004 in a bid to secure Olympic success in 2012 (look for BBC Horizon documentary from 2006 - Winning Gold in 2012). The Brits copied it from Australian swimmers and they in turn from East Germany athletes. The science and team organization just works. If an exceptional individual would be able to prevail from time to time, it would be very rare occasion.

So I guess it all ends well. There will still be stories of great exploits, we just have to get used to that the heroes would mostly lose their battles, as was so often the case in the course of human history. So why should cycling be different?
 
May 17, 2009
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andysho said:
This is my first post, although I follow cycling and this forum for some 5 years. The current outcry about the “most boring tour ever” prompted me to try and formulate my view why this Tour is regarded as boring, although it probably provided comparable entertainment to most of recent grand tours.

I blame the schizophrenic nature of cycling. It is a team sport, but the glory goes to an individual. I mean, in ice hockey the captain may get the first round with the cup, but it’s always team Russia that won, not Ovetschkin or Malkov (and everybody gets a medal). Here it is Wiggins who gets to stand on the podium and it would always be him who won the Tour, not Tem Sky.

While Sky was undoubtedly the best team, Wiggins may or may not be the best rider. He was superior in TTs but he has never shown his superiority in the mountains by an attack or even by riding in front himself for a while. Granted, he did not need to and it would be tactically unsound. But it leaves fans in a strange position. How are we supposed to believe that Wiggins was the best cyclist in this Tour when he was dragged most of the way by his team mates?

Cycling is a sport that is built on stories of the past exploits, of great champions and unbelievable feats of strength and determination. A sport, which thrives on individual achievements but due to unavoidable progress of technology and tactics, has become a sport where individual can no longer achieve anything against a well-organized team.

I believe people sense this dichotomy and search for confirmation that the individual getting the glory really deserves it. Not that he just happens to be on the best team. That’s why many people find this tour unfulfilling, and few(er) people complained about 2011 Giro.

What is the difference between Contador domination and Team Sky domination in terms of suspense? I would say none. Likewise, what is the difference between Team Sky grinding tempo and the same approach by Evans the year before? In terms of tactics employed - none.
However, both Contador and Evans have done that almost singlehandedly, with limited support from their respective teams. Would people still mention those stages from 2011 Tour where Evans dragged the whole peloton behind him to limit the losses to Contador and Andy Schleck as great examples of interesting racing if BMC had 5 riders in front winching Andy back in before the last climb?

I have no doubt that 5 years from now, we will still hear about Andy’s or Alberto’s long range attacks, but I would be seriously surprised if we would still recount Sky’s meticulous attention to detail and precision with which Wiggins kept the power meter pinned to 420 Watts.
With that said, I believe this is the future of cycling. What we have seen is the result of British dedication to sport science which started in 2004 in a bid to secure Olympic success in 2012 (look for BBC Horizon documentary from 2006 - Winning Gold in 2012). The Brits copied it from Australian swimmers and they in turn from East Germany athletes. The science and team organization just works. If an exceptional individual would be able to prevail from time to time, it would be very rare occasion.

So I guess it all ends well. There will still be stories of great exploits, we just have to get used to that the heroes would mostly lose their battles, as was so often the case in the course of human history. So why should cycling be different?

This is true, cycling is a team sport, and it is possible for a rider to win largely due to the strength of his team. But that is not the issue for me. No doubt Sky has chosen an effective and well tested approach to conquering cycling, but it is as much fun as watching paint dry... Where is the panache? Where are the attacks? Ok, you may not need to attack when you are in the lead, but if you can, why not give the fans something to be estatic about?

Compare the way Sky won the tour with the way Quickstep won the classics. They knew Boonen was the strongest rider, he also had the strongest domestique in Chavanel. He was dead certain to win a sprint against Flecha or Ballan. Did he play it safe and hang on until roubaix? No, he launched an attack 50k from the finish. That's how you win the fans. That's agressive riding.

If Sky's way of winning races is the future, I fear that cycling will loose a great deal of fans.
 
There were some great breakaways in this tour and a couple that faltered, heartbreakingly within sight of the line. We had Tommy V and his performing tongue and then we had the sprints.
The drag up the hill on stage one was stupendously exciting...then there was Sagan's celebration. The final kilometer of the Paris stage was electrifying....when have you ever seen the Maillot Jaune busting his mutton chops to lead out a sprinter on the grandstand stage of the tour?

Add to that Pinot and his excitable DS....some really great moments.

Although I'm not given to nationalism, as a Brit cycling fan who has watched the tour for decades, this edition has left me sore from pinching myself.
 
Sep 1, 2010
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armchairclimber said:
There were some great breakaways in this tour and a couple that faltered, heartbreakingly within sight of the line. We had Tommy V and his performing tongue and then we had the sprints.
The drag up the hill on stage one was stupendously exciting...then there was Sagan's celebration. The final kilometer of the Paris stage was electrifying....when have you ever seen the Maillot Jaune busting his mutton chops to lead out a sprinter on the grandstand stage of the tour?

Add to that Pinot and his excitable DS....some really great moments.

Although I'm not given to nationalism, as a Brit cycling fan who has watched the tour for decades, this edition has left me sore from pinching myself.
This tour had its moments no doubt but the main show was sadly lacking, obviously we all have different qualities that we like to see as I prefer to see the GC riders busting their chops on a climb rather than on the flat but like you I too had to pinch myself from falling asleep on too many of the stages. ;)
 
May 4, 2010
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jrolaf has hit the nail on the head. "Where's the panache." For those of you who think you've been watching bike racing for the last 3 weeks can I refer you to the famous "side by side" mountain battles between Anquetil and Poulidor.Just the two of them. Anquetil in yellow needing only to defend by sitting on but to do so would have been to accept the role of supplicant, to be humbled and that would never do .So they rode shoulder to shoulder. No quarter asked, no quarter given. We had Sercu, super sprinter, winning stages with 100 mile lone breakaways. Much was made of Cavendish equalling the stage wins of Darrigade, but Darrigade won sprints not only from bunches but from breaks too. He even won the odd mountain climb and usually finished around 20th on g.c. Best was 14th I think. I often wonder whether those with little knowledge of cycling come to terms with the fact that the world champion seems to drift in around 123rd most days.

There was an American racing in the 80's who I now only remember as "Bob" who was always embarking on impossible exploits. When asked by a journalist if he actually wanted to win his answer was "sure I do but when I win I want to win in style."
 
Apr 11, 2011
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andysho said:
While Sky was undoubtedly the best team, Wiggins may or may not be the best rider. He was superior in TTs but he has never shown his superiority in the mountains by an attack or even by riding in front himself for a while. Granted, he did not need to and it would be tactically unsound. But it leaves fans in a strange position. How are we supposed to believe that Wiggins was the best cyclist in this Tour when he was dragged most of the way by his team mates?
But if he was 'dragged' how come no one else was able to capitalise on the tow? When Nibali attacked, Froome 'dragged' Wiggins back to Nibalis wheel. What was to stop JVDB, etc. getting onto Wiggins wheel so they could be 'dragged' up the mountain.

Wiggins was paced not dragged. Consistently the only three riders able to stay at the front whether they were the ones setting the pace or following it were the top three. They were the best riders.
 
Jaunty Monty said:
But if he was 'dragged' how come no one else was able to capitalise on the tow? When Nibali attacked, Froome 'dragged' Wiggins back to Nibalis wheel. What was to stop JVDB, etc. getting onto Wiggins wheel so they could be 'dragged' up the mounting.

Wiggins was paced not dragged. Consistently the only three riders able to stay at the front whether they were the ones setting the pace or following it were the top three. They were the best riders.
But he did drag in the TT. Everyone else seemed second rate.
 
May 17, 2009
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armchairclimber said:
Although I'm not given to nationalism, as a Brit cycling fan who has watched the tour for decades, this edition has left me sore from pinching myself.
Wiggo is really from Belgium isn't he? And Froome is Kenyan...
;)
 
Jul 23, 2012
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Jaunty Monty said:
But if he was 'dragged' how come no one else was able to capitalise on the tow? When Nibali attacked, Froome 'dragged' Wiggins back to Nibalis wheel. What was to stop JVDB, etc. getting onto Wiggins wheel so they could be 'dragged' up the mountain.

Wiggins was paced not dragged. Consistently the only three riders able to stay at the front whether they were the ones setting the pace or following it were the top three. They were the best riders.
I did not mean it to sound derogatory. "Paced" works for me. I do not think it changes what I was trying to say.
 
Jul 16, 2012
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This is my first post as well. Been an avid cycling fan for over 10 years now and watch just about every race available. This tour was indeed boring to me. The only sense of excitement I got was from the NBC fantasy cycling challenge where I finished in the top 50. Ok, and maybe a little when Froome was dropping Wiggo.

To me, I think a # of factors contributed to my boredom.

1) the Olympics. It seems many riders were at the Tour this year with the Olympics in the back of their minds. It was brought up in interviews, and riders stated their ultimate goal was at the Olympics. So I felt that the all out effort you normally see @ the Tour was simply not there.

2) the lack of a true favorite GC rider for myself. Having been a Lance, then Alberto, then Schleck fan, I was left without a true rider to really route for. (I seem to have a great record of picking the questionable ones) To me, the most excitement I feel is when a rider goes on the attack, whether it be Fabian on the small cobbled hill, or Alberto on a mountain top, or a rider powering off the front of the peloton trying to steal a stage win. The "can he do it" question wasn't there for me.

3) the fact that the sprinters didn't chase on the stage before the final rest day! I kept saying to myself, this is the Tour right? It was like that on a couple other stages as well, and it was shocking and disappointing to see.

4) the crashes. With a bunch of strong riders abandoning or getting that mysterious stomach flu, it hurt the overall competition.

5) the shear domination of team sky. I mean, they were just flat out unbeatable. I can't fault them for this, but it just gave you the sense that everyone else had no chance to win.

Everyone's got an opinion, and this was just another one expressing my reasons for a disappointing tour. I'm usually saddened when it's over, but not this year.

Here's to hoping for a Froome/Contador showdown at the Vuelta.
 
Tour director Christian Prudhomme said: ‘The one thing I can tell you is that the 2013 Tour will favour the climbers a lot more than this year’s route did. Whatever we decide, there will be more stages with summit finishes.’
 
saganators said:
This is my first post as well. Been an avid cycling fan for over 10 years now and watch just about every race available. This tour was indeed boring to me. The only sense of excitement I got was from the NBC fantasy cycling challenge where I finished in the top 50. Ok, and maybe a little when Froome was dropping Wiggo.

To me, I think a # of factors contributed to my boredom.

1) the Olympics. It seems many riders were at the Tour this year with the Olympics in the back of their minds. It was brought up in interviews, and riders stated their ultimate goal was at the Olympics. So I felt that the all out effort you normally see @ the Tour was simply not there.

2) the lack of a true favorite GC rider for myself. Having been a Lance, then Alberto, then Schleck fan, I was left without a true rider to really route for. (I seem to have a great record of picking the questionable ones) To me, the most excitement I feel is when a rider goes on the attack, whether it be Fabian on the small cobbled hill, or Alberto on a mountain top, or a rider powering off the front of the peloton trying to steal a stage win. The "can he do it" question wasn't there for me.

3) the fact that the sprinters didn't chase on the stage before the final rest day! I kept saying to myself, this is the Tour right? It was like that on a couple other stages as well, and it was shocking and disappointing to see.

4) the crashes. With a bunch of strong riders abandoning or getting that mysterious stomach flu, it hurt the overall competition.

5) the shear domination of team sky. I mean, they were just flat out unbeatable. I can't fault them for this, but it just gave you the sense that everyone else had no chance to win.

Everyone's got an opinion, and this was just another one expressing my reasons for a disappointing tour. I'm usually saddened when it's over, but not this year.

Here's to hoping for a Froome/Contador showdown at the Vuelta.
It was the perfect expression of British dryness.
 

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