Vuelta 2017, Stage 8 : Hellín / Xorret de Catí. 199,5km

[Jagartrott]

Re: Re:

Another one for Quick Step. What a season they're having... #13 in the bag.

#13 what? Wins? They have much more than 13 wins this season and Allaphillipe doesn't have 13 wins so I don't know what you're referring to?

13 gt wins this season

Could they get to 5-5-5 (and who's the last team that was able to pull that off)?
I think they have a decent chance, with another sprint victory and the TT with Lampaert or Jungels, or a win from the breakaway with Mas or Alaphilippe again.

There was a discussion a few weeks ago whether the number 1 spot of QS in the WT was justified. I think it definitely is - they are omnipresent, winning all through the season - with far from the biggest budget.

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Everyone saying the race is over need to remember there are a lot of things that can happy. Froome can have a jours sans, an accident (I don't wish that on anyone), Sicilian Voodoo, or any number of other situations. It will be a good Vuelta.

Froome hasn't had a really bad day since 2011, so no, that will not happen.

That's not really true though is it. He's lost a minute plus multiple times on mountain stages. Not that I'm necessarily expecting it here, but he has had had days in the past.

 

[dacooley]

Re: Re:

Everyone saying the race is over need to remember there are a lot of things that can happy. Froome can have a jours sans, an accident (I don't wish that on anyone), Sicilian Voodoo, or any number of other situations. It will be a good Vuelta.

Froome hasn't had a really bad day since 2011, so no, that will not happen.

That's not really true though is it. He's lost a minute plus multiple times on mountain stages. Not that I'm necessarily expecting it here, but he has had had days in the past.

Sure he did. Against Quintana in perfect form.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Contador has said he didn't feel really good today. When Froome took some distance from him, it was because he wanted to take a breath but nothing else.

That essentially means that Froome put Bertie into the red...

yes did you think he dropped for fun..?

 

[Vroome.exe]

Re:

Great win by bala junior. But unfortunately i'm more certain that bala junior is just a uphill sprinter, he is not a attacker at all.

Compared to Bala he is easily the more attacking rider.

 

[Irondan]

Re: Re:

Contador has said he didn't feel really good today. When Froome took some distance from him, it was because he wanted to take a breath but nothing else.

That essentially means that Froome put Bertie into the red...

yes did you think he dropped for fun..?

Me? No, I didn't think he dropped for fun. I think he dropped because he couldn't keep up with the pace.

My comment was in reply to someone that made it sound like Bertie could have chose not to have "taken a breath". Let's call a spade a spade.

 

[May0maniac]

Re: Re:

Alaphilippe was so strong today!

really? Sitting on Majka's a@@ all that time? Disgusting. A typical French way...

Lol Majka didn't take a single pull himself, they rode side by side.

What race were you watching? They rode side by side for a few hundred meters but that's about it, the rest of the climb Majka was out front.

Because he had to drop the stronger sprinter and Buchmann even worked for him to drop all the others, that's just how things work out.
Nibali was stronger than expected and Delfino is also improving, the proper mountain stages will be fun.

 

[portugal11]

Re: Re:

Another one for Quick Step. What a season they're having... #13 in the bag.

#13 what? Wins? They have much more than 13 wins this season and Allaphillipe doesn't have 13 wins so I don't know what you're referring to?

13 gt wins this season

Could they get to 5-5-5 (and who's the last team that was able to pull that off)?
I think they have a decent chance, with another sprint victory and the TT with Lampaert or Jungels, or a win from the breakaway with Mas or Alaphilippe again.

There was a discussion a few weeks ago whether the number 1 spot of QS in the WT was justified. I think it definitely is - they are omnipresent, winning all through the season - with far from the biggest budget.

Maybe renault? For me they are the second best team only behind sky. They don't win stage races and don't really have a gc rider (only martin but I still think he is more a classicomano than a gt rider). Gt riders are the ones who have the best salaries so it is normal that despite their low budget (compared to katusha, sky, etc) they can be competitive in every race bar gc battles

 

[rick james]

Re: Re:

Everyone saying the race is over need to remember there are a lot of things that can happy. Froome can have a jours sans, an accident (I don't wish that on anyone), Sicilian Voodoo, or any number of other situations. It will be a good Vuelta.

Froome hasn't had a really bad day since 2011, so no, that will not happen.

will you ever get over some froomes triumph with dignity?

:lol:

 

[Rvizzle]

Haimar Zubeldia to appear from nowhere (he's probably not anywhere near a bike) and take the GC...............

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Everyone saying the race is over need to remember there are a lot of things that can happy. Froome can have a jours sans, an accident (I don't wish that on anyone), Sicilian Voodoo, or any number of other situations. It will be a good Vuelta.

Froome hasn't had a really bad day since 2011, so no, that will not happen.

That's not really true though is it. He's lost a minute plus multiple times on mountain stages. Not that I'm necessarily expecting it here, but he has had had days in the past.

Sure he did. Against Quintana in perfect form.

And Purito. He's had a jour sans every year except 2014, when he only did 5 stages of the Tour and then was second best for most the Vuelta. In 2012, he lost 2:30 to the three contenders in Cuitu Negro, then 5 minutes the next day. In 2013, he lost over a minute on a 13km climb to Purito and Quintana with an illegal feed thrown into the mix as well. In 2015, he had two consecutive bad days at the Tour before having that day in andorra, but that was because he managed to crash going uphill. In 2016 he lost near 3 minutes to Quintana and Brambilla and Felline. So not only Quintana.

 

[Brullnux]

Today's ascent was the quickest since 2004, quicker even than Valverde and Evans in 2009

 

[dacooley]

Re: Re:

Everyone saying the race is over need to remember there are a lot of things that can happy. Froome can have a jours sans, an accident (I don't wish that on anyone), Sicilian Voodoo, or any number of other situations. It will be a good Vuelta.

Froome hasn't had a really bad day since 2011, so no, that will not happen.

That's not really true though is it. He's lost a minute plus multiple times on mountain stages. Not that I'm necessarily expecting it here, but he has had had days in the past.

Sure he did. Against Quintana in perfect form.

And Purito. He's had a jour sans every year except 2014, when he only did 5 stages of the Tour and then was second best for most the Vuelta. In 2012, he lost 2:30 to the three contenders in Cuitu Negro, then 5 minutes the next day. In 2013, he lost over a minute on a 13km climb to Purito and Quintana with an illegal feed thrown into the mix as well. In 2015, he had two consecutive bad days at the Tour before having that day in andorra, but that was because he managed to crash going uphill. In 2016 he lost near 3 minutes to Quintana and Brambilla and Felline. So not only Quintana.

remembering formigal, surely he сan get under the edge in the echelons or become a victim of unattentiveness once again and lose 5 minutes on some relatively easy stage. nonetheless, froome wasn't outnumbered by quintana, felline and brambilla by 3 minutes on formigal. he wasn't just on guard when it was vitally needed, simple as that. the real problem this time is froome not riding at a disadvantage as all the condenders have one gt in the legs as well.

 

[Vasilis]

Re:

Today's ascent was the quickest since 2004, quicker even than Valverde and Evans in 2009

By Contador and Froome?

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

I suspect that Majka took the wrong approach to getting rid of Alaphilippe. By attacking in bursts and then slowing up he was using the standard approach to dropping someone who is less of a natural climber. But Alaphilippe is an Ardennes guy. Anaerobic efforts separated by brief recovery periods are in his comfort zone. On the other hand he probably can't TT up the mountain at Majka's pace and there's little benefit from drafting. Majka would have been better off trying to grind him off his wheel.

 

[Pharazon]

Re: Re:

Everyone saying the race is over need to remember there are a lot of things that can happy. Froome can have a jours sans, an accident (I don't wish that on anyone), Sicilian Voodoo, or any number of other situations. It will be a good Vuelta.

Froome hasn't had a really bad day since 2011, so no, that will not happen.

That's not really true though is it. He's lost a minute plus multiple times on mountain stages. Not that I'm necessarily expecting it here, but he has had had days in the past.

Sure he did. Against Quintana in perfect form.

And Purito. He's had a jour sans every year except 2014, when he only did 5 stages of the Tour and then was second best for most the Vuelta. In 2012, he lost 2:30 to the three contenders in Cuitu Negro, then 5 minutes the next day. In 2013, he lost over a minute on a 13km climb to Purito and Quintana with an illegal feed thrown into the mix as well. In 2015, he had two consecutive bad days at the Tour before having that day in andorra, but that was because he managed to crash going uphill. In 2016 he lost near 3 minutes to Quintana and Brambilla and Felline. So not only Quintana.

if i remember rightly Froome was in the peloton at the beginning of a climb and got squeezed off the road and into a barrier or a wall, something like that

 

[Asturiano]

You can watch here the uphill of tomorrow with this video, it's going to be climbed twice:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2xvFLa5flw

 

[HelloDolly]

Re:

Haimar Zubeldia to appear from nowhere (he's probably not anywhere near a bike) and take the GC...............

Haimar is out mountain biking ....maybe its his ruse to sneak in the Vuelta (from the bushes)

 

[HelloDolly]

two questions please

Does anyone have the cimbing times on the Cati today of the GC men ..
Is tomorrow stage finale the same as the one Dumoulin won in 2015

 

[Red Rick]

Re:

two questions please

Does anyone have the cimbing times on the Cati today of the GC men ..
Is tomorrow stage finale the same as the one Dumoulin won in 2015

Xorret de Cati
2017:3,8 km@11,8%---13:20---average speed 17.10 km/h(Froome-Contador)
2016:3,8 km@11,8%---13:36---average speed 16.76 km/h(Wouter Poels)
---14:03---average speed 16.23 km/h(Navarro-I.Izaguirre-Aru-Intxausti)
2010:3,8 km@11,8%---13:56---average speed 16.36 km/h(Nibali-Anton-Rodriguez-Tondo-Sastre)
2009:3,8 km@11,8%---13:27---average speed 16.95 km/h(Valverde-Evans-Basso)
2004:3,8 km@11,8%---13:15---average speed 17.21 km/h(Jorge Ferrio)
---13:25---average speed 16.99 km/h(Valverde-Heras-Piepoli)
2000:3,8 km@11,8%---12:42---average speed 17.95 km/h(Eladio Jimenez)-RECORD
---12:52---average speed 17.72 km/h(Heras-Zulle-Gotti)
1998:3,8 km@11,8%---12:58---average speed 17.58 km/h(Jose Maria Jimenez)
---13:23---average speed 17.04 km/h(Roberto Heras)
---13:45---average speed 16.58 km/h(Jalabert-Olano-Armstrong group)


And it is the same climb as the one Dumoulin won on in 2015.

 

[Asturiano]

Re:

two questions please

Does anyone have the cimbing times on the Cati today of the GC men ..
Is tomorrow stage finale the same as the one Dumoulin won in 2015

Yes, to the second question.

Threre is a video in YouTube you can watch it.

 

[Tank Engine]

Re:

I suspect that Majka took the wrong approach to getting rid of Alaphilippe. By attacking in bursts and then slowing up he was using the standard approach to dropping someone who is less of a natural climber. But Alaphilippe is an Ardennes guy. Anaerobic efforts separated by brief recovery periods are in his comfort zone. On the other hand he probably can't TT up the mountain at Majka's pace and there's little benefit from drafting. Majka would have been better off trying to grind him off his wheel.

You may well be right, but that's the benefit of hindsight.

Why did I jump off the Balaphilippegilbert hype train?

As for those moaning about Alaphilippe wheel sucking (which is of virtually no meaning on 20% slopes), that style of racing is one thing I love about cycling. Riders with different characteristics having to use the terrain that suits them to put themselves in a position to win. It was Majka's job to drop Alaphilippe on the climb and Alaphilippe's job not to get dropped.

And it's not that I was shouting for Alaphilippe (although I like him as a rider). Hint: today I cycled over Przełęcz Okraj (the Okraj pass) from the south into the country I live in.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

two questions please

Does anyone have the cimbing times on the Cati today of the GC men ..
Is tomorrow stage finale the same as the one Dumoulin won in 2015

Xorret de Cati
2017:3,8 km@11,8%---13:20---average speed 17.10 km/h(Froome-Contador)
2016:3,8 km@11,8%---13:36---average speed 16.76 km/h(Wouter Poels)
---14:03---average speed 16.23 km/h(Navarro-I.Izaguirre-Aru-Intxausti)
2010:3,8 km@11,8%---13:56---average speed 16.36 km/h(Nibali-Anton-Rodriguez-Tondo-Sastre)
2009:3,8 km@11,8%---13:27---average speed 16.95 km/h(Valverde-Evans-Basso)
2004:3,8 km@11,8%---13:15---average speed 17.21 km/h(Jorge Ferrio)
---13:25---average speed 16.99 km/h(Valverde-Heras-Piepoli)
2000:3,8 km@11,8%---12:42---average speed 17.95 km/h(Eladio Jimenez)-RECORD
---12:52---average speed 17.72 km/h(Heras-Zulle-Gotti)
1998:3,8 km@11,8%---12:58---average speed 17.58 km/h(Jose Maria Jimenez)
---13:23---average speed 17.04 km/h(Roberto Heras)
---13:45---average speed 16.58 km/h(Jalabert-Olano-Armstrong group)

So this years time was good but not incredible. There have been way faster times and being 16 seconds faster than Poels in a very early preparation race also isn't that great.

 

[HelloDolly]

Thanks Red Rick and Asturiano for anwering my questions

 

[Billie]

Re: Re:

Another one for Quick Step. What a season they're having... #13 in the bag.

#13 what? Wins? They have much more than 13 wins this season and Allaphillipe doesn't have 13 wins so I don't know what you're referring to?

13 gt wins this season

Could they get to 5-5-5 (and who's the last team that was able to pull that off)?

Petacchi on his own did 6-4-5 in 2003.

What's the record for most GT stages in one year by one team? Fassa Bortolo had 17 and 16 GT stage wins in consecutive years