Wheel Gate "solved" Who do you trust?

[Anonymous]

I thought this was worthy of a fresh thread, so I copied my first post to Who Do You Trust - AC or LA and JB AKA Wheel Gate here. The big thing is that along with a lot of revisionist history, projecting his own actions onto Alberto, etc., Armstrong said that the story about Contador buying his own wheels was untrue, and suggested that anyone could call Trek & confirm. In a later response by the poor maligned writer from Marca, he said he had the story from others and had seen documentation of the purchase. Today Bruyneel had an interview in Marca. Here are excerpts via Google Translate:

- Since last year's Tour has been said and written about your relationship and the 'affair' of the wheels ... What happened exactly?
I, the statements contained in the press were taken with great caution, because many are misunderstood and others come from a mistranslation and was taken out of context. In the case of the wheels, Trek bought from a vendor a certain number of special wheels and one of those was for Alberto. However, someone around the saw that Lance was a different color because they were with the logos of Livestrong and Contador told they were better. So Albert spoke his own Trek and bought another.

There were no favoritism with Armstrong?
That's preposterous. To think that my interest or equipment was not the best material to give Alberto is incomprehensible. Was he talking about sabotage, and at this level is ridiculous to even think about it.

http://www.marca.com/2010/01/23/ciclismo/1264276601.html

There's still the unasked question of who was around looking at wheels and telling Contador that Lance's were better - Lance bragged a few days ago about how he will battle Contador with mental warfare, and that Bruyneel is an expert at that. Who could have seen the Astana equipment before the Tour and convinced Alberto the wheels were different, and what might their motivation have been? And why couldn't Trek have told Alberto that he already had the wheel he was about to pay for himself? If Johan was so involved with Contador during the Tour, how could he not have known until the following January that Alberto was buying his own wheel? Does anyone recall the recent Cycling News article with a title along the lines of "Bruyneel Proves Contador Wrong"? That was quoted everywhere, and along with the Armstrong quotes, led the world to believe that Alberto was a liar, and it made the rest of the nonsense and the "war of words" believable.

But the bottom line is, in that horrible interview that Lance gave, his one "fact" that he tied everything else to was that Alberto never bought his own TT wheels. Bruyneel just said that he did. Who do you trust?

All the opinions can now apparently be settled with facts and documentation about the purchase of Time Trial wheels. The closest thing I've seen to a negative statement by Contador in months was that during the Tour he found out he wasn't getting the team's best wheels, so he had to buy his own.

Bruyneel just answered reader's questions for ElMundo, and the first question he addressed was the TT wheels. He said he had no idea where Alberto got that from, as all the riders, especially the leaders, had the same materials.

Part of Lance's interview is now out on Nieuwsblad, and he also addresses the wheel situation (via Google Translate).

http://www.nieuwsblad.be/sportwereld...leid=G8O2KA8D4

Quote:
“If you just the second time the Tour have won and you are the king of Spain, it is normal that all stories are all right. His career has barely begun. Let us talk again about fifteen years. When I subsequently the Spanish media during the Tour had to face, I fell from one surprise to another. We talked little about the atmosphere in the team, but they apparently do. If you read some Spanish sports daily Marca newspaper as distributed: so many dirty things, unbelievable. Complete bull****, pieces of mucus, fat lies. They said we were behind him during the Tour. Yeah. Recently he declared that he had no time trial wheels like me during the tour. Yeah. (Evil) First, this is not true. Secondly, it is easy to prove. You only have to grab the phone and calling into bicycle manufacturer Trek. I understand that the Spanish media after their heroic stand, but it was so untrue what was printed. Come on, at the end of the day as a journalist, you ****ing do proclaim the truth. ’ "
Alberto hasn't accused anyone of lying, but he's definitely now been accused. It's not coincidence that Bruyneel answered the question first, saying Contador had the story all wrong. I think our lives can be simplified. If Alberto did buy the tires, then Armstrong and Bruyneel are both liars who went out of their way to make someone else look bad, again. If they could do that, then every word they've said for the past six months can be questioned or doubted. If Contador made the story up, without actually attacking anyone while doing it, then he's a liar and we can question other things he's said.

Personally, as a former Armstrong fan who switched back to Contador, I believe things I've seen, and the words of people outside Astana. Like Gutierrez telling the story of how he tried to hand his friend Alberto a water bottle on the climb because he didn't have one, but Armstrong rode up and grabbed it first. I've seen a brilliant Graham Watson photo of that exact instant, so I don't believe the Spanish press made it up. But for other things, I'm willing to let it come down to who bought the wheel.

Here's Johan's version

http://www.elmundo.es/encuentros/inv.../2009/12/3976/

 

[scribe]

Man I am confused. I guess I don't care who did what with wheels. Isn't gonna change the podium now.

 

[usedtobefast]

Man I am confused. I guess I don't care who did what with wheels. Isn't gonna change the podium now.

LOL! dude you don't care about 'wheelgate"? what about the...oh wait here's an ad for a 'snuggy'. gotta go.

 

[BroDeal]

I thought this was worthy of a fresh thread,

You thought wrong.

 

[hfer07]

the only thought that I add to this "already solved mystery" thread is:

Can anybody in this world ever give LA & JB credibility, when the two of them publicly commended/insult/blasphemed "MARCA" for publishing "SUPPOSEDLY" false allegations- and yet one of them by the name of Johann Bruyneel A.K.A. "the Hog" concedes an interview?

 

[scribe]

LOL! dude you don't care about 'wheelgate"? what about the...oh wait here's an ad for a 'snuggy'. gotta go.

LMAO!

Would you try this in a real blanket???

 

[unsheath]

Indeed, who was the person advising Pistolero......? His mechanic perhaps?

 

[Ripper]

I don't trust the lot of them. What's more is, I don't care.

 

[auscyclefan94]

LMAO!

Would you try this in a real blanket???

I don't think I wouldd ever be seen in one of those things.

JB and LA are obviously lying and their stories don't match...

Why are we floggin a dead horse? People always have so many LA, AC or JB threads talking about the same stuff and then I am bagged for talking about evans and continaully making evans threads which i hardly do unless appropriate.

See the hypocrisy?...

 

[badboyberty]

I don't think I wouldd ever be seen in one of those things.

JB and LA are obviously lying and their stories don't match...

Why are we floggin a dead horse? People always have so many LA, AC or JB threads talking about the same stuff and then I am bagged for talking about evans and continaully making evans threads which i hardly do unless appropriate.

See the hypocrisy?...

A new first, someone hi-jacked an Armstrong thread to talk about Cadel Evans. What's next, civilised debate in the Clinic? A discussion on US politics that actually makes sense?

 

[Publicus]

Thanks Swordsman. I appreciate your dogged determination. Keep up the good work.

 

[ruswilks]

Why didn't you just continue using your old thread?

 

[scribe]

Thanks Swordsman. I appreciate your dogged determination. Keep up the good work.

But what about snuggies at the rib shack???

 

[franciep10]

But what about snuggies at the rib shack???

oh now I want ribs and I'm trying to lose 5kg, thanks scribe

 

[Ripper]

A discussion on US politics that actually makes sense?

Now you know that this is actually impossible!

 

[Publicus]

But what about snuggies at the rib shack???

Oooh, a snuggie and ribs! I'm channeling my inner Homer Simpson as I type this....

 

[usedtobefast]

But what about snuggies at the rib shack???

a woman in a snuggy eating barbeque...can it get any better? not where i come from.

 

[krebs303]

a woman in a snuggy eating barbeque...can it get any better? not where i come from.

are those hush puppies in the lower left?
now we are talking.
What part of country serves hush puppies with bbq.

It's not Texas those look like pork and in Texas bbq is beef
Its not pulled pork so it's not the Carolinas
looks like a dry rub
I'm going with Memphis

 

[auscyclefan94]

I don't trust the lot of them. What's more is, I don't care.

So for you the question is "Who do you trust, George W Bush or osama bin laden?"

 

[usedtobefast]

are those hush puppies in the lower left?
now we are talking.
What part of country serves hush puppies with bbq.

It's not Texas those look like pork and in Texas bbq is beef
Its not pulled pork so it's not the Carolinas
looks like a dry rub
I'm going with Memphis

i saw the hush puppies too and cole slaw...
we usually had the hush puppies with fried fish in dallas where i grew up.
but i digress.


http://www.ocregister.com/articles/-230720--.html?pic=9

 

[Anonymous]

The blow by blow details

Hey gang. When Armstrong told Nieuwsblad that Contador and the Spanish press, especially Marca, posted lies, there was a particular Marca writer - the one who votes for Rider Of the Year and things, who felt it was a personal attack on him. Some weeks ago he wrote a blog saying he had multiple sources for the Time Trial wheels story and had seen the invoice. Now that Bruyneel told Marca that Contador did buy the wheels, he has printed the details, which he had known since the Tour but had to keep quiet.

Read this and you'll find the details, timing, weight in grams, and everything else your heart desires.

http://marcawas5.recoletos.es/blogs/Controlador?opcion=9&codPost=5129

Google Translation of part of the story:

It happened the day before the start of the Tour, Astana mechanics when they rode bicycles that they would be used in the time trial in Monaco. At one point, the mechanical counter realized that there were two different rear disc wheels to rest. He thought they were, as might seem logical, Alberto and Lance, but Trek's mechanic said no, they were for Armstrong, but not to worry because they were like the rest and only changed the labeling. Without wanting to discuss, the Spanish mechanic took a scale and weighed the wheels of one and the other, showing his partner the mistake that had since the new weighing about 150 grams lighter than the others. "One for Lance and another to Albert, "he said, to which the other replied:" I have to check with Armstrong. "

Seeing that there was something fishy, the mechanical counter told him not to worry. And, after talking with Albert, he decided that it was not worth getting angry so soon, had not started the Tour, but to commission another game like that he would pay for out of pocket, as it were (on the street with a value of 5,000 euros). A few hours later, just before dinner, came the two wheels that Contador had requested. With time running out gave Pastic, special glue tube, and after dinner put them to dry up during the night. The next morning, the day of the start of the Tour, Contador mechanic handed over the two wheels 'Lightweight', that is the mark of them, the mechanic for Trek to decorate with the labeling of 'Bontrager' and representative of both colors. And so Contador and Lance ran on equal terms. The Spanish, of course, was 22 seconds better than the American in the 15.5 km of travel.

A curious and very knowledgeable they could add that, while the corridors of Astana, Contador included, had at their disposal during the Tour Leightweight wheels 240, Armstrong had prepared for the revolutionary new model 190 with ceramic bearings, approximately 15% lighter and 30% more rigid thanks to the carbon-braided and nonlinear-employed. Only a true 'crazy' the material and the latest technical advances, such as mechanical counter, if not the best in the world will miss his little plot, so it rifan, could tell the difference. But uncovered.

Edit: I don't know what physical location the wheel was ordered from, but if you've got a lot of money, Same Day UPS service exists where they drive to pick up a package and get it straight to the airport. FWIW

And on the Plea For Integrity note, news sites around the globe printed the story of Lance calling Contador, Marca and the Spanish press liars. Anyone that doesn't correct that is a disgrace to ethical journalism.

 

[ravens]

I don't think I wouldd ever be seen in one of those things.

JB and LA are obviously lying and their stories don't match...

Why are we floggin a dead horse? People always have so many LA, AC or JB threads talking about the same stuff and then I am bagged for talking about evans and continaully making evans threads which i hardly do unless appropriate.

See the hypocrisy?...

I hear they are coming out with a Livestrong snuggie.

My son asked for a snuggie for xmas. Wife and I rolled our eyes and then it was very difficult to find a snuggie in kids size and boy color. On xmas, we found out it was like on every other kid's xmas wishlist. What's happened to kids?? I wanted a hunting knife and a BB gun! Guess I'll never be a grandpa....

 

[Ripper]

I saved 150 grams of weight in a recent TT by farting

 

[Publicus]

Hey gang. When Armstrong told Nieuwsblad that Contador and the Spanish press, especially Marca, posted lies, there was a particular Marca writer - the one who votes for Rider Of the Year and things, who felt it was a personal attack on him. Some weeks ago he wrote a blog saying he had multiple sources for the Time Trial wheels story and had seen the invoice. Now that Bruyneel told Marca that Contador did buy the wheels, he has printed the details, which he had known since the Tour but had to keep quiet.

Read this and you'll find the details, timing, weight in grams, and everything else your heart desires.

http://marcawas5.recoletos.es/blogs/Controlador?opcion=9&codPost=5129

Google Translation of part of the story:


Edit: I don't know what physical location the wheel was ordered from, but if you've got a lot of money, Same Day UPS service exists where they drive to pick up a package and get it straight to the airport. FWIW

And on the Plea For Integrity note, news sites around the globe printed the story of Lance calling Contador, Marca and the Spanish press liars. Anyone that doesn't correct that is a disgrace to ethical journalism.

Good stuff. I would be surprised if any of the English-speaking press responded to this, printed a retraction or followed up with Armstrong/Bruyneel/Trek. I wonder, though, if Bruyneel knew anything about this. I could certainly see some collusion between Lance and Trek to do this (though I am somewhat shocked (taken aback) by Trek's involvement), but I Bruyneel was protesting pretty intensely that all of the riders had the same wheels (I wonder what Levi/Kloden are thinking).

Thanks for being so diligent on this issue.

 

[Big GMaC]

I could certainly see some collusion between Lance and Trek to do this (though I am somewhat shocked (taken aback) by Trek's involvement)

Thanks for being so diligent on this issue.

I was just wondering, will any of this be any use the LeMond, setting up background of Trek's favouring of LA over other athletes etc?

How is that progressing anyway - Is there a set court date?

And yes, thanks swordsman, just another piece of information, nay fact, that can be added to the 'Lance is an a-hole' pile.