Vuelta a España 2025 discussion

[Brullnux]

Miles better field than the Mickey Mouse fields in the Giro.

Agree but unlike the Giro nobody outside of Mas has this as their main goal.

 

[Rou]

Agree but unlike the Giro nobody outside of Mas has this as their main goal.

Sure, it's the last GT and it doesn't make a lot of sense to have it as your main goal.
Doesn't change the fact that the level is always higher than the Giro.

 

[Brullnux]

Sure, it's the last GT and it doesn't make a lot of sense to have it as your main goal.
Doesn't change the fact that the level is always higher than the Giro.

But it's also less prestigious and much less anticipated, not helped by a real monotony re the routes.

 

[Pozzovivo]

Or maybe the TDF field was deeper with Onley, Vauquelin and Jegat in top 10.
LoL

Onley is clearly a very good rider and will podium GT's many times in the future.

 

[Rou]

But it's also less prestigious and much less anticipated, not helped by a real monotony re the routes.

How do we measure prestige?
In terms of history?
In terms of opponents?
In terms of difficulty?
In terms of history Strade Bianche has no prestige. In terms of spectacle it has.
The Giro has prestige in terms of history. But it has become a real mockery the last years with the habit of paying top riders and the pathetic routes.
As example: I value a Pogacar victory in the Giro against Dani Martinez much lower than a potential victory in the Vuelta against Jonas.
Do you get my point?

 

[Rou]

Onley is clearly a very good rider and will podium GT's many times in the future.

Or maybe he's a fluke like Valentin Madouas in 2022.

 

[Pozzovivo]

Or maybe he's a fluke like Valentin Madouas in 2022.

You mean Jegat who also came 10th like Madouas? Or Gaudu coming 4th in 2022?

 

[Rou]

You mean Jegat who also came 10th like Madouas? Or Gaudu coming 4th in 2022?

Madouas was the freak performance. Gaudu has other GC results as well.

 

[zlev11]

damn this route stinks

at least we finally get to see Cerler again

 

[Rou]

damn this route stinks

at least we finally get to see Cerler again

They made this joke of a route to lure Pogacar.
But he is too scared to even ride this.
I hope they never make this mistake again and bring back the hard routes from several years ago.

 

[Pozzovivo]

Madouas was the freak performance. Gaudu has other GC results as well.

Yeah, Onley is kinda similar to Gaudu in many ways - just a bit better.

 

[Sciatic]

But it's also less prestigious and much less anticipated, not helped by a real monotony re the routes.

Not for me, I relish it since I know there’s only a few weeks of major races left to the season after that.

 

[zlev11]

They made this joke of a route to lure Pogacar.
But he is too scared to even ride this.
I hope they never make this mistake again and bring back the hard routes from several years ago.

last years route was excellent, hardest grand tour of the season

 

[P4rthen0n]

So Pog is just letting Vingegaard win this? It seemed like he wasn't the guy to give out victories easily.

No, he sent Almeida and Auyso to get the job done.
If they combine their powers then they could... oh, nvm.

 

[Red Rick]

How do we measure prestige?
In terms of history?
In terms of opponents?
In terms of difficulty?
In terms of history Strade Bianche has no prestige. In terms of spectacle it has.
The Giro has prestige in terms of history. But it has become a real mockery the last years with the habit of paying top riders and the pathetic routes.
As example: I value a Pogacar victory in the Giro against Dani Martinez much lower than a potential victory in the Vuelta against Jonas.
Do you get my point?

Yes. It's a good point. But it's also not everything. The races prestige is quite independent of the spectacle or the competition. I really enjoyed the times Rogla beat Pogacar in Emilia for example but that does not make the prestige greater than the robbery he committed in Liege.

That said, Vuelta and Giro are more equal in status naturally so they should be more dynamic in their prestige relative to each other.

 

[Cycling111]

Oney finished fourth in the Tour due to the retirements of Remco and Almeida, and because the Tour has domestiques of Yates' level.

If two riders retire in the Vuelta, he'd be second 😅.

 

[Sciatic]

Oney finished fourth in the Tour due to the retirements of Remco and Almeida, and because the Tour has domestiques of Yates' level.

If two riders retire in the Vuelta, he'd be second 😅.

Perhaps that would have been true because of the TTs, but I don’t think Remco would have hung on as long in the Pogacar-Vingegaard group on the biggest climbs as Onley did. That was seriously impressive.

 

[Unchained]

They made this joke of a route to lure Pogacar.
But he is too scared to even ride this.
I hope they never make this mistake again and bring back the hard routes from several years ago.

I think to describe, Pogacar as being scared to race might be a little much, if he has some structure in mind for the worlds that doesn't include another 3 week test, scientific instead of scared is probably more accurate, he is wearing rainbow and maybe that's more important than anything happening in Spain. In my opinion Vuelta made decisions will also benefit CT and WT teams.. Last year some of the Kern , Caja, BH give some early flare, not much yield at the finish but fans like it..I don't know if Polti is riding but they also have a Spanish rider makeup.. Easy is better for everyone!!

 

[Rob5091]

Pogi's getting bored with all the winning.

 

[ice&fire]

damn this route stinks

at least we finally get to see Cerler again

My biggest fear is seeing Vingegaard putting a show in Cerler leading to Unipublic thinking it's cool to have Cerler again in the route every 3 years.

 

[QueenStagiaire]

My biggest fear is seeing Vingegaard putting a show in Cerler leading to Unipublic thinking it's cool to have Cerler again in the route every 3 years.

What is wrong with Cerler? It looks like a MTF with good gradients.

 

[ice&fire]

What is wrong with Cerler? It looks like a MTF with good gradients.

Bad racing, because:
1) It's not well connected with other climbs
2) It' s made of three climbing sections 3-4km long each one connected with two 1-1.5km long flat/descent sections that typically allowed dropped riders to get back to the front

 

[Red Rick]

It's an ass climb.

Amazingly enough it doesn't even make the top 3 worst final climbs in the Vuelta though.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Doesnt look too bad to me if riders are willing to go hard quite early. The percentages are there. Rather see a climb like this instead of 12 km gradual at 7%.

 

[Red Rick]

Doesnt look too bad to me if riders are willing to go hard quite early. The percentages are there. Rather see a climb like this instead of 12 km gradual at 7%.

It can be good, but it requires a very big commitment from one rider to just take off already. It's obviously better than Tenda, Valdezcarray and Larra Belagua, but that's a pretty low bar.