Tour de France 2020 | Stage 8 (Gazeres-sur-Geronne - Loudenvielle

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Well you guys wanted interesting TdF with many riders fighting for it. Now you have it with not so strong Roglič and you are complaining again :)

What if Roglič peaks in week 2 or 3 and is still riding himself in form after that crash?
Who's complaining? If anything I'm really hoping my whole "Roglic is overrated" narrative stands as my "Pogacar ain't even that good" narrative seems to have been absolutely horrific.
 
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Yeah. First it was boring because JV train destroys everybody. Then it would be boring if Roglič killed everybody. Now JV train died, Roglič couldn't/didn't want to/was not allowed to go for it so many riders can still win it all and no one happy about that again.
Maybe he's just a bit of a dull rider? He doesn't really give neutrals much to get exited about whether he's winning, losing, or tactically deciding to gift time to his rivals.
 
I just read JV comments. Their plan was to bring Roglič and Tom as close to the finish as possible and they would follow wheels until the end.

Problem was all Doms were not in form today because of yesterday hard stage and they dropped too quick. Then Tom called director that he won't be able to follow Roglič and others any more and decided (or was forced) to dom for Roglič. He had nothing in the tank any more so he was able to work 5 hard minutes and got dropped.

Roglič then continued alone and tried to keep up. He didn't go after Pogačar because he knew he's flying and would put Roglič in red.

Cut the loses and try another day i guess.
Pogačar is dangerous even for TdF win.
 
I still think Roglič simply isn't as good as he was in Dauphnie. Crash caused a lot of problems and missed training. He's there and riding himself in form. And that is scary.
I already said in the stage 6 debacle that Roglic is still at 90 % and he is planning to peak in 2nd/3rd week. Probably Loze is their biggest fear as Quintana/Bernal might thrive there and get a lot of time. He isn't taking any risks and the orders from his DS is just to respond to attacks from people around him in GC.
JV is heavily overestimated but actually only WvA is in a tremendous form, the rest of them are worse than in Dauphine. Bennett and Kuss can't help Roglic in the mountains for now so Dumo thinks he has to sacrifice himself for the team and basically doing their work. I still think it was a bad decision because Roglic didn't have an attack planned for the stage.
 
Reactions: Sandisfan
Or you could just stop watching and spare us your wishing people get sick while we enjoy watching racing.
Or you could read the post after, light up and accept people have Different types of humor.

Also they didn’t soft pedal the whole stage so I don’t want them to lose their job. (This is also a joke)
 
If Roglic is really not that great and his team knows it, the tactics of JV are even more clueless. They didn't have to drive the pace that much, the victory was already gone and they are in pole position for yellow (which they claim they don't want yet anyway). But they did drive the pace with WVA, who in the process basically burned both Kuss and Bennett, leaving only Dumoulin. Dumoulin feels he doesn't have it, but instead of keeping a low profile, he actually does a 5 minute turn with the only effect being that he put himself out of contention. Not one other favourite lost ground, and perhaps the most dangerous one gained time. Now JV have exposed themselves as having no mountain domestiques on prime form, and perhaps some adversaries will indeed begin thinking Roglic is vulnerable.

Great job - but not really.
 
Some shocking comments from Frans Maassen (Jumbo DS). He didn't exactly crucify Dumoulin, but he's not going in soft either. The initial plan was for Roglic to gain time and for Dumoulin to just follow wheels. Dumoulin then just decided to start pulling, which they couldn't stop him from doing (perhaps because the (self inflicted) damage was already done by the time the news of Dumoulin pulling had reached them), and is somewhat pointing the finger of blame towards Dumoulin. Dumoulin thinks he's not in good form, which Maassen deliberately disagrees with. What a mess they've made of this.
 
If Roglic is really not that great and his team knows it, the tactics of JV are even more clueless. They didn't have to drive the pace that much, the victory was already gone and they are in pole position for yellow (which they claim they don't want yet anyway). But they did drive the pace with WVA, who in the process basically burned both Kuss and Bennett, leaving only Dumoulin. Dumoulin feels he doesn't have it, but instead of keeping a low profile, he actually does a 5 minute turn with the only effect being that he put himself out of contention. Not one other favourite lost ground, and perhaps the most dangerous one gained time. Now JV have exposed themselves as having no mountain domestiques on prime form, and perhaps some adversaries will indeed begin thinking Roglic is vulnerable.

Great job - but not really.
Well it happens. It's not chess. It's 3000+ km long cycling race.
 
Some shocking comments from Frans Maassen (Jumbo DS). He didn't exactly crucify Dumoulin, but he's not going in soft either. The initial plan was for Roglic to gain time and for Dumoulin to just follow wheels. Dumoulin then just decided to start pulling, which they couldn't stop him from doing (perhaps because the (self inflicted) damage was already done by the time the news of Dumoulin pulling had reached them), and is somewhat pointing the finger of blame towards Dumoulin. Dumoulin thinks he's not in good form, which Maassen, deliberately disagrees with.
Well Roglič gaining time and Tom following wheels means it's clear they don't count on Tom any more for the win. So he rather burned himself up. I hope this doesn't mean bad vibes in the team and that Roglič just lost a super dom.
 
Some shocking comments from Frans Maassen (Jumbo DS). He didn't exactly crucify Dumoulin, but he's not going in soft either. The initial plan was for Roglic to gain time and for Dumoulin to just follow wheels. Dumoulin then just decided to start pulling, which they couldn't stop him from doing (perhaps because the (self inflicted) damage was already done by the time the news of Dumoulin pulling had reached them), and is somewhat pointing the finger of blame towards Dumoulin. Dumoulin thinks he's not in good form, which Maassen deliberately disagrees with. What a mess they've made of this.
If that's true and Dumo pulled without their consent then it's on Dumo really. Why would the DS be to blame in this case?
Well Roglič gaining time and Tom following wheels means it's clear they don't count on Tom any more for the win. So he rather burned himself up. I hope this doesn't mean bad vibes in the team and that Roglič just lost a super dom.
Dumo was the backup, the plan was for him to stay in reach in case something happens with Roglic. Just because Roglic would gain time doesn't mean Dumo wouldn't have chances for GC.
 
Dumoulin was always thought to be on a rising curve, so that he doesn't feel great the first week is normal. There's still two weeks and a time trial that suits him to perfection to come. Him burning himself for absolutely nothing is extremely stupid. Dumoulin first pulled for a short while, so the DS could have told him to sit in the wheels and not pull again, but they didn't or he didn't listen - neither of which is good.
 
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If Roglic is really not that great and his team knows it, the tactics of JV are even more clueless. They didn't have to drive the pace that much, the victory was already gone and they are in pole position for yellow (which they claim they don't want yet anyway). But they did drive the pace with WVA, who in the process basically burned both Kuss and Bennett, leaving only Dumoulin. Dumoulin feels he doesn't have it, but instead of keeping a low profile, he actually does a 5 minute turn with the only effect being that he put himself out of contention. Not one other favourite lost ground, and perhaps the most dangerous one gained time. Now JV have exposed themselves as having no mountain domestiques on prime form, and perhaps some adversaries will indeed begin thinking Roglic is vulnerable.

Great job - but not really.
Agree, if Dumoulin is suffering then why isn't he following hiding out wheels instead of putting in a five minute max effort that leaves him totally cooked? Roglic didn't have the legs to use it as a spring for an attack and there's a good chance the entire group stays on a steady pace or slows and maybe Dumoulin hangs on or only loses a few seconds . That was cluster from JV today.
 
Reactions: gregrowlerson
Really unsure if serious
What? It’s 18 km from top of Col de Marie Blanque to the finish. Last 7 km is flat/slightly uphill. It seems to be around 10 GC guys that are pretty equal when it comes to strength. If two of them get at gap of 20second, don’t you think it’s to far from the mountain top to stay away?
 
Some shocking comments from Frans Maassen (Jumbo DS). He didn't exactly crucify Dumoulin, but he's not going in soft either. The initial plan was for Roglic to gain time and for Dumoulin to just follow wheels. Dumoulin then just decided to start pulling, which they couldn't stop him from doing (perhaps because the (self inflicted) damage was already done by the time the news of Dumoulin pulling had reached them), and is somewhat pointing the finger of blame towards Dumoulin. Dumoulin thinks he's not in good form, which Maassen deliberately disagrees with. What a mess they've made of this.
That sounds like an explanation for what JV did today at first but it isn't really. I totally agree Dumoulin shouldn't have thrown himself under the bus like he did but:
a) if they didn't actually want to blow things up like they did and only wanted to control things they probably would not have wasted the rest of their team on the Bales and the first third of the Peyresourde
b) if they wanted to blow things up they desperately needed Dumoulin because the rest of the team clearly wasn't able to properly prepare an attack.

To me it sounds like Dumoulin knew the plan was for Roglic to attack and as he didn't feel strong himself he decided to work for the team instead and prepare said attack. He probably did so following his own instinct and wasn't really communicating with Roglic all that well and as Roglic realized he doesn't have the legs to just fly away from everyone Dumoulin was throwing away his own gc ambitions to prepare exactly that.
 
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Some shocking comments from Frans Maassen (Jumbo DS). He didn't exactly crucify Dumoulin, but he's not going in soft either. The initial plan was for Roglic to gain time and for Dumoulin to just follow wheels. Dumoulin then just decided to start pulling, which they couldn't stop him from doing (perhaps because the (self inflicted) damage was already done by the time the news of Dumoulin pulling had reached them), and is somewhat pointing the finger of blame towards Dumoulin. Dumoulin thinks he's not in good form, which Maassen deliberately disagrees with. What a mess they've made of this.
Man, that’s bad. Are they purposely trying to screw this up? With Rog’s comments, Dom burning up and using WVA like a rented mule, sheesh. Poor WVA just pegged himself today. We he peeled off he was toast. Just don’t understand their strat but they sure are making this interesting.
 
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